Chaff or no Chaff?

[Spring Feather]

TBH you modern feeders seem to have a very large amount of problems that we never faced when we fed straights.

No problems here. Vet comes to AI mares, tend to the odd injury and vaccinate the horses annually. I've fed straights and I've fed balancers and there's been no noticeable difference to the internal health of the horses.

 

[ester]

So what is IN your bucket? Many modern feeds once wet become a sludgy pulp which doesn't travel well through the digestive system.

An experiment I give my students to do is to put various different feeds into beakers of water and leave for 20mins, the average time food is in the stomach.

When horse and pony cubes first hit the market the cases of colic increased as people fed them on their own, they turned to sludge and got themselves jammed up in the caecum. Feeding chaff or bran (at the time) or Sugarbeet prevented this from happening.

Of course it will travel well through the digestive system, it's fibre, not sure what you are meaning.

My comment about it being just glorified straw. Why would you pay so much for this sort of mix when you can supply chaff and beet pulp at a fraction of the price?

well I thought fastfibre was the epitomy of a sludgey pulp that therefore wouldn't travel through the system (soaked pony nuts end up much the same having used them too) but sugar beet isn't wholly difference in consistency yet you think that is great as a fibre source.
Reasons for using fastfibre = dentition problems and palatability, it has other additives which make it more palatable than straw and sugar beet, mine certainly prefers it to beet and unmolassed beet doesn't work out massively cheaper without finding some straw to chop up/buying bagged.

 

[ester]

So what is IN your bucket? Many modern feeds once wet become a sludgy pulp which doesn't travel well through the digestive system.

An experiment I give my students to do is to put various different feeds into beakers of water and leave for 20mins, the average time food is in the stomach.

When horse and pony cubes first hit the market the cases of colic increased as people fed them on their own, they turned to sludge and got themselves jammed up in the caecum. Feeding chaff or bran (at the time) or Sugarbeet prevented this from happening.

I grew up in a non chaff environment. People had stopped cutting their own and chaff cutters were something referred to in old pony books however bagged chaff were not available. Apart from Spillers pony nuts it was all straights own brand from the local feed merchants.

It was when I returned to riding in the 90's after a long break that I came across molassed chaff and alfalfa for the first time.

I think the revival probably occurred when people became keen on fibre only diets and not mixes- without thinking about the molasses on it . Ours started on hi fi/sugar beet/pony nuts but have moved on since then.

 

[Tnavas]

well I thought fastfibre was the epitomy of a sludgey pulp that therefore wouldn't travel through the system (soaked pony nuts end up much the same having used them too) but sugar beet isn't wholly difference in consistency yet you think that is great as a fibre source.
Reasons for using fastfibre = dentition problems and palatability, it has other additives which make it more palatable than straw and sugar beet, mine certainly prefers it to beet and unmolassed beet doesn't work out massively cheaper without finding some straw to chop up/buying bagged.

We don't have Fast Fibre here in NZ so cannot comment on how it looks when soaked. I looked at the contents which indicate high fibre. I've never seen Sugarbeet that looks just like sludge, mine comes from the UK and when soaked you can see the shreds of beet quite clearly.

I soak my sugar beet in just enough water that it is crumbly wet not dripping, it's an invaluable fibre source, palatable, will carry meds or supplements well and spreads out the concentrate part of the ration. I feed my feeds just damp, not sloppy as the horse still needs to chew well and add saliva to the mix.

The revival - fortunate for the horse is the result of manufacturers finally realising that they are hurting our horses with their 'junk food'.

I remember when the first premises came on the market, the various contents were highly visible then, it looked pretty and smelt yummy and the feed companies used that to sell it, along with the biggest sales gimmick of only needing one feed bin, labour saving and less storage space. It sent many horses loopy as it contained grains that were totally unsuitable for a horse.

When people decide to take on a horse they need to go and learn about feeding, not just pop to the local feed store and buy the bag with the flashy dressage horse on it because they want to be a dressage rider.

