Can i refuse to pay vets bill? Not happy

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molly1239

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Just written loong post and lost it so this is very condensed. Sorry its not in vets but thought more would see it here?

* Horse had prev sinus troubles, since sorted out, but no longer insured for this.
* Horse started with snotty/bloody nose, so scope, xray etc hole was put into sinus, and drain. Then decision made that something was going on in the sinus..
Op removed large sinus cyst.
* Horse sent home with 2 remaining AB injections, and for me to flush him daily.
* 7 days later drain removed, 10 days after op stitches removed. All ok but noe still running however vets said it should all settle down.
* 2.5 weeks later still running, and horse was quiet. Got vet out and he could see pus in sinus after he removed the scab off the hole where the drain had been.
* Next day took him into vets, they mentioned that stuff (bits of hay etc) must of got into hole where drain was and caused infection. He had drain put back in, flushed and xrayed again. They then mentioned that op could of blocked the drainage channels. (there fault?) Diff vet dealing with him mentioned he usually puts horses on long term ABs after this type of op. (None given) So sent home 2 x flushes daily, bute and 2 x ABs. (one long term)
* 10 days on and still no better. Vets due tomorrow to scope him and see whats going on..
* Ive had a bill for the last visit £300, now bills at £1,400!

Somebody tell me im not going mad at not feeling like this is all my fault, and some responsibility had to lie with the vets?
 
TBH, no I am not seeing it is the vets fault, nor am I saying it is yours.

A horse with known sinus problems, that sound like it hasn't totally sorted ( or it wouldn't have come back ) itself out. Yes, it's harsh that the insurance won't cover it. Yes, it's harsh that the op didn't make it totally disappear. There is mixed views on whether long term AB's are effective - he had a course to cover the initial operation, if there is no further evidence of infection, then continuing them is not always necessary.

One thing I will say though, they should have given better advice on keeping the holes clean after the drain removal - if they have scabbed over, then anything inside will just get infected if it can't escape - and sinuses are well known to be very fluidy.

Sorry to hear your horse hasn't been well though - it's a worry, whatever happens. Fingers crossed it gets sorted for you.
 
some responsibility lies with nature, horse all respond differently to medication as do infections to antibiotics.
animals are not machines its why we love them but also what makes each and everyone individual even down to how they respond to meds, stress and infection.

if you are unhappy discuss it calmly with your vet but s**t happens, hope things go more smoothly from now
 
Should of explained better. Last time he had bone flap op done on the oppersite side of his head, that is all sorted no problem with that side. Discharge this time from the other nostril.

I know he must be more prone to sinus troubles, but surely knowing that they should of sent him home with a longer cause of ABs.

The hole was cleaned (as much as he would let me) but tbh the hole has to scab over to heal eventually? If it was caused by that then his course of flushing and AB should of seen it off by now? (maybe not) but i think theres something else going on, in my heart.

Dont get me wrong i will pay my bill, just think they are abit steep given whats happened.
 
molly1239 said:
Should of explained better. Last time he had bone flap op done on the oppersite side of his head, that is all sorted no problem with that side. Discharge this time from the other nostril.

I know he must be more prone to sinus troubles, but surely knowing that they should of sent him home with a longer cause of ABs.

The hole was cleaned (as much as he would let me) but tbh the hole has to scab over to heal eventually? If it was caused by that then his course of flushing and AB should of seen it off by now? (maybe not) but i think theres something else going on, in my heart.

Dont get me wrong i will pay my bill, just think they are abit steep given whats happened.
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you explained it fine first time, i dont think vets have done anything wrong from what you have said, is your horse insured? this is going to sound wrong but its meant as a straight forward question, why should the vets stomach the extra cost because things have not gone as expected?
 
Its always disappointing when an operation doesn't lead to a quick return to full health.

Perhaps to restore your confidence in the practice, have a chat about how likely the complications were and if it was reasonable to have foreseen this and if so, would it have changed the aftercare.
 
But long term ab use has very real risks, too. Vet work is, unfortunately, full of variables and so vets are constantly weighing risks and rewards. There is rarely one and only one right answer.

I know it's not what you want to hear but my personal observation/experience of sinus infections in horses is not particularly cheery and has almost always taken a similar path to your own situation. Yes, there are many stories that end quickly and happily but there are others that drag on, up and down, for ages, even with the very best of treatment and attention.
 
Jools- you said the first sinus problem couldnt of been solved, hence why i tried to explain further. This sinus problem is not related to the last one, they have told me that much.

I feel that the vets have done the op, and told me that out of 30 ops only 2 have had a cyst re occur. I think that they have failed to sort out this problem, and so being a little more lenient on the bills would not go amiss. Vet even came out to look at him, and possibly put drain back in, and turned up, gave him a load of dope and then didnt have drain with them, so still cost me £90.
Between me and the vets, i want him fixed and not having him to put up with this any longer.

He is not insured for this problem, so ive folked out for two ops in as many years. So yes i accept ***** happens, but where does it all end? Next time i will buy a goldfish as a pet!
 
