Cheltenham Racing

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Elf On A Shelf

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We have 2 runners at Cheltenham tomorrow. I'm not there of course, I don't get to go to the good meetings. I've just doubled up a beach donkey Derby day at Newcastle and a hurdler at Wetherby in the last 2 days. There was no point in going all the way back up the road from Newcastle at 5pm to turn around and leave again at 4.30am with the Wetherby runner when they tracks are less than 2 hours apart and neither horse cares about being away from home.
 
splashgirl45

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A question for you Elf, why do jockeys bump on the back of the saddle when going for the finish. Paddy Brennan was so far back he was on the horses loins and I can’t understandthe reason. They almost all do the same so I assume that’s how they are taught. Words of wisdom from you please ?
 
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It's actually nothing that is taught as a specific skill, it's purely down to the jockeys throwing their arms and legs at the horse so they lose the core strength to keep them from bouncing. You rarely see flat jockeys do it as their stirrups are so short they can't really use their legs and they would come flying off. It is very much a jump jockey thing. I hate it. Its untidy and doesn't do the horse any favours. Dennis O'Reagan was shocking in the saddle in a finish but he was very effective and you need to be effective over stylish to win races.
 
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Crazy_cat_lady said:
I wish ITV wouldn't show "beach donkey derby" racing (love the phrase Elf!) When it's the jump season and there's jump meetings going on!
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It's catching on! I even have some of the mixed lot (mainly jump yards that, like us, cross to the flat with a couple) and some of the BHA staff calling it beach donkey Derby racing! I even got one random owner from someone else's yard calling it that after they stopped me to chat about Hank a couple of weeks ago whilst I was beach donkey Derby racing at Newcastle ???

Maybe I should make it my aim to get an ITV presenter to call it that live on air ???
 
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Thanks Elf, i agree with you , it must be uncomfortable for the horse, but surely theymust have good core strength to ride over jumps, if not they need to work on it for the good of the horse, I wonder how many of them have sore backs after hard finishes
 
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splashgirl45 said:
Thanks Elf, i agree with you , it must be uncomfortable for the horse, but surely theyhem end up so must have good core strength to ride over jumps, if not they need to work on it for the good of the horse, I wonder how many of them have sore backs after hard finishes
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Oh they do have core strength, it just goes to pot when they are riding a hard finish. A jockey that is far enough clear to cross the line, no matter the place, without major challenge will be at the front of their saddle, probably leaning on their knees a bit and not using theirs legs to kick or swing along the side of a horse. Those fighting tooth and nail end up messy. The horses do get sore but most will get a couple of days off after a run and no one rides like that at home so that part of the back gets the chance to settle down and fix.
 
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splashgirl45 said:
A question for you Elf, why do jockeys bump on the back of the saddle when going for the finish. Paddy Brennan was so far back he was on the horses loins and I can’t understandthe reason. They almost all do the same so I assume that’s how they are taught. Words of wisdom from you please ?
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I was going to ask Elf that! I don’t like PB anyway but I hated seeing that.
 
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Crazy_cat_lady said:
Al Roc 23rd race of the year and this is a staying chase, is that fair on the horse?
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Utterly stupid and greedy of the owners. And I'm not fully blaming the owners as the trainer could put a hold on the runs too. I had a quick look, the horse has been in consistent racing work since September 2021 when he had his first run back from wind surgery. Which means he has probably been in solid work without more than a day off a week since June 2021 minimum. It's one thing for a 5-8 furlong horse to so that as a race is just a bit of work with prize money to them but it's another for a staying chaser to do it. I would hope the BHA will look into this and his last couple of runs where he hasn't done anything and is obviously tired.
 
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Elf On A Shelf said:
Utterly stupid and greedy of the owners. And I'm not fully blaming the owners as the trainer could put a hold on the runs too. I had a quick look, the horse has been in consistent racing work since September 2021 when he had his first run back from wind surgery. Which means he has probably been in solid work without more than a day off a week since June 2021 minimum. It's one thing for a 5-8 furlong horse to so that as a race is just a bit of work with prize money to them but it's another for a staying chaser to do it. I would hope the BHA will look into this and his last couple of runs where he hasn't done anything and is obviously tired.
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Agree, it's a bit different from a sprinter doing it. Why isn't the trainer saying he needs a break? He did 2 circuits of the 4 circuit fontwell race today then completely emptied. The owners seem "choice" to put the term politely, feel sorry for if the cap fits, killed in his first run for them - but then why did his previous owners sell him on rather than give him a nice retirement as it seemed last season that he'd had enough

