Cannot believe it is not illegal for horses to be sold to slaughterhouses!

I appreciate that in some cases it is the lesser of two evils to have a horse killed then prolong its suffering but when you care for animals i believe you will try to save them anyway how even if it is to give them a few years of happiness if at all possible. Im trying my best to save this pony and have every intention of trying to rescue more and continue trying to prevent these poor horses suffering a horrible death through no fault of their own and if people can not understand why i think its wrong, then thats fine but im just going to keep plugging away :)!
 
Eugh!All completely sick.Its so sad,also would like to make a point,the same fate comes to many livestock animals FOR US TO EAT.But no one cares becasue its not a horse.Poeple need to stop breeding horses!But theres many people who breed,but wouldnt sell to the meatman.It also comes down to vile idivdual ''people'' :mad:
 
frankie8 said:
I don't think the thought of any horse, especially youngstock, going to slaughter will sit well with anyone that uses this forum, however I do feel it is the lesser of two evils.
As others have said, a horse being humanly slaghtered is better than a life of neglect. I have recently come back from Ireland (we have friends involved in animal rescue over there) and have seen first hand some of the very sad horse cases as a result of neglect. Sadly there are very few rescue spaces available and the horse that get the spaces are the lucky ones.
Currently, there are more horses than good homes and this is the problem that has to be dealt with initially. I agree that long term the way to tackle this is responsible breeding and owner education, but to prevent a life of suffering to these horses at present,I feel humane slaughter is the option.
Well done OP for helping the pony, I'm sure you will offer a lovely, safe home :)
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A very good point.More horses than good homes.People should stop breeding horses especially now money is getting bad.Its a neverending circle:(
 
The meatman is merely there to clean up after our mistakes, i dont hate him for that.....I hate the fact there is to much back yard breeding, too much over breeding ie the new forest and dartmoor hill ponies. If slaughter over here was banned, then imagine the trauma as more and more end up shipped to ireland then over to france and so on. I thought we all hated that x
 
"There are worse things than being dead" - A quote that has stayed with me forever.....

And for me, a horse or pony destined for a life of endless abuse or being passed from sale to sale is indeed worse than being dead..... personally I have such horses PTS at home as i would rather that than not knowing, but each to their own.
 
kirstinw55 said:
Im trying my best to save this pony and have every intention of trying to rescue more and continue trying to prevent these poor horses suffering a horrible death through no fault of their own and if people can not understand why i think its wrong, then thats fine but im just going to keep plugging away :)!
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Very noble but what happens if your situation changes and you can no longer afford to buy or even care for the animals you already have? What will you do, put them down at home or sell them when they might end up in the same place?

It's naive to think it shouldn't happen or you can stop the animals going to market or being slaughtered. As others have said, there are worse things for horses than death, even if they are only young and because you paid double whack, that means he can go and buy more, you've added to the misery for some even if it was with the best of intentions.

BTW, if it's put down in this country, it won't be a horrible death although what it has already been through is horrible.
 
Maesfen said:
Very noble but what happens if your situation changes and you can no longer afford to buy or even care for the animals you already have? What will you do, put them down at home or sell them when they might end up in the same place?

It's naive to think it shouldn't happen or you can stop the animals going to market or being slaughtered. As others have said, there are worse things for horses than death, even if they are only young and because you paid double whack, that means he can go and buy more, you've added to the misery for some even if it was with the best of intentions.

BTW, if it's put down in this country, it won't be a horrible death although what it has already been through is horrible.
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Well even if i can make a difference to one horses life i'll take some solace from that.
 
kirstinw55 said:
I appreciate that in some cases it is the lesser of two evils to have a horse killed then prolong its suffering but when you care for animals i believe you will try to save them anyway how even if it is to give them a few years of happiness if at all possible. Im trying my best to save this pony and have every intention of trying to rescue more and continue trying to prevent these poor horses suffering a horrible death through no fault of their own and if people can not understand why i think its wrong, then thats fine but im just going to keep plugging away
:)!
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Having four rescue dogs,who's alternative fate would have been to be destroyed, I very much understand why you feel it's wrong. Any animal being destroyed through human ignorence doesn't sit well with me either. We too try to do our bit to save these animals and offer them a life free from suffering and pain, be it only a few years.
But what makes me feel worse is these horses going from home to home to experience years of neglect when a swift humane end was possible.
 
