Calling all COPD-/allergic-pony owners!

[xpkEcho]

Hi everyone!

I've been struggling incredibly with my pony lately. About a year ago she had severe issues with her (usually dormant) COPD. We moved yards to where she is out 24/7 and gets no straw or hay, but fresh air, grass, and haylage if necessary. Her symptoms completely went away for a year and now they're back with a vengeance. Coughing, trouble breathing, high respiratory rate. Had the vet out and treated her with anti-inflammatories and ventiplumin for a little over a week. She seemed better but still not great.

After a conversation with a yard-buddy, I considered it could be allergies as the timing of the symptoms went together with allergy season, and she's got sweet itch as well. Started treating her for pollen allergies and she improved dramatically. Barely any coughing now thank goodness. But... the respiratory rate is still high. Vet is stumped. As said, she is now out 24/7 but as temperatures here will rise up to 30 degrees and she doesn't cope well with heat, she will be in during the night this weekend. All sources of dust and irritants have been removed for over a year now.

So... My question to all COPD-/allergy-/respiratory-issue-pony-owners is, what do you do for your pony to make him/her feel more comfortable? Best supplements? Yes or no to (light) exercise? And also, very interested in your horse's resting respiration rate! Any tips (other than the obvious soaking hay, living out, etc) are absolutely welcome.

Love a poorly pony and a worried owner xxx

 

[Spottyappy]

Has she been scoped?
I'm asking because my mare treated as if had copd, but progressively worsened. So, I had her scoped.
Sadly, scope news doesn't look good, but there is a paralysis of the epiglottis, which means she has a lower intake of oxygen. I'm waiting for the RVC to do a different kind of scope now, to see if there is there is an operation that may help.

 

[xpkEcho]

Has she been scoped?
I'm asking because my mare treated as if had copd, but progressively worsened. So, I had her scoped.
Sadly, scope news doesn't look good, but there is a paralysis of the epiglottis, which means she has a lower intake of oxygen. I'm waiting for the RVC to do a different kind of scope now, to see if there is there is an operation that may help.

Hi Spottyappy, thank you so much for your reply! So sad to hear about your mare... My pony has not been scoped. As the symptoms totally disappeared for approximately a year and she was feeling great (I'm talking galloping through the forest for minutes on end, when months before she could barely walk without coughing), I just kept going the way I was - no vet, no medicine, just fresh air and good quality feed. If things do not improve I will absolutely look into that!

What have you been doing to keep your girl comfortable?

 

[autumn7]

Similar to above. Treated as if COPD for a year with no improvement despite trialling everything going, including ventipulmin. Changed vets, asked for a full MOT during which lungs were declared 100% healthy but question mark on respiration. Scoping found laryngeal paralysis (totally paralysed larynx LHS).
Declined tie-back op as mare was then 23 yrs old and becoming arthritic after a good hunting life so had retired her from more serious work the year before anyway. Continued to manage as you are, OP. Out 24/7, grass, steamed hay, bute for arthritis when needed.
Vet said to continue light hacking since paralysis was as bad as it gets anyway so couldn't get worse (RHS very rarely affected in horses) so hacked her out two or three times a week but let her do her own thing pretty much. This was mainly walk but odd short trots and rare canters if she was feeling particularly good. Had her put down at rising 30 due to arthritis.
Scoping, although slightly unpleasant, was a swift procedure and the scoping tube doesn't have to go down very far to check larynx, (unlike for stomach ulcers, for example) and as I recall, certainly didn't break the bank. Horse was scoped here at home in the stable, job done.
I did keep her clipped throughout summer which helped with the overheating, and didn't ride on hot days. Pretty much played it by ear from then on.

 

[xpkEcho]

Similar to above. Treated as if COPD for a year with no improvement despite trialling everything going, including ventipulmin. Changed vets, asked for a full MOT during which lungs were declared 100% healthy but question mark on respiration. Scoping found laryngeal paralysis (totally paralysed larynx LHS).
Declined tie-back op as mare was then 23 yrs old and becoming arthritic after a good hunting life so had retired her from more serious work the year before anyway. Continued to manage as you are, OP. Out 24/7, grass, steamed hay, bute for arthritis when needed.
Vet said to continue light hacking since paralysis was as bad as it gets anyway so couldn't get worse (RHS very rarely affected in horses) so hacked her out two or three times a week but let her do her own thing pretty much. This was mainly walk but odd short trots and rare canters if she was feeling particularly good. Had her put down at rising 30 due to arthritis.
Scoping, although slightly unpleasant, was a swift procedure and the scoping tube doesn't have to go down very far to check larynx, (unlike for stomach ulcers, for example) and as I recall, certainly didn't break the bank. Horse was scoped here at home in the stable, job done.
I did keep her clipped throughout summer which helped with the overheating, and didn't ride on hot days. Pretty much played it by ear from then on.

