buying horse or foal?

Hi Clodagh, thanks good advice there :) "he neighs to me all the time, does cuddles far more than the yearling and is a real sweetie." - yes this is the kind of bond I would love to have with mine :D I really hope I manage to find it!
 
ahashake3 said:
Hi Queenbee :) Thanks for that, all makes sense. It would be awful if the horse ended up hating what you loved to do riding wise (or vice versa :)) Yes I am not taking this decision lightly hence why I am doing all this now and not planning on starting looking till next spring. I need to think and study everything very carefully before making my decision. I was working with horses too but have been away from it for a while now, working in office the job is nowhere near as enjoyable but pays a lot more so I can now afford to have a horse of my own. I will be asking around all my horsey friends , and if I was to take on the challenge would like to have support there. I would be equally happy with a foal or a horse, I think. Just the fact this may well be the one and only time I do this, I want to be 100 percent sure so I don't have regrets later not taking on the challange of the foal/yongster or taking on the challange and really wishing I hadn't!! :D
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I think that the best thing for me was that I saw ben when he was 2 weeks old, his mother was really lovely, well put together, his dad was fab too, both had really nice temperaments, At 2 weeks old, ben was bold, but gentle, he was by the gate with the breeders 2 kids, and unphased. I also saw his full sister, so I had a bit of an idea of how he would be in the future, and other than his funny moment when his balls dropped, he has been a sweetie. I am really glad though that I saw him so early on (when I got him, at 6 months he looked so scraggy and cut and shut!) It gave me confidence in what I was buying.
 
ahashake3 said:
Hi Clodagh, thanks good advice there :) "he neighs to me all the time, does cuddles far more than the yearling and is a real sweetie." - yes this is the kind of bond I would love to have with mine :D I really hope I manage to find it!
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See, this is it, I absolutely adore ben, but I got eb's when she was 7, have had her 11 1/2 years. She is the one that I have 'that bond' whith, she greets me with a low whinney, sometimes so low that you can only see her nostrils move :) She is my soul mate. I spent hours just cuddling her over the weekend, this was not a horse I bred, but a highly strung, nervy horse whos trust I earnt. :)
 
queenbee said:
See, this is it, I absolutely adore ben, but I got eb's when she was 7, have had her 11 1/2 years. She is the one that I have 'that bond' whith, she greets me with a low whinney, sometimes so low that you can only see her nostrils move :) She is my soul mate. I spent hours just cuddling her over the weekend, this was not a horse I bred, but a highly strung, nervy horse whos trust I earnt. :)
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Def, whether I buy horse or foal or youngster, this is what is most important to me to have, the bond :)
 
a horse of course... bred two foals, had to wait forever for them to grow, and as expensive as keeping an adult horse, fun, but more fun getting out and about, they are accident prone, and are an unkown quantity as well, so many people buy a foal and end up with not what they wanted...too big, too small, not a dressage horse... spend time looking for something that is right for you.

The cost of raising a foal to where you can finally ride, you may as well spend a few more $$ now. I think mine cost me at least $10 000AUD by the time he was three, and to be honest probably double that by the time he was 5.
 
jeeve said:
a horse of course... bred two foals, had to wait forever for them to grow, and as expensive as keeping an adult horse, fun, but more fun getting out and about, they are accident prone, and are an unkown quantity as well, so many people buy a foal and end up with not what they wanted...too big, too small, not a dressage horse... spend time looking for something that is right for you.

