Can people buy horses off the meat man?

[Anna2015]

There is a dealer local to me that is getting slated at the moment as she is supposedly buying from the meat man and selling the horses on as perfectly fine horses but is that possible? As some people decide to send their horses off to the meat man expecting a quick and humane death... not to be sold on the advertised online??

 

[Equi]

Yes it is if they sell the horse to the meat man and he takes it away alive. When they have sold it to him, it is his to do with what he pleases.

 

[hackneylass2]

If people wanted a 'quick and humane' end for their horses they would not 'send their horses off' to the meat man. Meatmen usually buy their stock at auctions.

It is perfectly possible to buy a decent horse from a low end 'meat' action, if you are very well versed in spotting a potentially decent horse in the rough. Sadly with the economic situation as it is, there are a lot of viable animals ending up at auctions. If an honest dealer is good at spotting the ones with potential then good on him or her for buying and putting some training and value on it to sell on.

Owners who want a quick and humane death for their horse have it put down at home, they don't send it 'away'.

 

[ester]

Yes, and sometimes they are perfectly fine horses! our local chap ended up with 3 welsh B's after a lady died, mum and her 2 progeny. Mum went to a small child and the other 2 went to the riding school (he used to ring up if he thought he had anything that should get a try out , it didn't always work .) He also picks up at the new forest sales and throws them in a field to grow up and sells quite a few on as projects.

 

[TheMule]

Send your horse direct to the abattoir and it won't get sold on.
'The meat man' is just someone who buys the cheap dross and takes it to the abattoir- if someone wants to offer more money than its meat value then I'm sure they'd be perfectly happy to take it

 

[twiggy2]

a quick and humane death with the meat man? I don't think so

 

[Red-1]

Years ago I had my pony PTS, we did go to the abattoir, but had an arrangement that he would no go "in" the place, but would be dispatched on the house lawn. A friend had done the same so I knew it would all be tasteful, and it was back in the '80s, in our area, it was what was done.

When I got there they insisted that they could not do him that day, and wanted him to go into a stable overnight. I said I would drive him home again ( 2 1/2 hours) and fetch him back the next day, but I would NOT leave him. They suddenly were able to do the deed, and it was quick and as good as could be expected.

I later found someone else who had the same experience, but DID leave the horse in the stable. She said it was beautiful, well bedded, and she felt she could not refuse.

A year after that I met someone who bought a beautiful looking horse, who turned out to be lame with an occult spavin. She traced its history back, and found a previous owner had taken it to the same place, and she too had left it in the beautiful stable.

I was so glad I insisted my 35 year old, much loved pony, with melanomas right through, including lungs and heart, was done while I was there. It was indeed a fitting end, in the autumn sunshine, on the house lawn. For years I contemplated what would have happened if I had left him, as he did still look fantastic, as in well covered, sound. He would have looked OK in an auction ring, I guess people would not have listened to his heart/ lungs, even though it was obvious he was compromised even when leading up the steep hill from field to his stable, it would not necessarily have been obvious in an auction setting.

I though THAT was bad enough, but imagine years later, like 30 ish years later, the very abattoir is featured as a horrible, cruel place in the horse meat scandal. The clips of horses in a shared barn, with broken legs, being hung up still alive, they will haunt me for a very long time. I don't think the place was the same 30 years previously, I can't compute the easy end my pont had to being the same place.

If I had not stayed? Who knows? Would he have been sold to auction? Would he have been swiftly out of the stable and into the barn?

What I do know is that staying to the end was what my pony deserved. It has stopped me being in despair when the horse meat scandal broke. TBH the thought of him being eaten would not have bothered me either way once he was dead, but the thought of that faithful old man being scared and hurt would have driven me mad.

4 years ago Charlie was PTS. This time we did it at home, on our own lawn, with the vet.

Both ways were fine, but I think staying to see the deed done is essential. And yes, I do think some, in the past at least, were sent to be PTS, only to be sold on at auction if they looked good.

 

[Goldenstar]

All sort of horses end up with meat men , they are dealers buying and selling things .
And they are perfectly entitled to sell on horses if they wish if the owner has taken cash on collection for them.
Sadly often perfectly healthy horses go for meat it just takes one wrong turn for a horses life to go wrong .
And often the horse is in that situation for a very good reason .
PTS your horses at home or on your yard if you want to know where it ends up.

