Bucking pt 2…

[Elopi]

Hi some of you might remember my last post about loan horse throwing head down and bucking when asked to go forward. A few weeks have passed and he has had everything checked, saddle has had more flocking in however wasn’t causing him any discomfort.
He has started doing the same with his owner. Fine in walk and trot (lazy), however when asked to canter or go forward more with a schooling whip he pulls head down and bucks.
Now he only seems to do it when the whip is used, however he will not go into canter solely off the leg. It’s driving me insane as I’ve came off every single time trying to get into canter, as he snatches the reins from me and proceeds to buck resulting in me catapulting over his head. He has done it on a hack too and galloped off. My confidence is non existent and although my instructor is fab and reassuring I’m dreading my lesson tomorrow because I’m afraid I’ll get thrown off again. Help please ?

 

[Elopi]

I forgot to add, he is perfect on the lunge and transitions onto canter pretty easily without too much encouragement. He also free schools beautifully it just seems that with a rider on board he completely changes.

 

[Not_so_brave_anymore]

I mean, what's your gut feeling here, when you have a horse who appears happy and comfortable with no weight on his back, but behaves completely differently when carrying a rider?

 

[Elopi]

I mean, what's your gut feeling here, when you have a horse who appears happy and comfortable with no weight on his back, but behaves completely differently when carrying a rider?

My instructor and owner both seem to think that it’s just a naughty habit that he has developed and that we can work on preventing it however I’m just nervous to ride him now. I’ve been doing plenty of groundwork which has been going well I just don’t want to give up.

 

[SpeedyPony]

If he'll never go into canter under saddle without a whip, it really does sound like something is wrong, what checks were done? Could you have a vet out and ride him in a lameness work-up so they can see how he goes under saddle? Some things just aren't visible without a rider.
Tbh if he's bucking to the point of unseating the rider it really doesn't sound like a lazy horse protesting to me, I'd be worried there was something pain related going on.

 

[Elopi]

If he'll never go into canter under saddle without a whip, it really does sound like something is wrong, what checks were done? Could you have a vet out and ride him in a lameness work-up so they can see how he goes under saddle? Some things just aren't visible without a rider.
Tbh if he's bucking to the point of unseating the rider it really doesn't sound like a lazy horse protesting to me, I'd be worried there was something pain related going on.

I wasn’t told exactly what was checked, the owner said he has been assessed by a vet and all of his tack has been checked that is all. I can’t really take matters into my own hands as he is just on part loan to me.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Who declared that he wasn't in any discomfort? It seems that they were wrong! If I were the owner I would want a full vet workup

 

[AdorableAlice]

I wasn’t told exactly what was checked, the owner said he has been assessed by a vet and all of his tack has been checked that is all. I can’t really take matters into my own hands as he is just on part loan to me.

Without wishing to upset you, in this situation you are at risk of getting hurt and your already low confidence being shattered completely. It is time to walk away from the loan and have a few lessons at a good school to rebuild your confidence. When you are comfortable and happy you could start to look for another more suitable loan horse.

 

[SpeedyPony]

I wasn’t told exactly what was checked, the owner said he has been assessed by a vet and all of his tack has been checked that is all. I can’t really take matters into my own hands as he is just on part loan to me.

Ah, that is a bit of a problem, but if he's started doing it with the owner as well I would be inclined to say there is an underlying (maybe worsening?) issue.
It might be an idea to start looking for a different part loan, as regularly being bucked off/unseated is going to get tiresome at best and could lead to a loss of confidence. It doesn't sound like the owner is going to get a proper work up done. :/

 

[Not_so_brave_anymore]

My instructor and owner both seem to think that it’s just a naughty habit that he has developed and that we can work on preventing it however I’m just nervous to ride him now. I’ve been doing plenty of groundwork which has been going well I just don’t want to give up.

FWIW with the information you've given here, it sounds like they're wrong and that you're quite right not to want to get back on this horse.

But tbh, it doesn't really matter who's "right" or "wrong" - the beauty of a part loan is that you're free to walk away and find something you enjoy riding more.

 

[Carrottom]

I would not ask this horse to canter when on his back unless I had seen the owner or another rider do so without any issues.

 

[Elopi]

 

[Elopi]

View attachment 73433

This is what the owner said to me. They are honestly lovely people and do care for their horse a lot and it would be a shame to look for another loan as I have never came across owners who are so kind and supportive of my riding. In my area there are not many friendly horsie people as during previous loans I’ve found them to be quite competitive and cold towards me. I have been with a riding school for 2 years previously however I felt like I was never getting anywhere and £40 for a half an hour lesson seems a bit too steep for me.

 

[Melody Grey]

Sounds like only a saddle check then? No fitter can confirm the back wasn’t sore in my opinion- you need a physio, if not a vet to confirm that.....and then to consider what else is going on.

 

[Bellaboo18]

Poor you! This doesn't sound like much fun at all. No wonder you're losing confidence.

I think as others have said I'd look for another loan and stop riding this horse before you get hurt.

A saddle fiiter isn't qualified to say the horses back is fine. I imagine they dont have xray vision
... It sounds like he's telling you something hurts.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

Sorry but lovely owners that care a lot for their horse don’t see said horse buck continuously with a rider on and not investigate it.

The horse needs to see a vet.

