Building a yard from scratch - Help!

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spaghetti-junction

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Hi,

Has any one got any advice for building a yard from scratch? What to look out for? Good contacts to use? Pitfuls, etc...

Am looking into doing this, but am finding it really differcult to know where to start and what things would need to be done first, etc, etc..

Just feels like i'm going round in circles :confused:

I'm based in the Hertfordshire area and would be really grateful for any advice or experience.

Thank you :)
 
I've done it.

My advice is to engage the services of a very good planning consultant as they will be able to tell you what you are likely to get agreed by the council before you start thinking about what you might want. You might want brick stables but the council will only allow wooden for example. I had back windows put in my stables and its one of the best things I've done as it gives a nice through breeze in the summer and double views for the horses.

My second advice is to set a budget and triple it. Most of the money ime is spent underground ie drainage etc.

Really think about how your yard is going to work. One thing I did wrong was not consider where the muckheap was gonna go in relation to the yard and now we've not been able to tuck it away because that would be too far from the yard practically.

Mains electric and water, if not connected can be very expensive dependant how far away they are at the moment.

Think about the layout of the whole yard, the proximity to the turnout paddocks for example, don't site the yard on the wettest part of the land as the winter will be a nightmare.

There's so much tbh.
 
make sure you have planning permission for everything you do before you do it

if your property already has living accommodation on it then good. If it doesn't don't think that you will get permission to live on greenfield land just because you have horses or a few sheep/chickens because you won't

If you don't have living accommodation already then think about how you will access the place in very bad winter weather.

If it'll be big enough to warrant employing staff then is there accommodation for them in the area

Getting floodlights for a new arena is very difficult so think about siting any arena so you can perhaps use 'security lights' on the buildings to light the arena
 
If you don't already have planning permission, I definitely ditto hiring a planning consultant first. Before you can even start drawing up the layout plans you may have to carry out a flood risk assessment (depend on size of development and location), a drainage statement detailing how you intend to dispose of surface water, even maybe an archeological survey etc etc The planning folks will work with the contents of the reports to determine the appropriate layout.

Planning can be a very costly process depending on the location of the land you're building on and the existing usage.

As stated by LHS, for most developments, the majority of the money is in the ground - utility connections, foundations, drainage

Good luck though :)
 
Another thing i would possibly think about is which direction the prevailing winds are.
Everywhere has a predominant wind direction, and by putting up a small windsock for a time being or get information from the met office or a weathervain (sp) its quite easy to get the information.

You wouldnt want to build your stable block and then find that the wind is constantly blowinng in through the door, when i could have been prevented buy having the stables the other way around.
Also if you have storage barns which are open at one/both ends, by having them facing a direction away from the prevailing winds, if its pouring with rain it will hopefully help to keep the barns a bit dryer.
 
I know this is way in the future but ensure doors in the corners open away from the adjacent wall. Worked on a yard where the doors opend next to the wall and you had to open the doors all the way to get in. hope that makes sense.

Another really nice thing was if you have a C shaped yard see i its possible to have a none poisonous hedge/trees on the open side (as well as fence obviously) the yard had this and not only completely hide the yard from the road but also gave us protection from the elements. Wind, rain and sun in the evenings.
 
LHS has a very good point re the back window in the stable. My stable at home has a back window in and my horse loved it. He could look out through the front door as well as the back window. It provided a bit of extra ventilation in summer. Also if you decided to disenfect the stable and wash it out, with the window open it dried a lot quicker.
It also provided extra natural light. I really like them if you have individual stables.
 
Recommend allowing half the money for the actual buildings and planning, and the other half for all the groundworks, services etc. It might be a bit less but it could well be half.

One critical thing is finding a level site. If its not level it soon becomes a major civil engineering project (we didnt have anywhere level so had to go with it!)

Recommend very much rear windows in the stables. Also if you go for mini barn or barn, a sliding door not opening ones, the latter are dangerous in a gale!

Re the rear windows, we have ones which are normal opening top halfs of stable doors (bottom half is solid) but in the middle of the frame they also have a window. This means in bad weather (we get some hairy stuff up here in the hills) you can shut that window but horsie can still see out.

Think about fire too, we have installed a fire hose direct from our (private) water supply on a big diameter pipe.

Generally planning these days will speciify for private use only unless you specifically apply otherwise, and you will get dobbed in if you say private and then use for commercial in most places.

heres ours.....
WesterBraeheadAutumn2008182.jpg
 
Ah wow!

Thank you everyone for all your advice. :)

Just had no idea quite how big this project was until I started looking into it!

It's great to hear other people have been through the same thing and it's been a success. :p

Will definately look into a planning consultant as I do want everything to be above board. How do they usually work their fees?

It is all the groundwork that I've been struggling to get my head around - there's just so much to consider!