The cost of raising a foal to where you can finally ride, you may as well spend a few more $$ now. I think mine cost me at least $10 000AUD by the time he was three, and to be honest probably double that by the time he was 5.
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See, I have been really really lucky with my boy, the only real cost I incurred was the gelding, he did impail well, not impail so much as spike himself on something, but it was healed without fuss, not near any joints, and I just kept it clean, and had some antibiotics left over so he had those in his feed and healed up. Other than that I have been incredibly lucky. The woman up the road has the most immaculate yard I know, she breeds and has some lovely horses, but she bred one that was blind, and I think lost her 2 other youngsters , one impailed itself. she recently went away and one of her horses ran amuck and ended up with a load of stitches, I am soooooo lucky! and I really feel for her because everything is BHS perfect up there.
 
ahashake3 said:
Hi ridinghigh :) thanks for the advice. This will be (probably) the only horse/foal I will buy so I am putting so much thought into what to do :D I had a good bond with the horse I loaned, so I know it can happen if you get them at an older age too! Its such a big decision for me and I wasnt to get it right for me and the animal. How old was your horse when you first got him? Its amazing that when you find the right one it just clicks like that, I hope it happens with mine :D
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my horse was 12yrs when i got him, we seemed to gel from the word go so i think i was very lucky with him, i was actually pregnant with my youngest son when i bought him and it's him that has bonded so well with my horse, maybe it's something that was there from the start i don't know.
 
thanks for the advice about your experience Jeeve, it does really appeal to me having a foal, any other animal I have bought I have had from a baby. But I understand a lot less people buy horses young than say a dog or a cat, for obvious reasons. Its more like having a child than other animals I would imagine, its more of a lifetime commitment - other animals are a lot easier to raise and less expensive :D. I could be lucky or I could be unlucky if I decide to go ahead, its the chance you have to take. Same goes for a horse allbeit to a lesser extent. I know horses that have had horrific accidents although I understand foals/youngsters are more prone to it. I really have a lot to think about!
 
Hi Amymay, I have a couple of options to explore, really not sure yet. Going by opinions some think livery is a bad idea also I know others that have done it and it turned out fine for them :)
 
Yes, I suppose that was my question really. General livery would be a bad idea - for obvious reasons. And you would need to be looking for specialist young stock livery.
 
oops posted too soon :) So far I have 7 go for the foal/youngster 8 in between and 9 go for horse opinions :D Still about 50/50 I would say to what way I am going to go, but luckily I have months to think about it :) Thanks for all the advice so far, it really helps and has given me a lot of "food for thought"
 
For what it's worth my advice to you would be to buy a nice little horse to go out and have fun with.

Babies and youngsters are one thing, but the reality is it's hard work and you need experience behind you to get the best results.
 
I'd say go for a foal, but be very very careful on what breed/type you go for and make sure that you have the right environment and support network.

I have owned/loaned/shared and worked with horses for over 30 years but it was only 4 years ago that I had my first foal born. He is now with his lovely new owner and I now have a 2yo colt - who for the moment is being left entire, a 2yo filly and both of their mum's. My closest bond is with my 10yo mare who I have had since she was just turned 3 - I backed her myself and she is different with me than she is with everyone else. But my filly comes a close second (she is out of the 10yo mare). I was there when she was born, and she is a lovely girl.

My intention is to keep her and back her and then I'll have 2 to ride (not greedy much) but I do love working with youngsters.

My filly will happily live in but soon gets bored so she gets brought in periodically and taken for walks, groomed, have feet trimmed then goes back out. I know exactly what has been done with my youngsters, all their history and all their injuries (none for any of them) they have all been a dream to deal with, yes we do have the odd 'moment' but my colt can be led out with a mare and will behave impeccably.

I wouldn't have done any of this had I been keeping them on a livery yard - a crass generalisation I know but I wouldn't want people messing with a foal of mine when I wasn't around and you can guarantee that this would go on on a livery yard - it is very very easy to turn a nice foal into a monster and then you have a big problem on your hands.
 
thanks amymay for the advice :)

Hi Madlady, thanks for sharing your experience! Good point about keeping a colt in livery, I never thought of it that way, there would be people round his stable constantly for the "cuteness" factor and I could see that causing issues with his behaviour! haha. Its great to get everyones different opinions/experience for this reason, opens your mind to all the different possibilites/problems!
 
