Mule
Well-Known Member
Is the idea behind being able to move each leg individually that it makes the riders aids more accurate?
Is the idea behind being able to move each leg individually that it makes the riders aids more accurate?
I like the lighter western style riding better and am increasingly beginning to dislike the very firm contact that modern dressage seems to demand.Interestingly my trainer was initially trained by her father,an old cavalary man.She also likes a much lighter style of riding.I'm no expert - I've only done the 1 clinic - but from what I understand he said that this ensures you are both mentally connected to the horse and physically in control of the horse. His legs should feel like your arms and legs. It should feel like the reins are hooked to his front feet to you can simply lift and place each feet.
Accuracy was more a state of mind - there was little teaching of technique - it was all about being very particular about what you wanted and making sure you got it. There are also a million more rewards in this style of riding. Mini breaks of say 5-10 seconds after the horse has been accurate where you drop the rein and sit there quietly to say 'yes well done'. Amber could not cope with that at first -- she had no concept of standing still. But now she enjoys her mini breaks and rests a leg, sighs, licks. whatever. Buck's view is a lot of UK horses don't enjoy these respite periods because they never normally get them and fret that they are supposed to be doing something.
There are a series of exercises that you go through that require you to move each foot back, forward and laterally. Also to control the rib-cage so it flexes in the direction you want, to control the head and neck so he is carrying himself in balance etc. And for all this to happen with no bracing and with immediate responses to feather light cues. In walk to start with then all gaits. Once you can do that you have control of the whole horse both mentally and physically and the horse can then go on and be trained in whatever specific discipline you want. But this 'foundation' is 'put on' all young horses no matter what their eventual job. So Buck has put the same foundation on high goal polo ponies, olympic show-jumpers, and ranch horses.
The thing I have never worked out (hoping to be enlightened...) is how to marry this work with dressage schooling. I have a brilliant dressage instructor and Amber is going really well. Much more connected and engaged. But we get that with a firm/secure rein contact. It feels heavy to me but she assures me that I am not remotely heavy in the hand and Amber needs me to be secure in the contact. Buck's way of riding involves a very long and light rein. At the moment I just ride both ways on different days! Amber seems not to be too confused by that.
The breaks are a very western thing.I went to the Deptfords and they were very into breaks.David says when he is preparing for a competition he might actually sit on his horse for 2 hours but only do about 30 to 40 minutes work,I like the lighter western style riding better and am increasingly beginning to dislike the very firm contact that modern dressage seems to demand.Interestingly my trainer was initially trained by her father,an old cavalary man.She also likes a much lighter style of riding.
The
The breaks are a very western thing.I went to the Deptfords and they were very into breaks.David says when he is preparing for a competition he might actually sit on his horse for 2 hours but only do about 30 to 40 minutes work,
Modern horses are a man made construct really and can carry weight on their backs.Left to themselves they can also find the best and most comfortable way of doing it,They are not stupid.Western riding when it is good, allows the horse a very natural frame.Compare and contrast to modern dressage.Watch David on youtube do a reining pattern.It is a sudden burst of energy,followed by a rest,followed by another sudden burst of energy.The rest is partly psychological.According to David a rest is the best reward you can give a horse, it also allows the muscles to recover.See I am struggling with this. And struggling with the reply further up the thread that said being sat on for three hours shouldn't be a problem for a working horse.
My understanding is horses weren't built to carry riders, and they need to have abdominals engaged and their backs lifted, else we are compressing their spine. I can see hacking or driving for three hours as okay. But sitting stationary on their backs for long periods doesn't typically sound very fair, or to promote horse learning to engage back muscles and carry rider. Especially a young horse.
I like the idea of lots of rewards. I would imagine giving the horse breaks allows it to understand what we are asking if it.I'm no expert - I've only done the 1 clinic - but from what I understand he said that this ensures you are both mentally connected to the horse and physically in control of the horse. His legs should feel like your arms and legs. It should feel like the reins are hooked to his front feet to you can simply lift and place each feet.