The meat man isn't the enemy, the idiot who neglects the horse in the first place is.

I have been to a well known slaughter house in the UK and I must say it is very quick, quiet, and humane. The horses have fields to graze in beforehand and they all seem quite relaxed. Obviously there is a huge issue with traveling conditions for horses that are transported to France, Italy etc. But banning slaughterhouses would just increase the problem, as is seen in the USA, with horrific conditions horses are transported in to travel across the border into Mexico.

Glad that you have given this pony another chance, however as someone has said...you have just given the meat man enough money to buy 2 more ponies. I would much rather a horse go for meat than live a life of neglect.

People need to stop indiscriminate breeding, there are not enough good homes for all of the horses unfortunately...the meat man is just there to pick up the mess.
 
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its simple stop breeding crap no one wants or can afford !!!
how many of us have heard
'oooh id like a foal off her when shes retired as shes sooo lovely '
only then to be left with a over humanized thug they cant control which is then sent to auction !!!!!
( before anyone cares to shoot me - i know this isn't always the case !!)

if they have to be destroyed get it done properly and with respect for the animal - whatever the animal sheep, pig, cow, chickens or horses !!!!
 
Spudlet said:
It is better for a horse to be humanely slaughtered at the nearest available slaughterhouse than neglected, abandoned or transported for thousands of miles before being slaughtered. Although the idea of a horse of any age being slaughtered may be uncomfortable, the idea of what I just said happening makes me feel far more uncomfortable. Slaughterhouses provide a service - they are necessary.
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Agree with this statement.
 
kickandshout said:
its simple stop breeding crap no one wants or can afford !!!
how many of us have heard
'oooh id like a foal off her when shes retired as shes sooo lovely '
only then to be left with a over humanized thug they cant control which is then sent to auction !!!!!
( before anyone cares to shoot me - i know this isn't always the case !!)

if they have to be destroyed get it done properly and with respect for the animal - whatever the animal sheep, pig, cow, chickens or horses !!!!
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agree with this also. too many people breeding from sub standard horses.
 
While any of mine that need to be put down are done by the kennels at home this is not the case for all, there should be stricter laws about horses being exported for salughter, but for horses that need to be put down and do not have a saviour then slaughter is not the worst that can happen think about the emaciated horses dumped recently slaughter would have been welcome.

What i do strongly believe is that commomners grazing rights should be revoked if they consistently produce inferior stock that sell at auction for a tiny amount.

I believe there are grazing rights in the new forrest wales dartmoor exmoor the fells, all these places have an excess of inferior ponies bred that are sold for a pittance at market most do not resemble the breed so are not helping to preserve it.

Now any of us who decided to breed horses would have to own a place to do so or rent so would pay a premium for land also it would not really be excepted to not look after or handle any youngstock, and they would have to make a certain amount to make it viable.

For some reason these people are given grazing rights alot of the time the stock is not looked after or handled in some cases they dont have to passport before sale as the rest of us do, and sometimes receive goverment grants.

Who does this benifit not the breed of any of these ponies not the public or pony buyers certainly not the ponies, just because the commoners have always had grazing rights to do this does not mean it should continue as a tradition.
Lets face it they used to drown women they thought were witches but we dont still do this.

There is a good market for well bred native ponies so it makes it even more of a disgrace that people who have grazing rights for free are allowed to breed in this way not look after their stock be encouraged to do this then sell for sometimes a few guineas. and even worse thier are charities helping such the like as the dartmoor ponies while it is nice they are why not put a stop to it all.

