Buying a horse in the US

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DoesDressage

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The possibility of relocating to washington dc is being more of a reality and am having to consider what to do with the horses. My mare has had to be retired and on the advice of my vet, family and some people on here I think she will stay behind. Has anyone ever bought a sports horse is the US? I'm pretty unaware what the availability of horses is like particularly dressage horses. Ideally I would be looking for something with the ability to go psg max. Either something with experience if I could afford it or a young horse. Are warmbloods etc around and does anyone have any idea what the market is like compared to here? Would be buying from Maryland/Virginia area.

Thanks, can't believe how clueless I am
 
From reading US websites and forums - horses are £££ which is why they buy a lot in Europe because will still often work out cheaper even once they have been flown back to the USA.
Tarr Steps will know far more than me but I believe its a very different culture to what we have here in the UK.
 
My dad has a friend who produces dressage horses in upstate NY. She buys a lot from Europe and then ships them over. I've emailed a link to this thread to dad as he posts on here a bit so may be able to fill you in a bit more
 
Thank you so much really appreciate it. Any yard suggestions in that area would also be appreciated. Am going for 5 days next week to have a house/yard hunt with the family so fingers crossed.
 
I did some riding for a breeding yard when I lived in the states for couple of year. Couple I rode for used to import from ireland and sell on for about 5 times the cost of the horse plus importing. From what I saw when I was there, riding is considered a sport for those who are very financially well off. Also livery prices are a lot higher. Obviously this may vary from state to state. You may get better value and more horse for your money buying a horse in the uk and shipping over.
 
You'll definitely have sticker shock on the price of horses over here (and board too ... that can be $$). It took me around 6 months of seriously looking to find my little swedish warmblood mare for what I wanted to pay because I refused to pay the big dollars for a horse but didn't want a complete baby and I didn't want to import (that was also more than I wanted to pay for the most part). She came from a dressage barn outside Baltimore, MD, actually so if you want their details, I'd be happy to pass them on because I liked them a lot and am still in touch with them. I mostly looked on dreamhorse.com and warmbloods-for-sale.com. Since I got her I've also joined the FB page Warmblood and Sporthorse Sales (window shopping!). I wasn't particularly looking for a warmblood though, just a horse who had the breeding to do decently in dressage (don't have a particular level in mind, just as much as we are capable of) and low level event which I think she has (she's well-bred for what I paid because she's small and ginger and green at 6). I think where you look changes the price tag too. I was looking both around Boston, MA, and here in S.E. PA, both more expensive places to buy and keep a horse over here. I think if you look in Florida or the midwest it gets cheaper.

I'm happy to help if you have any questions though, horsey or not :), so feel free to pm me.
 
Thank you so much Galupy. I will give those sights a try. If the move is 100% definite I will get back to you about that contact it would be very helpful. I did consider buying something here and flying it over but worked out that would cost be about £10-12k if I bought a £4-5k horse. I was hoping I would find buying in the US would be easier.

Also does anyone know of DIY really exists over there? Everywhere I look is just full board which would be fine but I'm so used to doing them myself maybe somewhere inbewtween would be nice.

Thanks again for all your help
 
DoesDressage said:
Thank you so much Galupy. I will give those sights a try. If the move is 100% definite I will get back to you about that contact it would be very helpful. I did consider buying something here and flying it over but worked out that would cost be about £10-12k if I bought a £4-5k horse. I was hoping I would find buying in the US would be easier.

Also does anyone know of DIY really exists over there? Everywhere I look is just full board which would be fine but I'm so used to doing them myself maybe somewhere inbewtween would be nice.

Thanks again for all your help
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Yes it exists but it isn't called DIY, it's called "self care board" instead. You can also get part board, field board, etc. (which is just that ... full time turnout with no assigned stall - much cheaper but probably still more than you're used to paying). You could also do a co-op kind of arrangement but I worry a little about those because you have to rely on other boarders and not everyone's idea of care is the same as mine. A lot of the bigger barns with the better facilities like indoor schools, etc. don't offer self-care because they want all the horses on the same schedule and because most horse owners over here do full board so it is more difficult to find. Be careful with turnout over here too. It can be very limited and some don't turn out at all. It's definitely the first question I asked when finding somewhere for my mare.
 
