Can I be missing something other than pain???

[shugmx]

We bought our horse rising 4 just backed. His flat work was fine little rushed to canter. He had a lovely trot but once cantered, very choppy short and tense when returning to trot, after previously riding in a lovely light outline. He is a 16.3 leggy skinny sport horse, Irish x WB He did get a lot better from may through to August 2015, in which time he did several 4 year old eventing classes. He went out in August on a break and came back to work January 2016. He was very hard to ride doing massive bucks, changed saddle with a qualified saddle fitter had his back checked and visited a vet. Vet has worked on many occasions with the Eventing Olympic teams. Vet could not find anything wrong with him. (no scan done or x rays.) Felt it wasn't needed just being hot headed. We pushed on his bucking became less and disappeared only when introduced to something new in grid work which we put down to stress. Down hill transitions canter to trot, not great still but better while super fit through spring/summer 2016. We jumped affiliated, jumping 110 hardly ever hitting a pole only now and again in speed rounds always in top 6 of classes sometimes with 120 in it. So jumping performance not suffering. Once again in August had 2 months off, bringing us up to the last 3 weeks. Everything great until he canters and then after downward transition he goes back to short choppy trot often not wanting to ride forward(again trot being so lovely before canter). He Hasn't changed much over last year in body shape but going to get saddle checked again. Now started with dressage trainer who hopefully will help. Show jumping trainer last year put it down to, he is a hard horse to ride and ignored it but as time progressed and he got fitter down hill transition got better not perfect. He is a lovely calm horse, in fact a dream horse. His only problem is down hill transition from canter as i have described above. With new dressage instructor we do see it improving still choppy but not as tense, riding it better but not when on our own yet. Please please anyone come across this before. Thank you for taking the time to read this.

 

[Zipzop]

How old is he currently?

 

[shugmx]

rising 6

 

[ycbm]

Are you ruling out pain?

Have you tried a bute test? I'm told they don't work on back pain, though.

I'd try a bute test, and if no reaction, I'd x ray the back, scan the hind suspensories for PSD and if nothing shows on that, numb the sacroiliac.

I hope you find the answer.

 

[Orangehorse]

What is he like if someone else rides him? Could just be a schooling problem, like don't think "down into trot" but "forward into trot." Actually I have always found the canter to trot transition very difficult. Maybe it is just that he is still not strong and balanced enough?

Otherwise it is back to the vet and see what he advises, which could include a course of physiotherapy or other bodywork.

 

[Zipzop]

As a rising six year old he hasn't even finished growing and developing, His cross breed contains two very big slow maturing types. IMO you are working his skeletally immature body far too hard and he is trying to tell you about it but you are still pushing him on! I heartily disagree with young undeveloped and therefore weak horses being pushed on to event and jump affiliated at four years old, quite frankly it's outrageous and just because it's the norm does not make it ethically correct. I have seen and taught Many horses who even up into their teens have remained weak through their body because no one gave them time to mature and get strong before they started pushing them hard physically and even then they were trained incorrectly which led to all sorts of behavioural problems all because the horse is not strong enough to do the job expected.
Once Pain has been ruled out I'd give this poor horse a break and work on building him up physically but only at the rate his body allows before these behaviour problems become firmly ingrained.

 

[shugmx]

ZipZop he was worked very slowly as a 4 year old and did 7 shows over a 3 month period to August when he was 4 only jumping up to 80s none affiliated eventing. In 5 year old he was worked to be fit up until may this year then jumped at a show every two weeks from mid may to august which was affiliated. Now just back in after 2 months off. i appreciate though what you are saying re not finished growing. i am very sorry if this seems too much to you.

 

[shugmx]

Thanks every one for your response, i am going to check saddle that was last fitted in may tonight we tried bare back and he rode a better transition. If this doesn't work heading back to vet to check further. just wanting to find out if anyone experienced everything ok bar that one downhill transition.

 

[Kezzabell2]

What's he like on the lunge?

My horse is 6 and has had numerous issues but now in full work. But he hates schooling, I've noticed recently on the lunge he sort of falls out of canter with his back legs but then trots on fine. So have put it down to only really being used to cantering in straight lines, so he's still unbalanced

He did have his hocks fused, due to spavins, so it could be connected to that. So I'm currently trying to build center up on the lunge again, to see if he improves

 

[shugmx]

Hi Kezzabell, he is fine on lunge. Only that downhill transition upsets him. What you are describing he did do when he started lunging as a 5 year old. but grand now. Hope all keeps improving for you

 

[gunnergundog]

Full lameness work-up with a decent equine specialist vet would be my approach. I have a very genuine six year (won first time out at BE100) that a few weeks ago said 'no' to something in a very polite but unusual manner; sadly, this has shown up as synovial proliferation in the medial aspect of the femoral-tibial joint. If you know your horse and ride to a semi-decent level then listen to your horse would be my advice. I would rather spend 1K at the vets and be proven to be a paranoid horse owner than work something to the extent that it can't be repaired.

Best of luck!

 

[shugmx]

Thanks gunnergundog, Back specialist and saddle fitting on Friday and if nothing sorted going to head to Dublin university veterinary hospital get full works done. Going to have to get second opinion. Thanks for reading.

 

[mega spoilt ponies]

discomfort after a canter.. i would want to rule out gastric ulcers. (squamous splash ulcers in top of stomach can be painful with faster pace splashing acid about)

 

[shugmx]

Thanks mega spoilt ponies. Hadn't considered ulcers as no other signs that's an interesting one to check out.

 

[elsielouise]

Might also be worth trialling a GOOD treeless saddle to see if that makes any difference. I have competition rider friends who swear by them.

 

[Ali27]

I would check for ulcers! Gastric and hind gut!