Thank you autumn7! Sounds absolutely reasonable. I'm unsure about huge procedures as well as she's not the youngest anymore either and don't want to put her through more than necessary... Hoping it'll clear up like last year... What was her resting respiration rate approx if you can remember? xxx

 

[albeg]

So... My question to all COPD-/allergy-/respiratory-issue-pony-owners is, what do you do for your pony to make him/her feel more comfortable? Best supplements? Yes or no to (light) exercise? And also, very interested in your horse's resting respiration rate! Any tips (other than the obvious soaking hay, living out, etc) are absolutely welcome.

Nose net when ridden, for pollen/dust, he seems to manage when in the field, but would put one on if needed. When he's having a flare-up, I keep him working lightly, as long as he's not struggling, as he's a good doer and will put on weight easily, which leads to further issues.
Supplement wise, he's on balsamic air, which has worked really well for him so far. He gets 15ml a day.

Last June/July, I found that he tended to cough at about 6.30/7pm if we worked out in one section of the fields, obviously there was something releasing a pollen he was sensitive to, so I avoided that field in the evenings. Could you move her from her current field to see if her breathing improves? It might help isolate something she's sensitive to.

Could you turn out at night instead of during the day if she struggles with the heat?

 

[Landcruiser]

Last year I invested in a Flexineb inhaler with Dexamethosone twice a day, which helped a lot. If you do go the inhaler route, this one is excellent as it's all one rechargeable unit, so you can use it anywhere, but it's extremely expensive and my insurance wouldn't cover it.
The single biggest help for mine has been switching from soaked/steamed hay to meadow haylage though. I haven't had to use the inhaler yet this year. (Could have saved myself a lot of money there!!!)

 

[xpkEcho]

Nose net when ridden, for pollen/dust, he seems to manage when in the field, but would put one on if needed. When he's having a flare-up, I keep him working lightly, as long as he's not struggling, as he's a good doer and will put on weight easily, which leads to further issues.
Supplement wise, he's on balsamic air, which has worked really well for him so far. He gets 15ml a day.

Last June/July, I found that he tended to cough at about 6.30/7pm if we worked out in one section of the fields, obviously there was something releasing a pollen he was sensitive to, so I avoided that field in the evenings. Could you move her from her current field to see if her breathing improves? It might help isolate something she's sensitive to.

Could you turn out at night instead of during the day if she struggles with the heat?

Starting today she's staying in during the day and out at night. I actually have the exact same experience, she tends to be A LOT worse in the early evenings than in the morning. I'm interested to see whether she'll improve from being in. At least she won't be out in the heat.

Unfortunately, my YO isn't the most flexible person in the world. I can't currently move her field individually, but the group she's in gets moved quite soon I believe. She has a nose-net attached to her flymask as well!

 

[albeg]

Starting today she's staying in during the day and out at night. I actually have the exact same experience, she tends to be A LOT worse in the early evenings than in the morning. I'm interested to see whether she'll improve from being in. At least she won't be out in the heat.

Unfortunately, my YO isn't the most flexible person in the world. I can't currently move her field individually, but the group she's in gets moved quite soon I believe. She has a nose-net attached to her flymask as well!

Fingers crossed being in will help.

Is there anywhere you could take her for a walk/hack for an hour or so to see if her breathing improves?
Just suggesting it as I had a dramatic one once, where I took my guy for a lesson and he started coughing when he got off the box at the instructor's yard, intermittently at first, but got bad enough that we cut the lesson short. Took him home and he was perfect, whatever plants/trees had been at the other yard had set him off, and once he was removed from it he improved immediately.

Another thought...is there any rapeseed near you?

 

[Abby-Lou]

I have had amazing results this summer with Maxavita MaxaBreathe, no coughing at all now, I'm waiting until pollen season really kicks in but so far over last month has stop ponies cough dead. I have just ordered my second tub which is currently on offer Hyperdrug £17.15 (probably get told off by admin for this but hey ho).

 

[stimpy]

I have 4 horses, 2 of which have been diagnosed with RAO within the last 18 months. The gelding (15yo) was triggered by eating mouldy hay, the mare (18 yo) had a massive allergic attack last summer when my neighbour was making hay. I have managed both of them in the same way: no dry hay, only steamed hay or haylage, and drastic spring clipping to keep them as cool as possible as temperatures begin to rise. I take their resp rate every day and keep a diary to try and establish what are the causes of any crises that they have. The diary has helped me realise that the gelding can be fairly compromised before his resp rate rate goes up, and he is very hairy so it is easy to miss that he can be doing light double breathing. He is mostly between 16 and 20 resp per min and will only rise above that when he is very bad. The mare however has a much more variable resp rate, if it is under 18 I am happy, she is often around 26-28 has been up at 40. Even if I am managing them well the heat really seems to do for them and they are both struggling this week. Medication-wise I don't find ventipulmin to have any effect so I have an inhaler (Equihaler, goes over one nostril) and give them varying amounts of their steroid puffer to control bad symptoms. I have trained them to accept the inhaler with no bother so it is very easy for me to medicate them, no headcollars I just do them in the field.