Horse definitely. Get something you can really enjoy. Don't overhorse yourself. If it works well and you find you are happy with the expenses and work involved start looking to the future after a year or two. Get the feel of keeping a horse at livery. Find a yard that offers safe turnout and company for your potential youngster.
Eventually if you still want to get a youngster you could get it whilst having a horse to ride. They do not cost the earth and the time involved for the first couple of years need not be huge. By then you might be ready to buy something more competitive or forward going.

When we knew my daughters horse would soon need retirement she could not afford or face getting something expensive and competitive. She wanted to continue hacking and enjoying her lad. She bought a lovely 8 month old colt who was gelded at the breeders. We brought him back to grass livery on the same yard as our other horse and he had our elderly mare to nanny him (unshod and kind natured). He lived with his half brother and 2 older ponies until recently when we have had to move yards. It is now just her and him in their paddocks and other horses over the fences. He was 3 this month and is slowly being prepared for backing next year. He has been a joy and a challange in every way. We have had horses for years and years and have had young ones but never before a foal. We have invested in regular help at every new stage to avoid doing things the wrong way. He has had his moments when I have thought what on earth have we done but overall would love to do it all again!

Please do wait though, it is harder than I thought and there are endless beautiful foals every year so there is no rush. Enjoy your first horse and get the feel of ownership - it is nothing like sharing, loaning or taking regular lessons.
 
Hi Misst, thanks for the advice there! I had never thought that maybe, eventually , I could do both. Have the horse and the foal, but it would be a good solution , see how I go with my first horse owned solely by myself and consider the foal much later depending how I get on - then I wouldn't feel that I had "missed out" on either option :) Its something I will look into,great advice, thankyou!
 
amymay said:
For what it's worth my advice to you would be to buy a nice little horse to go out and have fun with.

Babies and youngsters are one thing, but the reality is it's hard work and you need experience behind you to get the best results.
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I would agree with this, foals need experienced handling and with the best will in the world you don't have it. You can get a bond with an older horse just as easily and think about a foal once you have more experience under your belt.

Livery yards often don't take youngsters and with your lack of experience you would have to keep the foal on a specialist yard (you would need the back up of people who know).

As a breeder, I am afraid I would not sell a foal to someone who had no experience of keeping a horse apart from one on loan, it is very very easy to mess up a youngster.

You would be much better getting an older, been there, done that horse of around 10 to learn the ropes on.
 
I can honestly say that I have no idea whether or not you would be able to cope with a youngster because I have never met you.

You need to think very carefully about what you can and cannot cope with, what livery facilities you have available and what help you have.
 
Faracat said:
I can honestly say that I have no idea whether or not you would be able to cope with a youngster because I have never met you.

You need to think very carefully about what you can and cannot cope with, what livery facilities you have available and what help you have.
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yeah I have a lot to think about, and will be asking advice from the horsey people who actually know me personally too :D
 
foal/youngster - will end up costing you a lot more than having bought a "ready made" horse. You also don't really know how the foal will turn out - thats part of the risk. I have seen some super foals who hit 3 and then never grew out of the ugly stage. If you have a foal or say upto 3 year old you are actually pretty limited on what you can do and if you have never actually backed a horse - you just don't know till you start if the horse will be straightforward or be difficult and as said before - foals can be notoriously accident prone.

if you go out looking for your own horse you will be able to crack on and get out now, know what you have now and will probably be a lot cheaper in the long run. Go horse shopping - more fun and then plan what you can do next year...!!
 
Horse.

Like everybody else has said foals, while they may not need huge amounts of time, they are very hard work, they will inevitably hit the 'Kevin' stage at some point and you do need handling skills that are usually only learnt with long hard experience behind you. IME, livery yards are not set up for either youngsters or retirees, they are geared to riding horses (understandably!) that can be exercised under saddle when turnout is limited in bad weather. Also, people will spoil your foal :mad:because it's cuuuuuute, then complain when it bites or plays hard with their horses rug, or it chews the tack they leave within reach - the list is endless. Specialist youngstock livery is hard to find and is often lacking the facilities you might like so that you can handle and play with your baby. In saying that, I'm a fan of leaving youngstock to be horses in a herd with minimal (note, I say minimal not none ;))handling until you bring them in for backing but that doesn't sound like what you want to do.

