Buttercups - how to get rid and buttercup rash. Please help.

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bekstheartist

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www.rebecca-kitchin.co.uk
Hello,

I apologise, I do not post very often... but Please help.

In the past 48 hours Taran (Welsh Cob) has developed a terrible rash. NEVER seen anything like it. As it's Bank Holiday I have been working every hour (work p/t, although it doesn't feel like p/t... in the tourist industry) so horses have had their dinners, hooves picked and a quick check but chucked out in the paddock 24/7.

*A bit of back ground*
Moved into new house at end of March, moved horses then too to new house with 7 acres, where horses have been kept on land for past 20 years or so. We kept them at a livery yard before where there was no buttercups (we had sheep) We didn't realise that A) The paddocks had buttercups and B) buttercups were poisonous to horses (stupid I know, but never had problem with buttercups before...).

Now Taran and Jakes aren't eating them, they eat around them. Jakes isn't affected as he has no white bits but Taran is.

Started 48 hours ago when I noticed he had a 'mottled' effect on his muzzle and cheeks, now hair has fallen out on his cheeks and is slightly swollen and blistering. His nose looks like sunburn (can't be, up in the clouds for past couple of days) I have hibbi-scrubbed the areas and applied sudocream, which he isn't bothered about.

Last night I noticed a rash in between his back legs and on his chest.

Taran is fine in himself, eating, drinking, playing with Jakes.

Please advise me on how to get rid of buttercups? We don't have a huge covering just a few to be honest compared to other paddocks I have seen. I understand sheep eat them down - would this be the most organic way to keep them in check? I don't want to damage my land with spraying, although will if needs be...

Sorry am new to land owning and any help would be much appriciated.

Thank you xx
 
I'm afraid I don't have any advice but don't worry about not realising buttercups were poisonous... my family have kept horses for over 20 years and never new about it until this year! We seem to have loads this year but have had no problems with them so far, the horses appear to just eat around them. I'm a bit concerned about it though, having heard the problems people have with them.

I hope that you can get it sorted out. :)
 
We spray to be honest, it seems the easiest way. One field we had done last year now has virtually none, so it does work.
I suppose a quick fix would be to mow the area (ask a local contractor) and clear a small patch for grazing by hand, but as you aren't certain it's the buttercups it may be damned hard work.
I'd stick some sheep on for now and then spray at the appropriate time (I seem to think it's autumn), aloe vera gel will help any rash and stick kids' sublock over his nose, it might keep the effects off him as it may be the combination of the buttercups and sun combined.
 
It does sound like St John's Wort - big hairy 'fingered' leaves. In the short term, it might be worth giving the affectedhorse Piriton, if he's uncomfortable. SJW tends to grow in damp areas, near rivers etc. Does this sound possible? One of ours used to be affected but the other three had no problems. We just used to cut the plants down. Or ask YO to put them in a different field.
 
Hello, Thank you so much for your replies.

The fields are our own, sorry if I didn't make it clear. Had them on livery before moving in March 2010.

Spoke to one of our new neighbours today (well my Husband did) - who was irronically spraying his field. He said to spray field twice a year with Pasture? or something? Will check, Hubby couldn't remember exact name.

He said he has never known horses to suffer with buttercups, anyway thats beyond the point, her thinks it's the flys and midges to behonest... They are vicious here - we are situated between mountains and sea, wet low-lands, TONS of the buggers about.

Taran has now got little lumps, like the rash inbetween his back legs. I have coopered fly repellented his this morning, just incase it is midges... also covered his nose and scabby areas with sudocream after a good wash and dry from Hibbi-scrub.

I am off now with some pictures of St. John's wort and see if I can identify it in our paddocks. Neighbour said he never had problems with land when he kept his horses on there (welsh cobs, same as Taran) for the past 6 years.

If no improvement or he goes down hill (is his usual self apart from being Mr. Scabby) vet will be called.

Thank you again - does anyone else have any ideas? Much appriciated xx
 
When I first bought my mare she ended up with terrible blisters and sores on her white bits, flies attacked and it was horrible, vet said it was mud fever so treated for that but it got worse, so called vet no2 out and he said it is sunburn. At the time I did not know that it could have been buttercups but the field was full of them. For the rest of the summer, her legs were bandaged and she wore a fly rug and cream on the nose. Later years after much reading I now know it was the buttercups because they really did flourish that year. My guys are strip grazed and yes I hand pick the flowers however I am not sure if the remaining stems although short cause the problem or the stalks and flowers. They cause photosensivity so best keep the white bits covered.

I also think though that stress of the move and new grazing didnt help, its been 5 yrs and have not had any problems since.

Good luck.:)
 
have you any hogweed?the sap can cause problems.
google `giant hogweed` it looks similar to cow-parsley at 1st glance.
 
