Can you make a horse more careful?

[muddy_grey]

I took my girl out to s show today. Although she is 7 she has done very little show wise and even less on grass. A friend was running the show so I went along and jumped a bigger course at the end (1-1.05m not huge). She behaved beautifully and was super chilled.

I have trouble seeing a stride on this horse and it is something I am working on. I have regular lessons and will ask on Tuesday, but thought I would ask here. We had a couple of dodgy shots which I completely forgive, but I have never known a horse be so unbothered by knocking a fence. She has the ability and was amazing over the oxers, but she just won't respect uprights! It is really starting to get to me. I am not a complete numpty and have jumped competitively up to 1m20 and used to work for a SJ as a teenager. I had an amazing horse and know I can't replace him, but I am getting a bit disheartened.

Other horses I have ridden/ owned were upset by knocking fences and would buck or jump the next fence huge, but she just doesn't seem to care! She is a laid back horse so I understand that it is her temperament to an extent but are there any nice ways to make her more careful? She has a great backend and always has them in front. I know of various techniques that are used, but they aren't nice and I would rather sell her than go down that route.

I was thinking of taking her XC schooling and seeing if solid fences help. I am going to get a professional friend to jump her too to make sure I'm not doing anything. But anything else you can think of? She is a lovely horse and is a star in other respects so I would really like to sort this.

 

[PorkChop]

For me the fact that she was forgiving on the take off point, so to speak, would far out way the fact that she might have an odd fence down. However I do believe that all horses technique can be improved and I expect that this would help her to be more supple and correct over a fence. You are obviously experienced so I apologise for teaching you to suck eggs. I would imagine taking her over solid fences would make her less careful because she will be able to give them a knock and they will not fall down.

 

[Goldenstar]

I bought J as a five yo he had done some BE90's.
But his SJ record was not great (being ironic it was very poor )
When I saw him jump at my home before I bought he showed no inclination to clear the fences .
When I tried him some time later if was not better .
J was a heart decision , head would made another one .
Now I have taken three years and retrained him , and spent a lot of money sorting out his teeth and a lot of time on his feet and on physio to sort his asymmetry .
During this time I have been relearning how to jump.
He now rarely hits a fence we still have the odd stop that's our work In Progress but he's really changed .
His technique is completely different the last load of stills I have of him show good foreleg technique and he's very good behind ( that came soonest ).
I have worked a lot at home with a BE accredited trainer , it been flat , work pole small grids endlessly . I have spent a lot of time and of course money with a good dressage trainer .
We have really developed his strength and his focus ( his big issue ) and a well balanced canter .
I had no time constraints ( good job really ) I wanted a horse who needed lots of time at home as I was in no place myself to go and complete .
The BE trainer told at the start you transform a horses technique and she was right you can .
However the limit of my ambition is jump say a metre you would not have risked it on a horse you wanted to go on .
And the time scale has been a bit ridiculous but that's was about me too.

 

[smja]

In my admittedly limited experience, I've found that you can improve a horse's technique, so they're less likely to have a pole, but you cannot make them 'careful' - they either are or aren't.

 

[HotToTrot]

I'd say V poles on a fence, bounces and grids will help. There was a good article on Vittoria Pannizon; she builds up to a grid of oxers, then moves the back and front rails of the oxers out, such that the distance between them gets shorter (so the horse has to stay condensed) but the oxers get wider (so the horse has to stretch over the fence). My trainer had me come in trot to a cross, short canter stride to an upright, canter stride to an over. That got mine pinging up.

 

[TarrSteps]

It depends why the horse is having the rails. If there is a hole in the riding/training, weakness etc then yes, those things can be improved. If everything is going right but, in a pinch, the horse is happy to have the rail down, then that is trickier to address.

Every horse is a combination of chicken and lion and i think that balance is largely innate. But since you need both sometimes you have to accept compromise. A knowledgeable jumping trainer should be able to help and, if you are doing that kind of work you will need someone to help you on the ground to adjust fences, distances etc

 

[Goldenstar]

You defiantly need good eyes on the ground to help such horses and pole movers .