TBH, for your first horse and your first experience of ownership and all that comes with it, both good and bad I would look for the fabled 7 to 12 yo that has done a bit, is a known quantity that you can go and have fun with straight away with the minimum of dramas...yes, that horse will be more expensive than a foal but there is a very good reason for that - somebody else has invested their time and experience (also known as blood, sweat and tears of the human kind) to produce a good horse. Let them take the risk rather than you, especially for your first horse!

There is always time in the future to bring your own on.
 
Faracat - I can't deny that the urge to go out and buy is strong but I am determined to do this right be sensible and think it through! Luci - all very good points, thank you! I can see it from both sides, a foal is less initial outlay, but more in the long run (most likely) and for the horse would be more cash up front but don't have to worry about gelding etc etc.... the only thing I have decided for sure is I want a colt/gelding. Everything else is still open to discussion! My family isn't much help as I'm the only animal lover, so this board and my friends are a great help!
 
ahashake3 said:
Faracat - I can't deny that the urge to go out and buy is strong but I am determined to do this right be sensible and think it through! Luci - all very good points, thank you! I can see it from both sides, a foal is less initial outlay, but more in the long run (most likely) and for the horse would be more cash up front but don't have to worry about gelding etc etc.... the only thing I have decided for sure is I want a colt/gelding. Everything else is still open to discussion! My family isn't much help as I'm the only animal lover, so this board and my friends are a great help!
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Yup - just think of all the fun you could be having out and about on your new horse next year-and progressing your riding.. which you can't do with a foal!
 
queenbee said:
Hi Angelish,

I think Dexter means that once going under saddle, they may be too sparky for you to handle, or too laid back for what you want to do, you may want a jumping horse and they may hate jumping. It is at times, far better to buy a known quantity that you gell with and that will suit your needs, than an unknown quantity, that you spend years investing time, money and energy into only to find out that it isn't 'your sort of ride'.

I have had a number of horses and done different things with them, from bringing on a youngster (sending it to be backed for 3 weeks) then riding it on, backing other people horses, complete handling of youngstock that I rescued, working with my 2 adorable fizzy nutters (pickles and ebony) who both had 'issues' when they came to me, and pickles was and ebony is 'speshal;)' Ben was brought by OH for christmas for me at 6 months, I had seen him at 2 weeks old and loved him. He is now coming up to 28months old, he has been an absolute dream, and really hasn't challenged my boundaries like many foals would he stables, he ties up, he wears his roller with pride :D and has been a sinch to mouth, he is great to catch and was quick to get the idea of leading, he is good with his feet although we do go around the stable on three legs when the farrier comes to trim. Honestly, knowing what I know about youngsters he is absolutely fantastic in terms of what I could have ended up with., and some of that comes from his breeders, and what they did before he turned up at mine. Now last year he turned, and tested, he would rear on the lead rope, if that didn't work (which it didn't) he would come back down strike out in impatience with his front hooves, and buck and cow kick at you, you try leading that!!! I almost lost my bottle with him, and I am used to horses throwing me curve balls, and what I am describing is a foal who actually has behaved pretty impeccably.

I have years of experience with owning the 'challenging and messed up ones' I have also worked at a stud and I really wanted my very own un tainted canvas, but believe me, I was nervous as hell when I got him, things can quite easily go wrong, just think things through very very carefully, Only you know your real level of experience on here and your ability, perhaps ask some people who are experienced and know you in the flesh, what their opinions and advice would be. It would be far easier for them to judge and advise you accurately, because I do not know you but would find myself advising you to go for something that has been produced already. Loaning is different than the responsibility of owning, and there is a very very wide gap between foals and ridden horses. I don't know you, and perhaps the answer to the question you should put to yourself is yes, but you do have to be brutally honest with yourself and ask if you are really skilled, experienced and capable of bringing a foal on, anyone who entertains the idea of having a foal does.
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hi queenbee :)
everyone is giving very sensible advise on here but i can understand the need to buy a foal as i too dreamed of having a foal to bring up