My ears (eyes?) are burning!

Okay, I'm from a completely different country ;) but yes, probably a bit more up to speed with things North American than many on here.

As to price, yes, I'm sorry but you will find buying and keeping horses generally more expensive than here. SOME things are cheaper but you will find your options more limited and far fewer "cheap" options for most things than in the UK for many reasons, most having to do with things like logistics and weather.

You might be able to find a self-board situation - always worth a look - but likely not within commuting distance of a major urban area and it's certainly unlikely to be a few miles down the road, as is often the case her. The distances alone make DIY tricky, before you even factor in things like snow. And yes, places with good facilities will generally only take boarders. That said, if you are living there, it will make sense within the circumstances and I'd be surprised if you luck into a situation where you could do DIY.

Prices of horses, showing etc are also generally higher, especially around urban centres. The reason so many trainers buy in Europe is it is just so much cheaper to produce young horses here. But there is always a range and, like here, the lower end of the market isn't particularly buoyant right now. Have a look at some ads and call around some sales barns while you are there to get an idea of what you might pay for what you want.

Because owning is relatively more expensive though, you will find more opportunities to ride without the commitment of owning. Leasing is very common and many professional barns have horses for full and half lease available. You are most likely to find this in Hunter/Jumper barns but it's becoming much more common for dressage and eventing, too. You should also find it's easier to find school type lessons at a higher level than in the UK, which is a good "taster".

I would suggest, rather than rushing out and buying a horse, perhaps try to link up with a barn near wherever you end up living and get a feel for the industry there. Perhaps try a couple. Hopefully you will find a bit more of a "client culture" and even if the professional barns you contact can't help you immediately they should be able to offer suggestions of other places to try. Spotted Cat on here spent some time in the US and found it, I think, a good opportunity to work on riding with no strings attached, rather than commit to owing. I presume you won't be allowed to work (sorry if I have that ŵrong) so what the heck, have some fun. :)

I would also suggest picking up a copy of whatever local magazine is available, having a look at some websites, joining a forum etc. to get the lay of the land. If you want a more general look try magazines like Chronicle of the Horse, Practical Horseman, and Dressage.

I'm happy to answer any general questions you have, although DC is waaaay out of my area. It is quite horsey though, I understand.
 
You could hardly be in a better US area than DC. I don't know if you will be in school there or have to live within the city, but many, if not most, federal workers live in the very extensive Maryland and Virginia suburbs. I've even known people who commute from Delaware. These are all packed with horses and horse activities.

The one group of horses which is pretty uniformly cheaper is the OTTB. There are a rather large number of OTTB retraining and adoption groups around DC. So depending on your level of competition, you won't necessarily be looking at $25k or up for a Warmblood, and that is about minimum price for a WB, domestic or imported in that area.

As to board, etc., the commutes around DC are awful, and remember that it doesn't have the extensive commuter rail system that you are used to. So, unless you're doomed to living in the city, consider living out, at the end of the commuter rail, and beyond. You will be able to find far more varied care situations than if you live closer in. If you do have to live in town, you will only be able to do boarding and that probably means a version of full board just because of the commuting time.

I rather like the idea of taking some time off from horse ownership to suss out the lay of the land in your actual situation. You will be able to find huge numbers of barns with lesson programs and school horses within an hour or so of DC. Move around, try different ones, even consider taking lessons in southeast Pennsylvania and Southern NJ. From the US point of view, all these places are close enough together to be doable. I suppose from the UK point of view, the drives would be considered excessive.
 
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OTTB = ex-racer. :D

That's one thing you'll find - you'll spend quite a bit of time initially feeling like a character in one of those sci-fi movies where they wake up in a world that looks *almost* right but is just a little bit off! :) Luckily, horses are horses, wherever you go.
 
Agree that US is more expensive.

I've spent a couple of years there as the expat wife without a work permit. As previously mentioned, shares and schoolmaster lessons are abundant.