Would love to have a barn built if possible, so it was really great to see the picture posted on here, thank you:)

And yes, think back windows are a fabulous idea, will want to get these included if poss. And will remember about corner boxes and doors hinged on correct side too :)

The cost does seem to be immense just for all the groundwork, really hope I can find a way to make things work.

Thanks again for all your advice, will let you know how it goes :D
 
Ah wow!

Thank you everyone for all your advice. :)

Just had no idea quite how big this project was until I started looking into it!

It's great to hear other people have been through the same thing and it's been a success. :p

Will definately look into a planning consultant as I do want everything to be above board. How do they usually work their fees?

It is all the groundwork that I've been struggling to get my head around - there's just so much to consider!

Would love to have a barn built if possible, so it was really great to see the picture posted on here, thank you:)

And yes, think back windows are a fabulous idea, will want to get these included if poss. And will remember about corner boxes and doors hinged on correct side too :)

The cost does seem to be immense just for all the groundwork, really hope I can find a way to make things work.

Thanks again for all your advice, will let you know how it goes :D
 
We have just had an Elite barn constucted by JWS who i can very highly recommend :) They advertise every week in H&H if you need their info.

The planners were hard work and it took 7 months to get permission- thats with parish council approval :(

February 2010- here is the groundwork- nearly completed before snow stopped play
SarahsCamera006.jpg


hardcore in and ready for the concrete lorry
SarahsCamera023.jpg


Concrete laid
SarahsCamera051.jpg


9am 23 March
SarahsCamera104.jpg


11.30 am ish
Barn-23march10.jpg


6.30 pm (raining so not great picture)
SarahsCamera110.jpg


Internal frame going in the next day
SarahsCamera108.jpg


Third Day:
Barninterior.jpg


April- the planting of trees is complete and the barn is settling into the landscape beautifully :)
BarnExterior.jpg
 
My farrier is keen for yard designers to consider having an area under cover with a hard flat floor for shoeing/trimming purposes, so that the farrier can really see how a horse is standing and get the balance correct etc. He reckons an empty stable is too small and would rather that the area had at least one open side to avoid him getting squashed against a wall. He may be fussy, but he is a damn good farrier, and he does have a point about some of the conditions in which farriers are expected to shoe . . .
 
Ah wow! Your barn looks great too! :D

Will definately look into their info, thank you :)

Can't believe it took 7 months for planning though, i'm really hoping things will be ok in this department. I'm pretty sure the land was previously given planning for an indoor school, and although this was a while ago, am hoping this might work in my favour when it comes to it. Would be fabulous if they agreed ok, as really want to get something up asap :)

How many boxes did you have built? From what I can see on the pic, looks like about 5?
 
Ah Garnet! So true, so true! ;)

Completly agree with you and your farrier!

Am trying to build a barn that has space at one end to use as a tie up area, so that all things, farrier's, vets, grooming, tacking up, etc can be done outside the box but still undercover and on a level floor. :)

Think this makes so much sense. Just finding it really hard to come up with a design that works money wise as well as space wise.

Wanted to have stables oppsite eachother and go wider in the barn size to allow tie up room outside each stable and enough between for wheel barrows to pass but this causes the whole structure to be huge because the angle of the roof all changes, therefore costs sky rocket.

Then was going to have all stables in a row and go longer and still have enough room for tie up and barrows, but this still came out at way too exspensive.

So now have decided the only viable option is to have stables opposite eachother and then leave space at one end to use as a tie up area and have extra doors put in the side wall to allow for more light, ventilation and access :)

Just need to get quotes back on all the groundworks now, as if these come back way too high, then may need to go back to the drawing board again :eek:
 
Garnet said:
My farrier is keen for yard designers to consider having an area under cover with a hard flat floor for shoeing/trimming purposes, so that the farrier can really see how a horse is standing and get the balance correct etc. He reckons an empty stable is too small and would rather that the area had at least one open side to avoid him getting squashed against a wall. He may be fussy, but he is a damn good farrier, and he does have a point about some of the conditions in which farriers are expected to shoe . . .
Click to expand...


I would totally agree about this. We are able to use the field shelter (its part of a barn and has a concrete floor) if its wet/snowy when the farrier comes, and he says its so nice to stand somewhere dry for a couple of hours and have enough light to do the job.

I think that natural light is as important as electric light in stables - so yes get great lights for all the dark hours we spend in our stables, but make sure there's plenty of light in there for the rest of the year when you don't want to put lights on!

make sure your stables and yard drain well!

think carefully about where your muck heap goes and how easy it will be to get it removed

think about access for vehicles so that you don't end up carrying feed/hay etc miles in the winter cos you can't get your car closer.
 