Tarrsteps- yes i know sinus troubles is a real bugbear to get sorted. However if a vet says 'oh we have removed a large cyst' you think they have got to the root of the problem. Now if it was just a secondary infection then the drugs and draining hes been on should be working by now.. if they have blocked drainage channels or it is indeed caused by something else, they must of failed to find all the causes to start with?

All though i do appreciate im probably in a stinking mood with all this going on!!
 
molly1239 said:
Jools- you said the first sinus problem couldnt of been solved, hence why i tried to explain further. This sinus problem is not related to the last one, they have told me that much.

I have read back over what I have written in case it came across wrong but I cant see where I wrote that

I feel that the vets have done the op, and told me that out of 30 ops only 2 have had a cyst re occur. I think that they have failed to sort out this problem, and so being a little more lenient on the bills would not go amiss.

I dont maybe yours is one of the two i still dont understand why the bets should carry some of the cost

Vet even came out to look at him, and possibly put drain back in, and turned up, gave him a load of dope and then didnt have drain with them, so still cost me £90.

if they knew they were putting the drain back in then i would expect this cost to be wavered or no charge for the visit to return and put the drain in, but only if no other treatent was given or needed

Between me and the vets, i want him fixed and not having him to put up with this any longer.

we would all want that its not nice having animals that are not 100%

He is not insured for this problem, so ive folked out for two ops in as many years. So yes i accept ***** happens, but where does it all end? Next time i will buy a goldfish as a pet!
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my horses are not insured, my choice if s**t happens i have to pay the bill or make the decision to call it a day, it is the owners choice not to insure unless it is an excluded condition and then owners know if it happens again then they will need to find the money
 
Sorry Jools, you it was Saalsk that i should of been replying to re the prev problems.

If the vets told me cyst was the cause, its removed and we then (hopefully not but still a chance) find out there is something else going on in there.. then they havent fully sorted the problem out.
 
molly1239 said:
Sorry Jools, you it was Saalsk that i should of been replying to re the prev problems.

If the vets told me cyst was the cause, its removed and we then (hopefully not but still a chance) find out there is something else going on in there.. then they havent fully sorted the problem out.
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sometimes one problem can mask/hide another so its not till one is removed that the other becomes evident.

i think you have had bad luck but not that there is anyone to blame
 
I agree with all of the above answers you have received; medicine, human or veterinary isn't perfect. Sometimes one things happens after another and it isn't anyone's 'fault'. But, if you are unhappy with your vet, I would suggest that you write a letter outlining your thoughts to the senior partner, copy to your vet for courtesy, and wait and see what happens. Far better to do that than getting cross about what has happened, and not getting the support that you feel you need from posters here.
 
Think I'd put it in the these things happen category. Mine had a large sinus mass removed, but then needed 2 further surgeries plus regularly travelling 200 miles for check up CT scans,this was over a course of 2 years. He's been left with a head shaking problem as well & I spent £7,000 over what his insurance covered! I'm a vet nurse though so it's probably easier for me to accept that's just the way things happen sometimes! By the end though the vets did,I think,knock a bit of money off final bills. Also I always kept his head fully dressed until the holes had sealed(sometimes for 8-10wks after surgery)
 
Also it's a tricky operating in sinuses due to lack if visualisation especially if just through trephine holes.
 
I do really feel for you - sinuses are a nightmare to sort out because of the fluid, the likely foreign bodies, the fact they are so well supplied with blood - all that warmth and moisture, makes them a bug-fest.

I would be raising my eyebrows if a vet could say for certain that 2 sinus problems in one horse were totally unrelated. Just as I would if the vet said that removing a cyst was the end to the problem. In fairness to the vet, operating for sinus problems on a horse, finding and removing a cyst - I would think that was the most likely cause. However, until the horse was sinus problem free afterwards, I would not make bets on it. There is nothing to say there wasn't an ongoing issue, that is nothing to do with the cyst, and the cyst just happened to be found.

I do hope they sort it for you ( and the horse), and as another poster suggested, I would be asking about the visit where the drain wasn't brought with them - they knew what they were coming out to. I have had a vet visit to do vaccinations, identichip and a passport on a baby, and they didn't bring a chip - they tried to charge me for a second visit to do the chip. I suggested it wasn't my fault - they knew what the visit was for - they did a FOC visit.
 
It sounds as though you have been unlucky OP. I can completely understand how frustrating it is as we had a similar thing with our lizard. I know its not the same but had an operation, no antibiotics afterwards and it got infected. He had the wound drained and an antibiotic paste put inside it but no other antibiotics. It then became severely infected and he then got antibiotics but went down hill fast, He had all manner of drugs but unfortunately died. My first thought was he would have been OK if he'd had antibiotics first time etc, but thinking back now I don't think it would have mattered.

For future treatment, speak to the vet and tell them any concerns you have and put this bill down to experience.

I hope your horse recovers soon x
 
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