I ended up with as much riding as I wanted courtesy of the local hunt, who had a barn full of horses that needed schooling and hacking. Everything from an ID, to OTTBs, QH and a paint pony (I'm small!)

The barns I rode at did do t/o, but in most cases was just dirt with big hay racks. Hunt was part of a large country estate, so their horses enjoyed large post and rail paddocks including field shelters. If I had bought there, think I would have joined the hunt club just to get access to that turn out.
 
I went out there as an ex-pat wife (well girlfriend at the time!) and had more riding than I knew what to do with, plus training, free. I found that people are a) more generous with their nice horses than here, and b) pretty much exclusively on full livery where the barn owner makes all the decisions including who rides the horse. They ask the owners for sure, but out of politeness and most people follow the owner's suggestions. You sort of have to because of the distances involved. If you want DIY then look at living in a property with land - much much cheaper than here. Otherwise the distances are just too great to deal with DIY - you'd either spend all day at the barn or half the day in the car.

I also found people genuinely friendlier than here - I was really surprised by how much I enjoyed it! They were all happy for me to ride their horses once I'd been supervised by the barn owner and passed muster.

I wasn't in a great place for horses but lucked out by doing my research in advance and being totally honest. I googled 'eventing' and the location I was going to and found a local message board. Put a post on it saying I was coming over, what I'd done and that I wanted to swap hard labour for riding/training if possible. I got put in touch with the owner of the place I rode at, and luckily she was an excellent trainer (had done the young rider programme for her area and regularly had 4* trainers doing clinics) so I got to ride 3-4 horses a day and training 3 times a week plus took sole charge 2 days a week on her day off and the day she taught at another barn. I had the time of my life, but it was hard work!

The other thing you'll find (or at least I did!) is the style of riding is subtly different over there. Lessons before buying would be highly recommended if you intend to buy anything which has any training, as I found that despite having evented to novice, several of the horses initially just went 'you what?!' at me and clearly I needed retraining to ride them. It happened fairly fast, and was the best thing I ever did for my riding, but again, I was willing to put hours of hard work in.

I even got offered horses to compete on when out there, so not owning is no barrier to doing a lot of horse stuff. I did one competition and had a horse lined up for an affiliated event, so it's all doable.
 
Oh yes, and you'll get some serious culture gaps. The funniest was when I was grooming the owner's 2yo colt. I tied him up and like anyone here went and found some twine to put through the tie ring. She came out an started grilling me about his behaviour and him being naughty. I was completely non-plussed as he'd been fine and she clearly didn't believe me. Eventually she asked about the string. I had to explain that over here if you tied any horse to the ring, you'd probably be escorted off the premises! Over there everyone ties directly to the ring and she was killing herself laughing at me/us. The farrier said 'but when I tie my horses I want them to stay there'.

Farriers are also a whole different ball game over there because there isn't the same qualification/registration system as here. Also, because of the distances etc, vets expect you to keep various injectable drugs on site and treat a lot more yourself, all be it under telephone direction. I don't think insurance exists in the same way either.
 
DoesDressage said:
The possibility of relocating to washington dc is being more of a reality and am having to consider what to do with the horses. My mare has had to be retired and on the advice of my vet, family and some people on here I think she will stay behind. Has anyone ever bought a sports horse is the US? I'm pretty unaware what the availability of horses is like particularly dressage horses. Ideally I would be looking for something with the ability to go psg max. Either something with experience if I could afford it or a young horse. Are warmbloods etc around and does anyone have any idea what the market is like compared to here? Would be buying from Maryland/Virginia area.

Thanks, can't believe how clueless I am
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I just met someone who have a warmblood type, does dressage and lives near DC. Bung me a private message with your questions and I'll ask her!
 
I'm an American dressage rider, not far from where you'll be- and that's 7 hours. You'll find you will be driving a lot more probably. Definitely some nice horses here, not sure what your price range is, you can find psg horses, but you might have to travel. Not too much self care board, and not usually at the better facilities with good arenas like you'll need. Keep in mind dc traffic is notoriously awful, so it might be tricky getting around am and pm to feed if you are near the metro area. Lovely farms outside of dc, but very $$$ and probably over an hours drive. I'm looking at a fei horse about an hour from dc in a couple weeks, I can report back on the area. :)
 
The distances are vast. That is the one thing that struck me when I have been visiting family in the USA. I would also recommend that you do not rush into horse ownership. I guess the magic words are "dressage/eventing/warmbloods" because further west horses get a lot cheaper, but then they are just ordinary horses with no aspirations to be competition horses.