 

[xpkEcho]

I have had amazing results this summer with Maxavita MaxaBreathe, no coughing at all now, I'm waiting until pollen season really kicks in but so far over last month has stop ponies cough dead. I have just ordered my second tub which is currently on offer Hyperdrug £17.15 (probably get told off by admin for this but hey ho).

Awesome, thank you so much! I've ordered it and am going to give it a go! xxx

 

[stimpy]

The single biggest help for mine has been switching from soaked/steamed hay to meadow haylage though. I haven't had to use the inhaler yet this year. (Could have saved myself a lot of money there!!!)

That's really interesting Landcruiser, I have been starting to wonder whether haylage is considerably better for mine than steamed hay. Were you steaming with a good quality steamer? My problem is that both of mine are extremely good doers and getting good quality meadow haylage rather than rye in small bales for this time of year is almost impossible. Winter is OK as I can get through enough to buy large rounds.

 

[xpkEcho]

Fingers crossed being in will help.

Is there anywhere you could take her for a walk/hack for an hour or so to see if her breathing improves?
Just suggesting it as I had a dramatic one once, where I took my guy for a lesson and he started coughing when he got off the box at the instructor's yard, intermittently at first, but got bad enough that we cut the lesson short. Took him home and he was perfect, whatever plants/trees had been at the other yard had set him off, and once he was removed from it he improved immediately.

Another thought...is there any rapeseed near you?

Thanks so much everyone for your continued help!!

I haven't seen any rapeseed around. She's so bad atm that I'd rather not move her as she's a really insecure pony and gets stressed quickly... She's got sweet itch too so might just be allergic to life...

 

[xpkEcho]

I have 4 horses, 2 of which have been diagnosed with RAO within the last 18 months. The gelding (15yo) was triggered by eating mouldy hay, the mare (18 yo) had a massive allergic attack last summer when my neighbour was making hay. I have managed both of them in the same way: no dry hay, only steamed hay or haylage, and drastic spring clipping to keep them as cool as possible as temperatures begin to rise. I take their resp rate every day and keep a diary to try and establish what are the causes of any crises that they have. The diary has helped me realise that the gelding can be fairly compromised before his resp rate rate goes up, and he is very hairy so it is easy to miss that he can be doing light double breathing. He is mostly between 16 and 20 resp per min and will only rise above that when he is very bad. The mare however has a much more variable resp rate, if it is under 18 I am happy, she is often around 26-28 has been up at 40. Even if I am managing them well the heat really seems to do for them and they are both struggling this week. Medication-wise I don't find ventipulmin to have any effect so I have an inhaler (Equihaler, goes over one nostril) and give them varying amounts of their steroid puffer to control bad symptoms. I have trained them to accept the inhaler with no bother so it is very easy for me to medicate them, no headcollars I just do them in the field.

Thank you so much for your elaborate description! Good to hear I'm not crazy: I've been journaling her progress (or decline...) and taking her resp rate twice daily. I saw a neighbour making hay as well right next to her, but she was already struggling at the time so no way to know if that's what caused it...

 

[albeg]

The single biggest help for mine has been switching from soaked/steamed hay to meadow haylage though. I haven't had to use the inhaler yet this year. (Could have saved myself a lot of money there!!!)

I've noticed a massive difference in my gelding since we switched to haylage too. He was a lot better this winter than previous years.

Thanks so much everyone for your continued help!!

I haven't seen any rapeseed around. She's so bad atm that I'd rather not move her as she's a really insecure pony and gets stressed quickly... She's got sweet itch too so might just be allergic to life...

Hopefully you can find the cause soon, it's awful seeing them with their breathing elevated and not being able to solve it. Is there anything flowering around the yard?

 

[xpkEcho]

I've noticed a massive difference in my gelding since we switched to haylage too. He was a lot better this winter than previous years.



Hopefully you can find the cause soon, it's awful seeing them with their breathing elevated and not being able to solve it. Is there anything flowering around the yard?

She gets haylage too and that has certainly helped in the past. It's really awful... And gosh so much. I actually live overseas and right next to a massive forest, surrounded by fields and water (= pollen, flies, EVERYTHING). So just about anything that could be flowering probably is..

 

[albeg]

She gets haylage too and that has certainly helped in the past. It's really awful... And gosh so much. I actually live overseas and right next to a massive forest, surrounded by fields and water (= pollen, flies, EVERYTHING). So just about anything that could be flowering probably is..

Nightmare! Hopefully whatever it is will be finished flowering soon!