 

[D66]

On the other hand, I know someone who bought an ex racehorse from the meatman - she looked pretty and wasn't lame but she was never sound enough to ride and had a whole list of health problems and so must have been in some pain.

 

[Goldenstar]

On the other hand, I know someone who bought an ex racehorse from the meatman - she looked pretty and wasn't lame but she was never sound enough to ride and had a whole list of health problems and so must have been some pain.

Buyer beware in that situation .

 

[stormox]

If its a dealer buys off the meat man (who is just a dealer in low-value horses) they get slated....... if they call themselves a 'rescue'and buy off the meat man they get high praise.....

 

[EQUIDAE]

If its a dealer buys off the meat man (who is just a dealer in low-value horses) they get slated....... if they call themselves a 'rescue'and buy off the meat man they get high praise.....

A lot of unscrupulous 'rescues' do this - buy from auction 'saving' it from the meat man and then sell it on a few weeks later for a £400 'donation'. Quite profitable... A charity I used to back horses for did this. I stopped after she was bragging that she pulled in nearly £120k and only declared £26

ETA - they were reported to the charities commission and trading standards. Also to social services and the police as they were working with vulnerable children and had controlled drugs out and kids unsupervised

 

[be positive]

If its a dealer buys off the meat man (who is just a dealer in low-value horses) they get slated....... if they call themselves a 'rescue'and buy off the meat man they get high praise.....

That sums it up perfectly.

The "meatman" is not a slaughter house or someone who takes old/ ill/ injured/ unwanted horses off to a quick end, he is a dealer in cheap equines, many of those should have gone directly to the abattoir or pts at home but the owners take the option to get some cash rather than do the right thing, if they then get "recycled" there is only one person to blame and that is the person who sent it off to the meatman rather than take responsibility for their horse and doing the right thing by them.

 

[Silver]

If you want to be sure your horse has been put to sleep make sure you are witness to this. Selling to meat man as others have said is not necessarily going to mean your horse will be put to sleep, just means you have sold your horse on.

 

[Equi]

a quick and humane death with the meat man? I don't think so

This comment is a bit unfair. Meat men get a lot of abuse for their profession when they just do what everyone else is and making a living by providing a service. There are some truly compassionate slaughterers who don't enjoy their job but do it because it's required. Not all meat men are heartless murderers who just want a blood fix or a few quid.

 

[Meowy Catkin]

They could always buy the horses back and have them PTS. TBH, they should never have sold them in the first place (if PTS was truly the right thing), they should have manned up and arranged for it to be done while still in their ownership.

 

[9tails]

There is a dealer local to me that is getting slated at the moment as she is supposedly buying from the meat man and selling the horses on as perfectly fine horses but is that possible? As some people decide to send their horses off to the meat man expecting a quick and humane death... not to be sold on the advertised online??

Ahh bless, rose tinted glasses at their finest. The meatman isn't a slaughterer, he buys horses cheap who may or may not end up at slaughter. If you want a quick and humane death, book the vet or hunt to dispatch your horse at home.

 

[9tails]

This comment is a bit unfair. Meat men get a lot of abuse for their profession when they just do what everyone else is and making a living by providing a service. There are some truly compassionate slaughterers who don't enjoy their job but do it because it's required. Not all meat men are heartless murderers who just want a blood fix or a few quid.

Meatmen don't kill horses, they're dealers. Slaughterhouses kill horses, meatmen buy horses from auction or cheap sale and sell to the slaughterhouses.

 

[Leo Walker]

A lot of unscrupulous 'rescues' do this - buy from auction 'saving' it from the meat man and then sell it on a few weeks later for a £400 'donation'. Quite profitable... A charity I used to back horses for did this. I stopped after she was bragging that she pulled in nearly £120k and only declared £26

ETA - they were reported to the charities commission and trading standards. Also to social services and the police as they were working with vulnerable children and had controlled drugs out and kids unsupervised

Frankie came from a similar "rescue" They were living on a rented yard, paid for with housing benefit, and getting horses from the meat man on a sale or return basis, and then rehoming them for a donation. It all went horribly wrong when they fell out with the landlord and didnt pay the meat man.