The old 'Rules of Feeding' fly out the window. The most important one being

Feed according to Temperament, Condition, Work Load and I always add a bit extra to this - the ability and confidence of the rider

People go and learn to ride, learning to care for the horse is equally as important, and in this day and age it's so easy to attend evening courses on horse care. I struggle at every Pony Club rally to enthuse riders to enjoy learning about looking after their horse.

 

[Firewell]

They don't have chaff where I am in the states it doesn't exist. They feed pelleted feed, mixes or straights. Grass pellets, sugar beet (the full fat stuff, no kwick beet here), oats and rice bran are popular straights and we have balancers too.
My horse gets a fully balanced low starch pellet feed with an ulcer supplement and a joint supplement. The supplements are also pelleted, not powder as they don't have chaff.
Being English I wet my feed so it goes a bit mushy. They think that very strange! Wet feed is for old horses that dont have teeth or sugar beet .
None of the horses suffer for not having chaff, they all get lots of hay.

 

[criso]

I think the revival probably occurred when people became keen on fibre only diets and not mixes- without thinking about the molasses on it . Ours started on hi fi/sugar beet/pony nuts but have moved on since then.

Forage being the main part of diet were drummed into us at pony club it just didn't take the form of bagged chopped chaff. We fed very little bucket feed full stop, usually just a few oats when worked hard and as I said before sugarbeet in the winter if weight was needed.

The only branded feed was Spiller's pony nuts everything else was produced locally and bagged at the local feed merchants. They did do a mix they made up on site called hunters mix, god knows what was in it. I remember little milk pellets as we used to pick these out and eat them.

 

[Goldenstar]

Oh milk pellets I had forgotten about them .

 

[Tnavas]

None of the horses suffer for not having chaff, they all get lots of hay.

They won't as the Sugarbeet replaces the Chaff - they do the same job of opening the mix of concentrates and allowing it to nmove through the digestive system at a slower rate

Forage being the main part of diet were drummed into us at pony club it just didn't take the form of bagged chopped chaff. We fed very little bucket feed full stop, usually just a few oats when worked hard and as I said before sugarbeet in the winter if weight was needed.

The only branded feed was Spiller's pony nuts everything else was produced locally and bagged at the local feed merchants. They did do a mix they made up on site called hunters mix, god knows what was in it. I remember little milk pellets as we used to pick these out and eat them.

Yep - remember those days very well. If you had chaff it was because you had slogged away turning the wheel or risked your fingers pushing the hay in the chute towards the cutters.

I never fed my ponies at all, they were on a massive hillside paddock and ate grass, with 'Hay on the Stalk' to eat in winter. Yet I rode for hours on my pony sometimes as many as 40miles in a day, she did this all on grass, was fit, sleek & shiny - no supplements and lived sound as a bell into her 20's.

 

[criso]

Yep - remember those days very well. If you had chaff it was because you had slogged away turning the wheel or risked your fingers pushing the hay in the chute towards the cutters.

As I said before those had died out by then only to be referred to in old books.

 

[Firewell]

A lot of the horses don't get sugar beet though. Mine doesn't. The breeding stallion is on just sugarbeet and grass hay. The jumping stallion is on a senior pellet with a lb of oats fed dry in a bucket.
I thought it a bit strange when I got here as I was used to adding a double handful of Hifi with my horses feed and wetting it. A bowl of dry pellets looked odd to me but I'm used to it now .

 

[PolarSkye]

Sorry, I think I worded that weirdly. It's interesting to hear two anecdotes implying anticipatory salivation, and I'd love to know more but can't find any recent studies on it with a brief look...

Fellow livery's mare also salivates in anticipation of being fed her bucket feed . . . she has plenty of hay . . . but she is a real piglet when it comes to food. I had never seen it before.

P

 

[PolarSkye]

I don't know anyone who gives big starchy molassed bucket feeds any more.

I do. I am the only person at current yard who feeds a low starch, low molasses diet . . . I suspect the others think I'm a tad strange. They had never seen or heard of linseed or Copra before and think I'm nuts (pun intended) for being so anti mixes (which they feed). In the winter, the big mare's bucket feed is ridiculously full/heavy - weighed down with nuts, molassed chaff and Speedibeet. She is obese.

P

 

[ester]

Firewell I thought they didn't get much hay either as it was so rich?