Barninterior.jpg


This was a standard 6 stable barn with three 12x12 down each side. As OH has a much loved broken clydie that is too feeble to survive in the wild :rolleyes: we needed bigger! JWS suggested this horseshoe shape. It gives two 12x12 on the left then two 18x12 across the middle and another 12x12 on the right that leaves another 12x12 which is our feedroom(we dont keep tack at yard)

You can back the farrier van upto the door with its back door up. He told us what he wanted from a shoeing area so he has the central part which is 24x12 with lights up the side rather than over head. He shod for the first time in there a fortnight ago and loves it. My vet likes it so much he is threataning to move his clinic in :p( not such a silly idea as he seems to be visiting twice a week anyway :eek:)

Muck heaps are something the council were funny about but we have a 2 acre market garden so we use the muck on that which also means no hassle with disposal :)

The only minus is the council MADE us have the felt roof and wouldnt allow sky lights :mad:

We thought it would be simple as there had previously been a barn with PP there so 90% of our ground preparation had been done but it was still a battle..
 
OH has covered most of it :) we did go for horse pee resistant concrete as our last yard had areas of erosion that collected pee and was difficult to manage. I wont have the hay stored too close after seeing a friend lose her horse in a fire earlier this year :(
 
Quote: Will definately look into a planning consultant as I do want everything to be above board. How do they usually work their fees?

They charge by the hour (including how many times they phone you up! a bit like a lawyer!), its expensive but worth it, also try to work out your yard layout beforehand, we have just designed ours (its private) and its amazing how many times things change before you have the finished article. My husband couldn't believe how many redrawn drawings kept arriving in the post, he was like 'oh god not another change how much is he gonna charge for all these?', I just said that it was better to have it 100% now than moan about it for years to come if I hadn't amended it! lol :o)
 
Thank you everyone for all your advice, it's so interesting to hear everyones comments :)

Sorry though to LmuirEDT :o

Hmm.. horse pee resistant concrete sounds interesting, not heard of it before though, is it more exspensive? Will look into it and try get more info, thank you ;)

Ah, wow, you got two x 12 x 18 boxes that's great! And I love the way they go round in the horseshoe shape. That really works :)
Can't believe they wouldn't let you have the sky lights though, how annoying :mad:

Really hoping to get as much natural light in as poss. plus have good electrics to cope with those dark, winter days and yes am trying to be extra careful with drainage. Trying to work out the best way to cope with the water coming of the yard, may end up with a gulley going all the way round base so it can then end up draining into a soak away. Although don't want drains to get blocked, so maybe the ones with buckets that you empty daily?

Struggling a bit on what size to have the muck heap though, any ideas? :confused:
Am going to have this area concreted if poss, but not sure how much space to leave, looking at about 8 boxes? Would like the muck taken away as little as poss, to save costs (unless I can work out someone that would pick up and empty a trailer once a week :)) but obviously don't to go crazy on it as costs to build and lack of space.. :(
 
spaghetti-junction said:
Thank you everyone for all your advice, it's so interesting to hear everyones comments :)

Struggling a bit on what size to have the muck heap though, any ideas? :confused:
Am going to have this area concreted if poss, but not sure how much space to leave, looking at about 8 boxes? Would like the muck taken away as little as poss, to save costs (unless I can work out someone that would pick up and empty a trailer once a week :)) but obviously don't to go crazy on it as costs to build and lack of space.. :(
Click to expand...

if it's any help our muck heap (for 4 stables) is about 5m by 3m sloping away from the yard level, it's nearly 2m high/deep at the far end.

alternatively, and it depends on how green you're able to be - consider turning your muck heap into a wormery. The worms (only nice earthworms, nothing bad for your horse) reduce the volume of your muckheap by 80%!! and your normal horse wormer doesn't harm them. The only thing then is being careful about which bedding you use, as anything thats been chemically treated may harm the worms (straw, untreated shavings, paper and cardboard are usually fine). The finished product is good quality compost which can even be certified organic even though you've used non-organic 'ingredients'. One we get our muckheap emptied this is what I'm doing to ours for next year!
 
Also, thank you for the info on planning consultants :)

Did think they might work their costs a bit this way ;)
And so hear your hubby's point of view, the amount of drawings I've already done and not even got to the planning permission stage yet :eek:

Was thinking about the concrete in stables and I know your always told to have it sloping for drainage but having worked on so many yards, I'm not too sure this really always works well, how do you get it right? :confused:

Don't obviously want it draining to the front of the stable cause it's horrid for horses and us, but surely this would be the only way out - under the door? And if it drains anywhere else its just moving across the bedding and making more mess..?

I will have rubber mats and thick beds anyway so does it really matter if I just have it flat? That way the liquid stays in one place making it easier to muck out and saving on bedding costs..? :rolleyes:
 
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