Cement yard into manege?

[planete]

Is it possible to use a cement floor as a base for a riding surface or is the idea bonkers? VERY theoritical question but I feel I have to investigate the possibility. Many thanks for any replies not shooting me down in flames!

 

[meesha]

I would say not, won't drain and the surface will slip on top, normally you would have the fluffy white membrane between stone and riding surface.

Youi might get lucky if yard has natural run off and you can make membrane stick to concrete (assume u mean concrete not cement)

Wonder if it's possible to get it rubber matted instead so u can ride on it (not had coffee yet so that might be bonkers idea and mats would need to be well bolted down and they might still be slippy or trippy)

 

[Barton Bounty]

I also would say no, I agree with @meesha about the drainage too, it would need to be very deep for any comfort at all, however membrane and rubber may work…

 

[SantaVera]

Interesting idea if there's a slight slope then it should drain and a suitable topping should absorb impact, rubber maybe? Wouldn't have thought it would be suitable for jumping though. Most of us trot on roads so I would have thought trotting or cantering on a suitable topping would be less damaging than that. In fact, going back to roads, I read somewhere that cantering on roads has proved to be no more damaging than trotting, sorry I've lost the link to this paper. I think slipping is the issue with road cantering rather than excess concussion.

 

[ycbm]

Inside, yes I had no problem creating a rideable surface on a concrete base. Outdoors I would think it would be much more difficult to get it to drain. I might ask a professional installer if it's feasible though. I have seen arenas built on tennis courts and tarmac is used as a base sometimes, though that's obviously very different from concrete.


ETA dredging up a memory from the very distance past I realise that I've seen one built on a cattle yard. It was created by building block walls about 18 inches high and filling it up. The bottom layers were presumably grades of stone like normal. There was a ramp to get up onto it.
.

 

[Tiddlypom]

No drainage, so couldn't work. Heavy rain will wash the surface away, the water has got to go somewhere.

It would work as a base for a covered arena though.

 

[SEL]

If money is no object then I'm sure jelka mats could go down with topping on them. But probably cheaper to build an arena

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

If money is no object then I'm sure jelka mats could go down with topping on them. But probably cheaper to build an arena

I believe that the German manufacturers of mud control mats also market rideable mats.

 

[cauda equina]

I wonder if they would work on concrete though - rubber mats on grass are probably a lot more stable than on concrete

 

[Orangehorse]

How about when a surface is put down for an indoor show, like the Horse of the Year Show at the NEC for instance?
I have always wondered how it is done on a solid floor.

 

[ycbm]

Thread contains advice about outdoor too.

Laying an indoor surface on concrete

So, we are currently house hunting and looking at properties that have buildings of a suitable size to convert to an indoor (I’m told it’s pretty essential for winter over here). My question is, quite a few of the buildings have concrete floors. I’m thinking along the lines of obviously they...

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[toppedoff]

I can tell you right now I haven't slept and can prove that by saying I read cement yard as cemetery yard

 

[blitznbobs]

If you can make it an indoor it will work well

 

[abbijay]

Yes you can do it but not just by putting surface on top of the concrete slab (I'm assuming that's what you meant by cement)
Rather than the traditional excavation down and put sub base in you would need to form small retaining walls and infill on top of it with drainage, membrane, etc then add the surface. I would look to get a professional arena contractor out to price and give you an idea.
I'm a construction professional but not a QS so I don't know how the price would compare to digging out soft ground and paying for disposal of earth but it would definitely be cheaper than breaking out the existing slab if that were the alternative.

 

[Landcruiser]

I have seen both indoor and outdoor ones on concrete bases. I used to livery on a big yard which had an outdoor, loads of people doing jumping on it. It seemed to work, and I don't remember issues with surface being washed off. The whole thing was slightly above ground level so presumably just drained off the edges, which were boarded. Sand and rubber surface, I think. The indoor one is at a yard near me, inside a big converted barn. Used for all sorts, clinics, demos, jumping.

 

[planete]

Sorry, concrete of course. Many thanks for all the replies. So, raised surface with drainage, retaining low boards/walls and the right depth and type of surface could well work. No room for error financially so need to go into costs next and maybe find an arena specialist. All pie in the sky at the moment but planning for the future.

 

[little_critter]

Be careful, a horse I know jarred its shoulders and ultimately retired after being jumped (unknowingly at the time) on a surface laid over concrete.

 

[doodle]

There was a yard local that in the past was a grain shed in the summer and an indoor arena in the winter. Surface was lifted and stored over the summer then put back down.

 

[Nasicus]

I was at a place that boasted an 'indoor school'. It was surface over concrete, never rode it myself but it was slippy and the YM came off once and shattered her elbow as it went right through the surface and into the concrete. Was swiftly lifted and removed after that.

 

[blitznbobs]

I was at a place that boasted an 'indoor school'. It was surface over concrete, never rode it myself but it was slippy and the YM came off once and shattered her elbow as it went right through the surface and into the concrete. Was swiftly lifted and removed after that.

This is a case of not enough surface. I have now build several arenas and before the surface goes on the subbase would always be a disaster to fall on… limestone or granite in lumps is not exactly soft.

 

[Esmae]

A friend has done this. You can only ride in walk on it. They turn out on it sometimes and the horses have slipped several times. It is lethal as whatever goes on the top slips when pressure goes on it. If it were mine I would break the concrete up and then go from there and take lots of advice.

 

[planete]

I would really like to investigate any existing ones thoroughly for safety before trying to build one, I have no intention of risking horses or humans limbs , don't worry. For now, it is enough to know it can be done successfully if done well.

 

[Mari]

We bought a place with a huge (100’ x 50’) building that had been used for building horse boxes. (Sadly they didn’t leave one). It had a concrete floor. We put down tons & tons of sharp sand & when we mucked out (4 horses) we added the wet shavings to the sand. Made a brilliant surface.

 

[maya2008]

A yard I was at once had this - the concrete base was sloping so it drained. Was held in at the sides by boards and was just sand. You would have never known. YO had horses jumping up to 1m40 on it with no issues.

 

[ycbm]

We bought a place with a huge (100’ x 50’) building that had been used for building horse boxes. (Sadly they didn’t leave one). It had a concrete floor. We put down tons & tons of sharp sand & when we mucked out (4 horses) we added the wet shavings to the sand. Made a brilliant surface.

That's what my barn ended up as, but I started off with pine bark, which smelt fabulous for a year and stuck to the floor like glue! I added sand when it got thin, then mucked out all the wet shavings into it to top it up.

 

[Darbs]

Yes you can do it but not just by putting surface on top of the concrete slab (I'm assuming that's what you meant by cement)
Rather than the traditional excavation down and put sub base in you would need to form small retaining walls and infill on top of it with drainage, membrane, etc then add the surface. I would look to get a professional arena contractor out to price and give you an idea.
I'm a construction professional but not a QS so I don't know how the price would compare to digging out soft ground and paying for disposal of earth but it would definitely be cheaper than breaking out the existing slab if that were the alternative.

Definitely this.

The existing concrete would form a stable sub base, then clean drainage stone with perforated pipe laid, and the normal arena membrane and surface on top of that.