Many horses are kept on a dry lot and fed hay, rather than turned out in a field, and hacking can be very limited. No bridlepaths, although there are some private areas that have permits and National Forest type places. It will be a culture shock, but have a great time.
 
My sister lives in Virginia about and hour or so from Dulles airport. Virginia is known as horse country and is absolutely fabulous for all Equestrian Sports - I love it out there. My sister is into dressage and since selling their property she keeps them at a "barn" where there is a dressage rider that helps school and bring on her younger horse.

She is a member of VADA Nova http://www.vadanova.org/ and USDF. I reckon Virginia is about as English as you can get in America. I've been many times and even gone on a road trip to the Championships held at Lexington VA with her. She has lived there for 35 yrs and has run livery yards, been DC of Pony Club and hunts etc. Tonnes of hacking available where she is usually with agreement of landowners or there are public parks such as the those on the foothills of the Blue Ridge Mountains.

From what I have seen horses out there are wildly more expensive than here if they are of quality and ability although my sister seems to gain freebies. I'm sure she would be happy to help if you were thinking of locating in Virginia - she is near Warrenton.

PM me if you would like to have a contact. :)
 
I am an American expat in the UK and some of the generalizations on this thread are completely spot on; others, not so much.

First of all, as others have said, you'll be lucky to find a DIY-type barn. I never came across one. Also, horses are indeed more expensive. A trainer I worked for in Upstate New York tried to sell me a horse with FEI potential for a mere $40,000. The horse was working at a solid Second (Medium in British) Level. The horse probably could have gone to do higher levels, more so than the horse I had and still have, but I didn't have $40,000 to spare, nor the inclination to sell my horse. But that's what a good warmblood doing well at low levels, with potential to go further seems to go for.

The other advice you have received on this thread is entirely dependent on where in the US you are and also, where in the UK. Obviously the style of riding is different if you go Western, but for dressage, the principles should be the same. The good American trainers all seem to go to Germany and therefore the German style of dressage has become the norm. I can get on a UK dressage horse and, presuming that no one has stuffed up the training, ride it no bother.

I also laughed when I read Orangehorse's statement that "the hacking can be limited." The hacking at every single livery yard I have kept my horse at since moving to the UK has ranged from total pants to just about okay; but back in the US, we had amazing trails through the woods and mountains and had more than 100 acres of wilderness available to ride on. Beat that, UK!

Dry lots and hay are more common, especially out west. Out east, they will probably be in a field. Also, it's not that hard to find yards that turn-out so long as you're not trying to board your horse IN New York City. The area around DC apparently has some lovely horse facilities. If you want more info I can contact those people.
 
To add to the turn out comments, I don't know anyone in a "regular" boarding stable who does not turn out, aside from in dangerously icy weather. I do know a few dressage people who barely turn out and a few jumpers as well, but that seems to be discipline related and also much more "negative publicity" than actual fact. Even at the shows in Florida you can rent small paddocks - at an extortionate cost, of course! Fencing is almost always post and rail, especially in that part of the world.

Climates in most parts of North America mean it is almost impossible to feed horses off pasture year round but that has to do with logistics, not preference. Hay is generally better quality (haylage and chaff are almost unheard of) and there are more vaieities available, so horses are less likely to have their forage rationed. I would also say - for reasons I only recently worked out - I have never seen or heard of anything like the rate of laminitis that seems to be prevalent in the UK. Swings and roundabouts.

Would also agree re hacking - I've never boarded anywhere that didn't at least have some decent off road hacking. Riding on the road/in urban areas is much less common, though as right of way laws and road rules are different.