We have a gelding and a mare on our yard (both chestnuts with white blazes, pink noses) that suffer every summer now, due to the buttercups and developed photosenstivity afterwards it's thought - started about 2-3 years ago. They lose hair off their lower face/nose and the owners have both got some good fly masks - think they are Cashel ones which are quite tough and cut out a lot of light.
 
bekstheartist said:
Hello, Thank you so much for your replies.

The fields are our own, sorry if I didn't make it clear. Had them on livery before moving in March 2010.

Spoke to one of our new neighbours today (well my Husband did) - who was irronically spraying his field. He said to spray field twice a year with Pasture? or something? Will check, Hubby couldn't remember exact name.

He said he has never known horses to suffer with buttercups, anyway thats beyond the point, her thinks it's the flys and midges to behonest... They are vicious here - we are situated between mountains and sea, wet low-lands, TONS of the buggers about.

Taran has now got little lumps, like the rash inbetween his back legs. I have coopered fly repellented his this morning, just incase it is midges... also covered his nose and scabby areas with sudocream after a good wash and dry from Hibbi-scrub.

I am off now with some pictures of St. John's wort and see if I can identify it in our paddocks. Neighbour said he never had problems with land when he kept his horses on there (welsh cobs, same as Taran) for the past 6 years.

If no improvement or he goes down hill (is his usual self apart from being Mr. Scabby) vet will be called.

Thank you again - does anyone else have any ideas? Much appriciated xx
Click to expand...

Hi

Reading your post with interest, I am on a livery yard at the minute and moving on to my own land very soon. The livery yard owner has had all the fields sprayed (on a rotational basis so we have some to graze) the largest field, our summer grazing was even done twice but the butter cups still remain. I am not sure what he had it sprayed with, but having spoken to my landlord who is a farmer, he suggested he has it sprayed with either Pastor (the one your neighbour mentioned) or Grazon 90. Both of these should get rid of the buttercups, Pastor is half the price of Grazon 90 and should suffice for buttercups/docks etc.

Hope this helps :-)
 
Buttercups show that the PH in the land is wrong IIRC it is to high (acidic) so the land needs to be limed, but you are best off getting a soil sample so not to waste money on the wrong chemical(s) for your land. Getting rid of the weeds is not treating the problem, you need to get your grazing land right, so they dont keep on growing.
 
I might show this to my shares owner. I have only had him since september, but apparently him and especially the old mare get terrible sunburn no matter how many times suncream is applied, every year. I have noticed some small scabs on their white noses and thought it was the buttercups, which are everywhere! But i know his owner is just going to say 'it's sunburn' even though they have suncream on twice a day. I think it depends on the type of buttercups... ours aren't the ground ones (ours are tall) so if they were cut but not sprayed then they would no longer be harmful. Maybe if they are the ones which creep along the ground then spraying is the best option.
 
I thought my chesnut pony with a pink nose was getting buttercup rash every year. I just tried to soothe it with Sudocreme. However this year he has the rash badly again, but there are no buttercups in his field. It was so bad that he was rubbing his nose raw on his legs. I use a holistic vet with my horses, Tim Couzens from Sussex. The first visit wasn't cheap because of the distance, but once he has your horse on his books he can normally work out remedies to send over the phone. I emailed him a photo, he said he thought it was an allergy and sent some little white pills. One week later, all signs of the rash are nearly gone. Brilliant. Next year I will ask for pills to give from around May onwards to prevent it, as it seems to always happen at the same time of year. Might be worth contacting a holistic vet in your area.
 
Thank you all for your ideas and suggestions. It is much appriciated.

These are the photos from this afternoon and my report:

We think it is midges, they are everywhere. I mean it's thick with them. The burning on his nose could be buttercups but we don't have as many as others and our paddocks are pretty nice.

Jakes is not affected, which is odd as he has mild sweet itch but since he has been fed 'D-Itch' they haven't affected him at all... he is looking very good, whereas Taran is looking awful. Now feeding Taran 'D-Itch' also.

Now we moved Jake and Taran about 13 miles to our farm we bought in March 2010. The farm is inbetween the mountains and the sea, it is lower than the mountains grazing livery yard that we were at. Taran came from a farm, where he had lived for 10+ years about 30 miles away in a midge infested area, so you would of thought he had got an ammunity??

Taran is very well in himself. Eating fine. Lying down (which he often does anyway), passing urine and pooing fine. I haven't suddenly changed his diet either.

This has happened in 48 hours...