 

[LadyGascoyne]

I’d ask the instructor to hop on (with the owners permission). If he’s reluctant to move into canter with them, then you might find you get some support in terms of investigations.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I’m inclined to agree with the walk away suggestions.
Who is Georgie? Is she the owners daughter or have I got that wrong? I wonder if now he’s doing it with her aswell perhaps something more might get done about getting proper checks?

 

[Ownedby4horses]

I’m afraid this pony is screaming pain, a saddle fitter can’t assess if his back is sore. His owners may seem like lovely people but I’m afraid this pony needs further investigations.

if he is fine on the lunge and problems only arise when a rider is onboard then there is something obviously wrong.

Do not ride him again, unless the owners are willing to do further checks, you are putting yourself at huge risk of injury and personally, I wouldn’t be wanting to ride a pony who is so very clearly unhappy.

if the owners won’t get further investigations done, you need to walk away.

 

[Lipglosspukka]

I don't think they sound supportive about your riding at all. I think they just want the pony ridden and aren't concerned about how regularly hitting the deck is going to destroy your confidence.

Walk away before you get hurt.

 

[SpotsandBays]

I agree with the above. Speaking as somebody who struggles with confidence, I’d be inclined to find another loan. Losing confidence is a very easy thing to do, but getting it back is extremely hard!

 

[Parrotperson]

well fwiw you're no longer having fun. You've lost confidence. Its supposed to be fun! Especially if you're paying out money.

This isn't your problem. Its their problem which they aren't addressing frankly.

Plus maybe you need a loan horse that has been there and got the t shirt as this is by the sound of it your first venture into horse "ownership"?

 

[SaddlePsych'D]

This is what the owner said to me. They are honestly lovely people and do care for their horse a lot and it would be a shame to look for another loan as I have never came across owners who are so kind and supportive of my riding. In my area there are not many friendly horsie people as during previous loans I’ve found them to be quite competitive and cold towards me. I have been with a riding school for 2 years previously however I felt like I was never getting anywhere and £40 for a half an hour lesson seems a bit too steep for me.

I can absolutely empathise with this (as someone about to go to a £50 30 min lesson later today - kerching!) but more important than money is 1 - the horse's welfare, and 2 - your confidence (which if you lose it can a lot of time and even more money on lessons trying to put right!)

 

[Elopi]

I’m inclined to agree with the walk away suggestions.
Who is Georgie? Is she the owners daughter or have I got that wrong? I wonder if now he’s doing it with her aswell perhaps something more might get done about getting proper checks?

Yes she is the owners daughter. He has done it with her and also bolted on a hack but all she said is that he’s being naughty.

 

[Elopi]

I’m afraid this pony is screaming pain, a saddle fitter can’t assess if his back is sore. His owners may seem like lovely people but I’m afraid this pony needs further investigations.

if he is fine on the lunge and problems only arise when a rider is onboard then there is something obviously wrong.

Do not ride him again, unless the owners are willing to do further checks, you are putting yourself at huge risk of injury and personally, I wouldn’t be wanting to ride a pony who is so very clearly unhappy.

if the owners won’t get further investigations done, you need to walk away.

Thank you. I’m a little confused because everyone is telling me not to ride due to risk of injury but my instructor is more or less convincing me to ride even though she has witnessed my falls each time.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Thank you. I’m a little confused because everyone is telling me not to ride due to risk of injury but my instructor is more or less convincing me to ride even though she has witnessed my falls each time.

TBh, it sounds as if your RI is an idiot. Do you know what qualifications she has?

The horse is screaming pain, imo. Horses are rarely 'naughty' for the sake of it.

 

[Elopi]

TBh, it sounds as if your RI is an idiot. Do you know what qualifications she has?

The horse is screaming pain, imo. Horses are rarely 'naughty' for the sake of it.

She’s level 3 qualified in stable management and horse care, equine behaviour and psychology. I mentioned to her that it could be pain related and she said it may very well be but I’m limited in what I can do with a horse on part loan.

 

[Bellaboo18]

She’s level 3 qualified in stable management and horse care, equine behaviour and psychology. I mentioned to her that it could be pain related and she said it may very well be but I’m limited in what I can do with a horse on part loan.

Yes you're limited in what you can do *but* you can both speak to the owners on the horses behalf AND stop riding him so you're not contributing to his pain.
Never use an instructor that advices riding a horse in pain. Do you feel sorry for the horse?

 

[Ownedby4horses]

OP, this is going to end up in disaster. Your instructor has now admitted the horse might be in pain but they’re happy for you to keep riding (and paying them!). Do not underestimate how life changing some injuries can be (I’m speak from experience and I’ve been riding a very long time before I had a very bad accident on someone else’s horse). Please stop riding this horse before you get seriously injured. If you are not brave enough to talk to the owner about further investigations then walk away.

 

[Elopi]

Yes you're limited in what you can do *but* you can both speak to the owners on the horses behalf AND stop riding him so you're not contributing to his pain.
Never use an instructor that advices riding a horse in pain. Do you feel sorry for the horse?

Yes I do and knowing that so many people agree with me has made me feel much better. I have a lesson later on and I’m going to explain to my instructor that I don’t feel safe riding him and decide what we can do next. I have mentioned multiple times to the owners that I feel nervous to ride him and they just advice to wait for my instructor.