Frankie didnt actually come from the meat man but was gifted to them from his old owners who couldnt afford to keep him. He was only there 3 weeks when I got him. I went and picked him up at 3pm, and found a yard full of horses not mucked out, having been stood in from the night before, and loads more out in a field full of foggage and ragwort.

My "donation" for him was £500, which for a 2yr old 13.2/3hh cob in the North East, was over the odds. He also came with a fake passport, which added another £100 to his cost! The only reason I even considered it, is because I'd been watching it all unfold on Facebook, and I could see Frankie was exactly what I wanted and hadnt been able to find anywhere else. I wouldnt have done it if I had been funding them continuing, but it was unravelling fast by the time I got him out

 

[EQUIDAE]

Ahh bless, rose tinted glasses at their finest. The meatman isn't a slaughterer, he buys horses cheap who may or may not end up at slaughter. If you want a quick and humane death, book the vet or hunt to dispatch your horse at home.

I think this view is a bit rose tinted too - some people are crippled by vets bills (not covered by the insurance) and cannot afford to pay to have the horse PTS and removed. When my horse passed it cost £380 just for disposal of the carcass without factoring in the PTS cost. As much as you budget for unexpected vets bills (and paying by payment plan at the vets), actual euthnasia is costly. Many hunts now can't/won't take horses due to not needing them any more - so that option is limited too, some charge as much as a vet/removal service would be. Even when you are insured, some policies do not cover euthenasia and removal costs.

If someone is taking a horse that is only suitable for euthenasia - then that is what you expect. You don't expect them to be sold on, but it happens.

A mare I had in for backing was 'rescued' from the slaughter house by a charity as she was a very well bred TB and they saw £££ with rehab. Turns out that the mare had a incorrectly healed fractured pelvis, SI problems, kissing spines (4 vertebre), a fracture to the poll and a fractured eye socket. They tried and tried to 'rehab' and rehome her. She put one adopter in hospital and another never even attempted to ride her - instead choosing to PTS as they actually had her xrayed (previously she had been seen by a 'back person').

I'm sure the owners who sent her to the slaughterhouse knew she would never be ridden again or even field sound and chose to do the right thing. Sadly the slaughterhouse bowed to a kindly neighbours advice and passed her on to the charity

 

[EQUIDAE]

Frankie came from a similar "rescue" They were living on a rented yard, paid for with housing benefit, and getting horses from the meat man on a sale or return basis, and then rehoming them for a donation. It all went horribly wrong when they fell out with the landlord and didnt pay the meat man.

Frankie didnt actually come from the meat man but was gifted to them from his old owners who couldnt afford to keep him. He was only there 3 weeks when I got him. I went and picked him up at 3pm, and found a yard full of horses not mucked out, having been stood in from the night before, and loads more out in a field full of foggage and ragwort.

My "donation" for him was £500, which for a 2yr old 13.2/3hh cob in the North East, was over the odds. He also came with a fake passport, which added another £100 to his cost! The only reason I even considered it, is because I'd been watching it all unfold on Facebook, and I could see Frankie was exactly what I wanted and hadnt been able to find anywhere else. I wouldnt have done it if I had been funding them continuing, but it was unravelling fast by the time I got him out

I thought it was the same place until you said the north east

 

[Pearlsasinger]

A responsible owner makes sure that;
a) they can afford to do the right thing at the end of the horse's life. If their insurance policy wont cover it, they need an additional fund
b) they (or someone they know well and trust) is present when their horse is pts

If people wish to make a living through buying cheap horses from auctions and selling them on, either to a licensed slaughterhouse or to someone else who wishes to buy them, that is just a matter of business. It does take an experienced knowledgeable horseperson to pick out the potential from a low end auction but it can certainly be done, and has been done many times.

 

[EQUIDAE]

A responsible owner makes sure that;
a) they can afford to do the right thing at the end of the horse's life. If their insurance policy wont cover it, they need an additional fund
b) they (or someone they know well and trust) is present when their horse is pts

Good grief - you can't budget for every eventuality and sometimes people get stung. How many people even know if their policy covers euthenasia and removal - my friend didn't. And this was after a £8,000 vets bill that the insurance company refused to pay. There simply was no more money left - she had £6,000 covered by savings, but finding that extra £2000 meant that there was nothing left for the £500 to have the horse PTS and removed

There are threads after threads where people have had their horse PTS and haven't been there - some people just do not have the disposition to deal with it (I'm not one of them but I wouldn't condemn them for not being able to handle it).