Accuracy was more a state of mind - there was little teaching of technique - it was all about being very particular about what you wanted and making sure you got it. There are also a million more rewards in this style of riding. Mini breaks of say 5-10 seconds after the horse has been accurate where you drop the rein and sit there quietly to say 'yes well done'. Amber could not cope with that at first -- she had no concept of standing still. But now she enjoys her mini breaks and rests a leg, sighs, licks. whatever. Buck's view is a lot of UK horses don't enjoy these respite periods because they never normally get them and fret that they are supposed to be doing something.
There are a series of exercises that you go through that require you to move each foot back, forward and laterally. Also to control the rib-cage so it flexes in the direction you want, to control the head and neck so he is carrying himself in balance etc. And for all this to happen with no bracing and with immediate responses to feather light cues. In walk to start with then all gaits. Once you can do that you have control of the whole horse both mentally and physically and the horse can then go on and be trained in whatever specific discipline you want. But this 'foundation' is 'put on' all young horses no matter what their eventual job. So Buck has put the same foundation on high goal polo ponies, olympic show-jumpers, and ranch horses.
The thing I have never worked out (hoping to be enlightened...) is how to marry this work with dressage schooling. I have a brilliant dressage instructor and Amber is going really well. Much more connected and engaged. But we get that with a firm/secure rein contact. It feels heavy to me but she assures me that I am not remotely heavy in the hand and Amber needs me to be secure in the contact. Buck's way of riding involves a very long and light rein. At the moment I just ride both ways on different days! Amber seems not to be too confused by that.
See I am struggling with this. And struggling with the reply further up the thread that said being sat on for three hours shouldn't be a problem for a working horse.
My understanding is horses weren't built to carry riders, and they need to have abdominals engaged and their backs lifted, else we are compressing their spine. I can see hacking or driving for three hours as okay. But sitting stationary on their backs for long periods doesn't typically sound very fair, or to promote horse learning to engage back muscles and carry rider. Especially a young horse.
I used to be in a western riding group and we used to have a lot of fun with this during training sessions. It's stuck with me and is part of my everyday riding - it just makes everything so much easier for rider and horse. When I recently taught my son to ride (on my trained western horse), I soon had him ( a non rider) walking over a pole literally one foot at a time with a break between steps. It was brilliant for teaching him feel and subtle aids and quietness.Is the idea behind being able to move each leg individually that it makes the riders aids more accurate?
No-one took their horse out when I was there. I would not have dared! But then again I'm a bit pathetic. Ask the organisers first and see what they say.
I can't remember what colour horses Buck was riding - there were 2 and I am thinking of the darker one. Bay or brown.
Whilst I get that it's not really my point and I understand I should have maybe made that clearer.
My point is that the work you will need to do and that the trainer, on this occasion Buck, will be looking for is something you can and should practise in advance.
The format of the clinic is the thing you cant really plan for. You've got no idea what's going to happen and how it will be put across. Yes 30 horses is waaaay too much and something that most, if not all, people will struggle with.
Is the idea behind being able to move each leg individually that it makes the riders aids more accurate?
That would be my boy - I had only had him a couple of months and was having a lot of issues, his previous owner referred to him as being 'Tricky'! His feet were not just sticky but stuck, no forward, just back and up! If you put your leg on him, he would stop and bite his chest - if you persisted or got bigger, he would bunny hop, backup and rear!
Not at all.That was brilliant.It was the rest.Are you saying based on watching one DVD of him bridling a horse, you'd never let him touch a horse of yours, because of the way he bridled the horse in the DVD?
This is an interesting thread. I went to watch Buck the first year he came and one poor rider got bucked off in the first five minutes when they were just warming up and the music went on and everyone clapped. Poor woman the organisers and other riders didnt even notice for a second or too! My feeling was it was interesting to watch he makes quite sharp corrections if the horse doesn't respond quick enough and one person left in disgust when he had a horse in hand that couldnt cope with applause and fell over backwards with Buck handiling him.
If I was a participant I would have been disappointed in the lack of interaction with Buck as a lot was him demonstrtating and talking telling stories etc. Probably not a learning environment for horses that couldn't cope with the crowd noise and atmosphere. I prefer Mark Rashids quieter softer approach