The traffic for unwanted ponies trawling the markets that make nothing would drop a hell of a lot if this was put to a stop.
 
mymare said:
Do you mean pts or abattoir?
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Either way with respect but obviously its not for meat trade if its pts.

not all slaughterhouses show any thought for the animal try a few of the animal welfare videos for evidence.
the most recent one i viewed (wished i hadnt) was at a pig farm. barbaric !!!!

i know slaughterman have to learn their trade somehow. but if it was my animal id want a quick end with a professional person to do it.
 
always blue said:
agree with this also. Too many people breeding from sub standard horses.
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When my mare was diagosed with arthritis at the age of 7, partly due to her conformation. When we thought she may not get sound enough to do much with her, the equine vet, who also owns a horse, suggested breeding from her. Great idea!!! Needles to say, we deicided not to.
 
kirstinw55 said:
In my opinion tho cows and sheep do not have the same affectionate value a person shares with their horse!!
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These are emotions that we humans put on horses. I agree that its sad to see a horse go to slaughter, but its no worse than cows or sheep. I would hate this to happen to my horse, but thats because of emotions I have. I would have the same emotion for a cow if i cared for it every day. It wouldnt stop me eating steak.

OP - If you agree that slaughter can be the lesser of 2 evils, then surely you'd be better off trying to rescue abused, neglected horses.

Its also harsh but true, the slaughter man does now have money to buy 2 more.
 
kirstinw55 said:
In my opinion tho cows and sheep do not have the same affectionate value a person shares with their horse! Sure some people would disagree with that but that is just what i believe, and of course lamb and beef is a huge trade in our country but would like to think its extremely unheard of for anyone to eat horse in england!
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Oh dear....

Every animal deserves to be treated with dignity and compassion regardless of thirty breed or purpose. As comented elsewhere, overbreeding will result in little scraps like this ending up with the meetman, and better this than a life of neglect. I guess you must have deep pockets and lots of land in order to save all those destined for slaughter....

But that aside, good luck with your new youngster. He sounds lucky to have found you.
 
paisley said:
Well, lets imagine it is illegal to sell horses to slaughterhouses. Thats not going to stop the irresponsible uncaring idiots who breed and then neglect these horses.

It would simply mean a heck of a lot more unwanted horses suffering a piddle poor quality of life.

And a lovely example of no abattoir for horses can be seen in America, where they either truck then for days for the grimest of ends in Mexico, or they end up dumped on roadsides
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Hear, hear !!!
 
kirstinw55 said:
. A few phone calls later the meat-man agreed to sell me him for twice the price he payed for him! answer?!
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One of the reasons poor stock are sold through auctions is that people feel sorry for them and buy them at inflated prices.
For what you paid for this animal you could have bought a nice animal that someone had fed,wormed etc with a known history. By buying an animal that someone has just flung in a field and spent no money on its care you are prepetuating the problem. Why would any one care for them when they can get good money by neglecting them?
If they did not sell or there was very little money to be made from them they would stop breeding them.Unfortuately it is a commen problem.
http://www.saddlesoap.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=65671.0
http://www.saddlesoap.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=65641.0
 
TBH, as a regular at York, those that sell for slaughter are luckier than the ones bought by some of the low end dealers that frequent the auction, those horses just get dragged around from auction to auction. Those ones are ill treated and generally end up going for slaughter after being dragged around from sale to sale, dealer to dealer, although some may be lucky and find a good home eventually.

Echoing Trinity Fox, be careful if you decide to rescue more! We had our own land and stables and made our own hay, we had 6 horses originally and that increased to 13 with the 7 'sympathy' buys from York (to save them from slaughter). They are all nice horses, all had problems, mainly behavioural and emaciation, and a couple were bought for a fraction of their worth had they been 100%. Our circumstances changed dramatically, we now have 13 in livery and our hay bill is over £100 pw through winter plus a substantial amount spent on feed for the horses, vets bills, wormers etc etc.........it never ends!

TF, we have bought 3 county standard section A youngsters from York sales, bred by a stud that seems to sell all their stock at York after being unable to sell them at inflated prices on their website. Knowing what we have paid makes me wonder how/why they carry on breeding, but they still keep sending them. They have ponies at almost every sale, all have nearly always had high placings or won at the big county shows such as Royal Welsh and Great Yorkshire (so spend the money travelling and entering such shows), travel a fair way to the sale and yet sell for a pittance.
 