i had only ever had horses on loan/went to a riding school ,i didn't have horsey parents or any real help it should have been a disaster going from that paraghraph ;)

but i did have years of experience dealing with problem horses although not youngsters some of them were pretty volatile horses with a lot of issues
i got my foal from an (apparent :rolleyes: ) rescue center and visited him every week ,it turned out rescue center wasn't all as it seemed and to cut a long story short he ended up coming home at 4 mouths old very poorly with strangles and completely wild as they had twitched him and pined him down to trim his feet ,there was no other human contact before this as the mare was terrible to catch

it cost a small fortune to get him well and even my vet told me to leave him there as he wouldn't make it ,despite this i hired a wagon ,filled it with straw and brought him home not knowing weather he would even survive the journey but i had to take the chance i just couldn't leave him there,god only knows how i didn't buy more of them

i spent the first few weeks sitting in his stable reading a book ,then he allowed me to touch him and after waiting 5 months it was the most magic moment :) the 1st touch turned into scratching him and i was eventually able to get a head collar on him

we also went through bad times were he spent most of his time standing on his hind legs waving his feet in my face ,then more good times learning to pick his feet up although picking up a few bruises on the way

then bad times when he stuck his nose on a bumble bee and i spent 2 nights holding ice on him as his nose swelled up making it difficult to breath
then he went through a stage of every time i brought him in i had to get the vet as he just kept getting into trouble

i spent some humiliating time's at local shows with him being really naughty and showing me up by being a complete brat and dragging me all over the place and once even double barreling me when simple trying to take plats out

when the time came to ride him he was no problem i simply got on and rode him because he had been so well handled he took it all in his stride :)

then came more bad times ,he forgot to stop growing at 15"3 and got bigger than i wanted and by the time he was 5 he decided to turn into the most horrible nappy b***** you have ever met in your life ,he bucked me off at a dressage competition
he nearly killed me hacking out as he would rear -spin- leap-rear -spin etc he also developed a habbit of every time he spooked he'd then bronc ,he terrified me more than once and all i could think was "i either sort it out or sell him" there was no option for me ,i couldn't sell him ,i loved him and couldn't bare to think of what would happen to him

he put me through a lot of stress that year and there was times when i really hated him ,he was that naughty warming up at a ODE once ,i came 2nd in good company and should of been over the moon ,i got off, had a tantrum and said i never wanted to ride the s*** again !!

but we got through it with shear determination and since then he has taken me eventing (another dream) and is now a lovely well mannered horse and i wouldn't change him for the world :)

he is 8 now and did his tendon in june and is still causing me heart break ,the same vet that told me to leave him there was out today to scan his tendon and she is still gob smacked with how he's turned out

op if you think you can deal with all of the above and you enjoyed all the ground work and this doesn't put you off then i say go for it , i don't regret it and despite the bad times i'd do it all again in a flash :)

here are some pics of how he turned out

poorly foal

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first BE90

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first county show

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and a xc one

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he has made all my dreams come true ,he is not what i would have picked in a ridden horse as he is lazy and he isn't bold enough to go any higher than BE90 but i wouldn't swap him far anything
i think as long as you know what your getting yourself into ,have the right help and your brave/determind enough to see through an argument why not
its no good sitting when your 85 with your zimmer frame thinking oh i wished i'd done that life is too short :)
 
thats an amazing story you have Angelish :) It does worry me that if I get a horse I will regret not buying the foal later in life because it would be "too difficult" , and I really do think I could do it, you can do anything you put your heart and soul into I am a great believer in that! Then there is the option of getting the horse first and considering the foal in another couple years,like others suggested - hmm I'm really still undecided. Your story does inspire me though, sounds like it turned out well in the end despite all the challenges along the way and your boy is gorgeous!
 
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