 

[TarrSteps]

I find jumping alone also makes me inclined, even subconsciously, to stay in the comfort zone and 'ride to leave the rails up' which is exactly what you DON'T want to be doing with one that's not bothered. I'm not saying you want to trap the horse or intentionally ride it badly, but you do want it to learn and learning involves making mistakes and mistakes jumping often involve rails. Which is a pain if you have to get on and off, even before you get into adjusting distances, squaring boxers etc. With a super chilled one you're often better off jumping a bit less but pushing the envelope.

 

[cundlegreen]

Are you jumping plastic poles and /or with boots on? Both would be a no no for me. My mare knows instantly whether she's jumping plastic or wooden poles (don't ask me how) and won't touch a wooden pole but can be casual about plastic. She has amazing front leg technique and regularly hits her stud girth, so its just a case of disrespect.

 

[TarrSteps]

Plastic poles are the work of the devil.

 

[Ditchjumper2]

We used to teach ours over telegraph poles on jump wings...they were very careful!!

 

[cundlegreen]

Plastic poles are the work of the devil.

Love it!

We used to teach ours over telegraph poles on jump wings...they were very careful!!

that's what I do.

 

[mandwhy]

Mine has absolutely no respect for wooden poles either, just ploughs right through them, even stops to paw the whole lot down!! I am interested in people's suggestions on this. I know that she will probably be better over solid jumps but eek, I would like to see her go over them before I'm on her!

 

[sammiea]

Plastic poles are the work of the devil.

They aren't any more with jump 4 joys "super heavy poles" even my hubby cant carry 2 at a time!

 

[muddy_grey]

Thanks for all the replies.

No plastic poles here, though apparently a few rotten ones. I took the boots off and threw caution to the wind in my lesson today.

Instructor thinks she is careful, just a bit dim/anxious as well (may have been a few harsh words for me in there too!). We did poles and a small jump in the indoor and she was fine then we went out on the grass and it all went a bit dodgy and green. So we went round once with a boot it and ignore attitude and she had a couple down, but at least we were moving. I need to think less.

Then repeated the same course with a bit more control and she was much better. For whatever reason I have never really clicked with her (I broke her in). She is a lovely horse, but so laid back and I feel like a complete numpty on her!

Her technique is pretty good, but maybe she is lacking in confidence/match practice especially on different surfaces. I am still not convinced that she is careful by nature, but fingers crossed we can lesson the impact of that. She tries to jump the fences, just doesn't seem to mind if she hits it if that makes sense.

But then she squeezed passed a tarmac lorry yesterday without a second glance so maybe I have to live with the trade off.

 

[PorkChop]

That's great that it may be that she needs to get out and about more, and do more jumping on grass, she does sound like a lovely mare

 

[smja]

She tries to jump the fences, just doesn't seem to mind if she hits it if that makes sense.

This is exactly like my horse. He'll do his utmost to take off, and will try to leave them up in general, but if a pole comes down he's not actually bothered by it. He's better at comps/in group lessons where there's some atmosphere, at home he can be very blasé. Not sure how much of this is me, though! If I wanted to pure sj, I'd be concerned, but he loves xc and has done wonders for my confidence, so he's still in credit

 

[Becky.tinnion]

No boots and wooden poles. And a trick I learnt if they are constantly catching the front pole of a spread raise it higher that the back, only do it with a helper and just a couple times but really helped my boy lift his shoulders up more and not get too close

 

[canteron]

I had a horse who had very little awareness of his feet and would trip over his own feet, blunder through fences, etc, and not really care. I have spent lots of time money and energy (and had a lot of fun) retraining him But one thing I did find made a huge difference was taking his shoes off - he then seemed to understand where he feet where and where he was putting them.

There were other reasons for going barefoot (he has great feet) and it may well not suit your horse, but I seem to remember that the horse who won the puissance at Olympia last year was barefoot (?) so I am in good company!