Oh...things keep coming back to me - last year it was suggested to me to get a blood test done during a flare up, to see if anything showed up in that.

 

[Fruitcake]

I've invested in a Flexineb nebuliser too.

The thing is, if there's inflammation in the lungs, Ventipulmin won't help as it's a bronchial dilator (like Salbutamol that's in blue inhalers) designed to relax the airways to make breathing easier. If the lungs are inflamed, you need steroids to reduce the inflammation otherwise there's reduced capacity for air.

I started off using human Beclemetazone steroid inhalers (prescribed by the vet) with a baby spacer. This did have some effect so we decided to invest in the nebuliser so he can have his steroids nebulised every day as it's more effective.

I do still need to use a Salbutamol inhaler as a reliever or before work when he's bad but keeping on top of the inflammation with a low dose of preventative steroid has definitely had most impact.

 

[tashcat]

Hi, how old is your mare?

For my boy, the only thing that tackled his COPD (and brought his respiratory rate downs significantly) was a nebuliser. Happy to tell you all about it if you're interested - just send me a dm.

 

[fabbydo]

I had mine tested to see exactly what she was allergic to. They then made a vaccine specifically for her and I inject her myself. I had to retire her but it seems to keep things at bay. Our record resp rate is 54!!! She was very poorly and surprised many when she survived. We also tried inhalers, ventipulmin, shavings bed etc but nothing touched it.

 

[Spottyappy]

Hi Spottyappy, thank you so much for your reply! So sad to hear about your mare... My pony has not been scoped. As the symptoms totally disappeared for approximately a year and she was feeling great (I'm talking galloping through the forest for minutes on end, when months before she could barely walk without coughing), I just kept going the way I was - no vet, no medicine, just fresh air and good quality feed. If things do not improve I will absolutely look into that!

What have you been doing to keep your girl comfortable?

At the moment, I am waiting for the second scope to confirm how much oxygen she is getting, so I can make an informed decision on where to go next, as I was told it's a tie forward op she needs, not a tie back. Tie forward isn't as straightforward apparently.so, decision maybe retire and keep comfortable as long as possible.
She's out 24/7 and I do gentle exercise as vet advised better to keep her in low level work.

 

[xpkEcho]

Hi, how old is your mare?

For my boy, the only thing that tackled his COPD (and brought his respiratory rate downs significantly) was a nebuliser. Happy to tell you all about it if you're interested - just send me a dm.

Hi! She's 17. That sounds really interesting, I'd love to hear more!

 

[thezulu]

My horse developed hay fever last year (she is 7) SPA-RAO which triggers RAO. Nothing really worked apart from the nebuliser. Coughing and highly increased breathing rate, up to 30bpm (in the winter its 11). I have tried every supplement known to man.... The only thing that made a difference is the nebuliser and she has Ventipulmin in it (to help coughing and mucus) and Pulmicort (steroid) which reduces inflammation and brings breathing rate down. Twice a day from April - June then we got down to once a day July-October when all stopped and she is fine again until the tree pollen started in Mid February... I do support with various herbs and I am feeding spirulina to help with allergy. But, I am sure these things just make me feel better. Feedmark Clarity helps my old mare who gets snotty in the summer. But I guess like humans there is a difference between someone who just gets hayfever and a person who has asthma and then gets hayfever. I am always one for the more holistic approach, but the only thing that has got it under control is nebulising with drugs :-( Defo better to ride in morning as she is much better first thing, steamed hay, full face and nose fly mask, nose net when ridden (she will stop to itch nose at very difficult moments), she was better inside during the day this time of year which is a pain as I have a herd of 4 that all live out. It is difficult and very expensive. But, its all about acting quickly to avoid permanent damage. She is fine at the moment on roads, but starts coughing in fields especially when it is humid. I do still try and work her everyday, but anything faster than walk you need to play by ear (coughing). In the winter no problem at all. Good luck x

 

[xpkEcho]

Hey everyone, thank you so much for your comments. Pony was doing a lot better on natural supplements and being kept in during the day when it was hot, but yesterday starting coughing like never before. Calling the vet today to discuss nebulisers...

 

[Fruitcake]

Hey everyone, thank you so much for your comments. Pony was doing a lot better on natural supplements and being kept in during the day when it was hot, but yesterday starting coughing like never before. Calling the vet today to discuss nebulisers...

I'd say it's definitely worth looking into. They're quite pricey (around £900) but if you're insured, the insurance should pay.

 

[GoldenWillow]

My cob has just been diagnosed with COPD/RAO or Equine Asthma as it's now being called. He was diagnosed with a BAL which showed he had it. He showed signs last summer but was fine since then until this May. He's mainly out but when stabled has haylage and bedded on shavings. He's just started with a Flexineb nebuliser using steroids so I'm keeping my fingers (and everything else) crossed it can get it under control.