 

[Stockers]

I'd beg, borrow, or sell my worldly goods to ensure that I had control over the euthenasia of my horse. I don;t think the tone of this thread condems anyone who wasn;t present at the end - my YO stayed with mine - just those who 'sell' on and remove themselves from the responsibility nof the death - both financially and emotionally.

In the grand scheme of horse ownership and the financial pressure that comes with it, if you can;t stump up £500 to have your horse humanely PTS you probably weren't in a financial position to have one in the first place.

 

[9tails]

Like Stockers I will get the money from somewhere to euthanase my horse on my property before I ever shipped her off to an auction or slaughterhouse. It doesn't matter whether I'm in debt for the rest of my life as long as my horse has the best possible death.

 

[twiggy2]

If you want to be sure your horse has been put to sleep make sure you are witness to this. Selling to meat man as others have said is not necessarily going to mean your horse will be put to sleep, just means you have sold your horse on.

I have no problem with the fact but they are shot not put to sleep

 

[twiggy2]

This comment is a bit unfair. Meat men get a lot of abuse for their profession when they just do what everyone else is and making a living by providing a service. There are some truly compassionate slaughterers who don't enjoy their job but do it because it's required. Not all meat men are heartless murderers who just want a blood fix or a few quid.

I am not slating slaughter men at all, dealers who deal in horses for meat do it for a few quid. A slaughter man and a dealer who deals in horses for meat are 2 very different things.
loading/transporting/unloading at a place that smells of death and fear/being driven through the holding pens/shoots before being dispatched can never be classed as a quick and humane death.
A quick death is a wander to the nearest suitable place and shot or PTS, a humane death is one with as little stress and suffering as possible in my eyes.

 

[twiggy2]

I think this view is a bit rose tinted too - some people are crippled by vets bills (not covered by the insurance) and cannot afford to pay to have the horse PTS and removed. When my horse passed it cost £380 just for disposal of the carcass without factoring in the PTS cost. As much as you budget for unexpected vets bills (and paying by payment plan at the vets), actual euthnasia is costly. Many hunts now can't/won't take horses due to not needing them any more - so that option is limited too, some charge as much as a vet/removal service would be. Even when you are insured, some policies do not cover euthenasia and removal costs.

If someone is taking a horse that is only suitable for euthenasia - then that is what you expect. You don't expect them to be sold on, but it happens.

A mare I had in for backing was 'rescued' from the slaughter house by a charity as she was a very well bred TB and they saw £££ with rehab. Turns out that the mare had a incorrectly healed fractured pelvis, SI problems, kissing spines (4 vertebre), a fracture to the poll and a fractured eye socket. They tried and tried to 'rehab' and rehome her. She put one adopter in hospital and another never even attempted to ride her - instead choosing to PTS as they actually had her xrayed (previously she had been seen by a 'back person').

I'm sure the owners who sent her to the slaughterhouse knew she would never be ridden again or even field sound and chose to do the right thing. Sadly the slaughterhouse bowed to a kindly neighbours advice and passed her on to the charity

£380 would not break a home and for a humane quick death you find the money after all you wont have the upkeep of the horse so will be saving money long term

 

[OWLIE185]

Owning a horse is a responsibility and I do not have a problem with people not being able to be present at the humane dispatch of their horse, however when someone takes on a horse they should ensure they have the financial reserves to finance the humane dispatch of their horse(s) if and when the situation occurs.

 

[EQUIDAE]

£380 would not break a home and for a humane quick death you find the money after all you wont have the upkeep of the horse so will be saving money long term

Sometimes it's not just that though is it? You are misunderstanding what I said - that £380 I paid was for removal only, not euthanasia as well. Not, like my friend who 'only' had £6000 savings, the additional £2500 needed.

People make a decision that they feel is best and who are we to criticise them? It's a hard hard decision anyway - why make people feel bad for it? The owner thinks they are going to be pts - not everyone is as savvy (suspicious) as the folk on here.