On 27th May, Taran looked like this:

Taranschooling129.jpg


On 31st May, he looks like this: :scared::scared::scared:
(excuse the white cream this is sudacream which was applied in the morning)

PartyandTaransscabs009.jpg


PartyandTaransscabs010.jpg


PartyandTaransscabs011.jpg


PartyandTaransscabs012.jpg


You can see some midges here:
PartyandTaransscabs014.jpg


PartyandTaransscabs016.jpg


PartyandTaransscabs017.jpg


Underside of his belly:
PartyandTaransscabs018.jpg


PartyandTaransscabs019.jpg


You can see the rash here on his bum:
PartyandTaransscabs022.jpg


What looks like mud fever:
PartyandTaransscabs021.jpg


PartyandTaransscabs023.jpg


PartyandTaransscabs024.jpg


Taran looks awful.
PartyandTaransscabs027.jpg


PartyandTaransscabs029.jpg



I have hibi-scrubbed the wounds, put sudacream on and tonight put Cooper's fly repellent on both Taran and Jakes.
 
Could be an allergy? If he is getting worse and not improving I would get a vets opinion to be honest, it could be a reaction to something he has not encountered before with you moving. It looks a bit too drastic to be just buttercup rash.
 
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Thanks. Thats what I thought. We think the midges here are vicious... vet is being called first thing in the morning. My R.I is popping up too to check him out. He is happily grazing outside my window but I am so worried about him (my horse of a lifetime, an absolute saint)

Ta again xx
 
I think I would get the specialist shampoo from your vet for any fungal infections, it looks like a fungus to me rather than midge bites. Sorry I can't remember the name of it offhand.
The marks round his white bits are likely to be photo sensitivity, and you need kids total sunblock factor 50 on him, yes, the buttercups have probably caused the reaction.
His hair will grow back quickly once you find the correct treatment, our horses here still have some buttercup filled fields and they won't really harm him.
It may help to include aloe vera juice in his feed, it is excellent for inflammation from stings/rashes etc, and yes, a vet who does homeopathy may well help.
Looking at some of our horses many have marks like yours this time of year, I poured fly stuff on two earlier today as the midges looked as if they had been attacking them.
Why not get him a decent fly rug and leave that on to see if it helps?
 
'Frequently found in horse grazed pasture. Buttercups are potentially poisonous because they contain a compound called protoanemonin, which is a powerful irritant, causing inflammation or ulceration of the mouth, often with sorenes, increased salivation and sometimes colic. However this usually causes the horse to stop eating which makes this condition self-limiting, although it is always advisable to contact your vet if you are concerned.'
Found this on the web which would maybe explain why one ponio stopped.
Agree with using Pastor as you don't really want the problem occurring year after year. Some of the fields round here are rife with buttercups but the ones that are well managed have no signs so it is a solvable problem, at least.
 
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Poor boy. Not as bad as mine was, he was pitiful. Have you read my reply? Maybe it will help. That doesn't look like what I've understood to be buttercup rash in the past, I think it would be worth getting a vet's opinion. However, once you've done that, I'd still ask if you could get a referal to a holistic vet, they work in tandem with your regular vet, it's not "alternative" therapies.
Also on the sweetitch helpgroup post there are some ideas that might help you to repel midges.
 
Thank you.

I have lots of ideas of what it could be. I am phoning the vet to see if they can come out today and see him. Not any worse this morning, it is raining now. My other 'sensitive' horse is totally not affected, infact he is looking bloody brilliant apart from holding onto the last shred of winter coat (maybe a protection??!)

Tinypony - thanks for your ideas, I will certainly ask my vet if there is a holistic vet around here, or covers the wilds of Snowdonia... I certainly do like the idea of herbs etc treating whatever it is.

It does look like a funal infection / sweet itch / buttercup rash - maybe it is all three is this possible?! I feel like such a bad owner - first saw start of rash on Saturday (29th May) evening about 8.30pm (fine in the morning when checked them at 8am just before work). I work in tourist industry and hours can be long on bank holidays etc. Went out bought him and my other cob in for their tea. Noticed slight hair loss on Taran's right cheek. Washed and put some sudacream on. Deet fly sprayed both as usual. Checked them again at 8am before work on Sunday (30th May) Quite a bit worse so I applied more cream. More fly spray. Sunday evening bought in at 6.30pm - not much worse - washed with hibiscrub, sudocreamed and fly sprayed. Monday (31st May) - what he looks like in photos - much,much worse. Seems to take hold over night (when midges are out in evening and morning perhaps?)

Thank you all for your thoughts and ideas. I will certainly be going through them all and slowly trying them by process of elimation if vet has no idea xxx
 
There was a new weed killer which came out a couple of years ago called BANISH its especially for buttercups, very similar to grazon but obviously for buttercups :-)

A friends chestnut mare had this happen to her a few years ago, her whloe muzzle was coverd in huge scabs was very sore she wouldnt let anyone get near her, i think he put sudecrem on it cant really remember, maybe camrosa would help as long as there was no infection.

Best of luck :-)
 
Hi there,

I wonder if it could be midges, I had a TB ex-racehorse come up in a rash all over once from midges rather suddenly. I use Jungle Formula sprays and roll on (human not horse mosquito and midge repellant, available from supermarkets, chemists etc).

Hope you get him sorted.
 
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