To the "stop breeding crap" I would add, "stop making crap". If a horse has a physical, behavioural, or training issue get it fixed, or you're drastically increasing the chances it will end up in a bad situation. I always say good training is health insurance for horses because if it can be useful, even as a hack or companion, someone is more likely to want it and take care of it.

While it is true we have too many horses, we also seem to have a lot of horses that don't get sold even though there are people looking. Of course, it's not that simple and there are many reasons horses end up in trouble but it's also sometimes the case that "rescued" horses eventually end up in trouble again because people over extend themselves and either can't give them enough time or end up bankrupt/having to sell later.

If you can save one or two or whatever and give them a good life, that's fantastic and admirable. But I'd rather see someone take on one and keep it properly than take on four and not be able to do right by them.
 
TarrSteps said:
To the "stop breeding crap" I would add, "stop making crap". If a horse has a physical, behavioural, or training issue get it fixed, or you're drastically increasing the chances it will end up in a bad situation. I always say good training is health insurance for horses because if it can be useful, even as a hack or companion, someone is more likely to want it and take care of it.

While it is true we have too many horses, we also seem to have a lot of horses that don't get sold even though there are people looking. Of course, it's not that simple and there are many reasons horses end up in trouble but it's also sometimes the case that "rescued" horses eventually end up in trouble again because people over extend themselves and either can't give them enough time or end up bankrupt/having to sell later.

If you can save one or two or whatever and give them a good life, that's fantastic and admirable. But I'd rather see someone take on one and keep it properly than take on four and not be able to do right by them.
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I agree with this completely, it is the point i was trying to make about taking on so many. You never know what is around the corner! Our vets bills for each of the 'rescued' horses were considerable to get them back to health, fortunately this wasn't an issue at the time but we just wouldn't have been able to manage them now to that level. The hours put in to sort out behavioural problems were also considerable, again I just wouldn't have that amount of time now. It is also very hard work caring for multiple horses compared to just one as so many people on here can testify.
 
there would be a hell of a lot more suffering in the horse world without the meat man, he is the very best answer for so many horses and ponies. Sorry, you have a very naive outlook. sm x
 
kirstinw55 said:
In my opinion tho cows and sheep do not have the same affectionate value a person shares with their horse! Sure some people would disagree with that but that is just what i believe, and of course lamb and beef is a huge trade in our country but would like to think its extremely unheard of for anyone to eat horse in england!
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A visit to a cattle slaughter house may persuade you to become a vegetarian sooner than you think!

Sorry OP, but you have just added to the problem. If more people went round buying horses off the meat man for double the price it would just increase the price of these animals and tempt more people to breed them.
 
If we didn't have the meatmen we would be overrun with horses and ponies dumped on wasteland, and left to starve, or dumped under tarps and left to die like that poor little mite in the news.
Like it or not the slaughterhouse is a valuble service for this country we CANNOT afford to lose- just one look at the crisis in america where slaughter houses were banned and horses are now shipped hundreds of miles to mexico to meet a barbaric end - how can that be right?
The rose tinted fluffy bunny view on horse slaughter is DANGEROUS and people need to seriously pack it in and think out of the box on welfare grounds.
Breeding should be more tightly regulated but there still needs to be a place to go for those horses that will never make a decent riding animal, they are large expensive creatures and not everyone can afford to keep them as pets you know..
 
LizzieJ said:
Should it be illegal for cows and sheep to go to slaughter?
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Exactly what I thought. Horses are lucky that we favour them above most of the other herbivores and generally treat them differently in this country. Cows are just as intelligent and full of character. I don't see any difference between a horse and a cow which is why I don't eat meat.
 
i hate to think about horse slaughter . However i cant think of any alternative. i personally cant afford to stand at the gates buying up these horses and giving them all a long and happy life ..... and i dont know of any other folk who can.
The side effects of the push for perfection at the top means a lot of surpluss at the lower end of the market.
This year all the horse charities were besieged with requests for help for horses suffering a worse fate than death. horse slaughter is a necessary evil.
 
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