Dressage training should, as CI says, should not be too different. There are some very good dressage trainers in the US and, if anything, I'd say you should find more opportunities to attend and audit clincs. Eventing is similar-ish. Only show hunters will be quite different and I suspect you would find even basic show jumping instruction different. SC's comment about horses being schooled differently was mostly re jumping horses.

In that part of the world I really would not worry about getting your horsey fix. As mentioned though, make sure you can either drive there or will have someone available to drive you.
 
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Yes, I suppose they don't have anything quite like show hunters here. Bloody good thing if you ask me. :D

I had never seen haylage until I came to the UK and while my horse eats it every day, I still don't quite know what it is. Similarly, you don't see much chaff but you do find a lot more people feeding grains and concentrates.

The other thing that comes to mind is that while laminitis, especially out west, is indeed not very common, you have to get your horse vaccinated for over half a dozen things. As Equine Infectious Anemia is a problem there, any horse who travels is required to have a Coggins test. Some states -- I suspect mostly ones out west -- also require the horse to have a thing called a brand inspection, which is sort of like a passport, except it doesn't contain vaccination records and an actual government official comes to your barn, looks at your horse, and fills out a form that states that this is the horse who you say it is.

Another odd thing of note.... vets in the US travel with so much more stuff. They can do everything short of actual surgery at your yard. I think in some well-off areas with lots of horses, you might have private vet clinics capable of surgery but for the most part, any major surgery requires the horse being shipped to a university hospital. I was floored when a horse on my yard who needed ultrasounds on his leg due to a tendon industry required repeated trips to the local vet clinic. In the US, all that would have been done with a portable ultrasound machine at the yard. The vet would be unlikely to have his or her own clinic to bring the horse to.

I could natter on endlessly.... And take the best of both countries and leave the worst if I can (and usually can't).

You'll be pleased to know that horsepeople in both countries are equally as insane. :D
 
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I didn't notice that you would be looking for a made PSG level horse. I'd be willing to wager that you will not find one for less than $75k and in that area, 100k minimum is far more likely. But I could well be wrong, since the dressage world is relatively small and closed. I do know that decent PROSPECTS generally run in the neighborhood of 25k; with FEI aspirations the price seems to jump drastically.
 
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Have to agree with Tarrsteps regarding opportunities to audit clinics.

I would welcome the chance in the UK. Really must get organised to visit the TTT sessions. Nevertheless, auditing US style gives you the chance to see "miss average" in action with a great trainer.
 
It's one of the things I really miss, mtj. There are so many more opportunities to see really top trainers teach in an accessible format and, because of the way shows are organised, to watch them train and compete.

I find the divide between pros and amateurs much greater here, and less transparent, perhaps because it is a much more client based culture in the US and most top pros have to teach to keep the lights on.
 
Yes, should have clarified, it was the jumping which is taught differently. It was just a case of relearning where the buttons were, but initially it was quite a surprise to me as I've always been able to get on most things and jump a fence - had to be taught the different style out there.

Caol - I would not expect to box my horse to the vets for an ultrasound over here, so again I think that's probably just a weird quirk of where you are. I've had ultrasound, x-rays, intestinal biopsies, gastric scoping, joint injections etc all done at the yard I'm on and would only really take a horse in for things that can't be done on a mobile basis like MRI.
 
I will defend my statement about limited hacking.

It depends where you live. My sister bought her house just because it was next to a forest where they could buy a permit to ride across a huge area, but if you had no permit the rangers wouldn't let you ride. And the riding is closed sometimes due to weather conditions. My sister said you do not ride down a road as you risk being run down by a lorry. This is near Seattle.

There isn't the bridlepath system like in the UK. So you don't tootle down the road for a little hack. I daresay that the livery yards do have access to good hacking, and I have also ridden in Montana across vast distances, but the land was still owned by someone and we had permission and I understand that there are various state lands that are available, in the right place. There is no right to ride like there is in the UK on a bridlepath so if you are in the middle of a vast arable district where do you ride your horse?
 
thank you all so much for your words of wisdom and advice. i will keep you updated and defiently take some of you up on the offers of contacts in the area. The plan is to live 45-1hr away from dc in either m or v. trying to talk dad into house with land but isnt going well. fingers crossed

thanks again
 
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