Just looked at their other horses in the race -

D'Jango - 17 runs since changed trainer in Dec 2021

Red Happy - 19 runs since wind surgery in January

Owners other horses

Abaya Du Mathan - 21 runs since December

Dindin - 24 runs since April
 
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Elf On A Shelf said:
Utterly stupid and greedy of the owners. And I'm not fully blaming the owners as the trainer could put a hold on the runs too. I had a quick look, the horse has been in consistent racing work since September 2021 when he had his first run back from wind surgery. Which means he has probably been in solid work without more than a day off a week since June 2021 minimum. It's one thing for a 5-8 furlong horse to so that as a race is just a bit of work with prize money to them but it's another for a staying chaser to do it. I would hope the BHA will look into this and his last couple of runs where he hasn't done anything and is obviously tired.
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They had 14 in training with David Pipe now 13 after If the Cap Fits died at Aintree 3 weeks ago. I suspect the money they pay in training fees talks rather loudly IMHO. Feel sorry for the horses though.
 
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How can they morally do that to the horses?

Is there no regulatory body that can step in and ban the horses from running until they have a proper break?

Now it's the jumps season they'll be flogged even more

What future will they have outside racing if they've been hammered this much? Can see one of them breaking down or their heart going
 
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Velcrobum said:
They had 14 in training with David Pipe now 13 after If the Cap Fits died at Aintree 3 weeks ago. I suspect the money they pay in training fees talks rather loudly IMHO. Feel sorry for the horses though.
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Yes they spend a lot of money in the yard but the trainer has a duty of care to the animals. But if the horses are sound and holding their weight then, in theory, there is no reason not to run them. I suspect the BHA vets are keeping an eye on them. I don't know the southern vets but I know our ones up here keep their eyes peeled and pay attention to every horse and how often they see it in the stable yards at rhe racecourses. I can see the other side of the argument here too. If Pipe doesn't keep running the horses the owner will just move them all. That would mean losing the best part of £30,000 a month in training fees. That's a lot of money. Especially when you don't have a lot of good horses bringing in the top prize money every week. Very few trainers would turn that down. Hopefully we will get a deluge of rain soon and the horses won't be able to run as they do seem to prefer top of the ground to a bog.
 
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Elf On A Shelf said:
Yes they spend a lot of money in the yard but the trainer has a duty of care to the animals. But if the horses are sound and holding their weight then, in theory, there is no reason not to run them. I suspect the BHA vets are keeping an eye on them. I don't know the southern vets but I know our ones up here keep their eyes peeled and pay attention to every horse and how often they see it in the stable yards at rhe racecourses. I can see the other side of the argument here too. If Pipe doesn't keep running the horses the owner will just move them all. That would mean losing the best part of £30,000 a month in training fees. That's a lot of money. Especially when you don't have a lot of good horses bringing in the top prize money every week. Very few trainers would turn that down. Hopefully we will get a deluge of rain soon and the horses won't be able to run as they do seem to prefer top of the ground to a bog.
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As a matter of interest do trainers ever refuse to train for owners? I can see that the very big successful trainers can financially do so but I guess the smaller yards just have put up with obnoxious/rude/demanding owners. I agree that a trainer has a duty of care but that must be an absolute tightrope to walk if the trainer says no I do not think that is a good race for the horse and the owner says I want my horse entered.
 
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Some do yes no matter how big or small the trainer. There have been people warned off of racing who try to get around it by having horses in other people's names but most trainers aren't daft.

As to entries and Dec's. Some owner's do it themselves as they have access to the BHA site. They just tell the trainer where the horse is going when.
 
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Elf On A Shelf said:
It's actually nothing that is taught as a specific skill, it's purely down to the jockeys throwing their arms and legs at the horse so they lose the core strength to keep them from bouncing. You rarely see flat jockeys do it as their stirrups are so short they can't really use their legs and they would come flying off. It is very much a jump jockey thing. I hate it. Its untidy and doesn't do the horse any favours. Dennis O'Reagan was shocking in the saddle in a finish but he was very effective and you need to be effective over stylish to win races.
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It seems to be a recent thing, over the last few seasons, I'm sure I don't recall seeing jockeys bumping on their horse's backs while they are going round in a race. I wonder if it is a bit of a "fashion" thing? So and so does it, maybe I should too. I hate to see it.

I can sort of understand in a desperate finish, but shouldn't they keep their backsides off the saddle otherwise, apart from riding into a fence?
 
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Orangehorse said:
It seems to be a recent thing, over the last few seasons, I'm sure I don't recall seeing jockeys bumping on their horse's backs while they are going round in a race. I wonder if it is a bit of a "fashion" thing? So and so does it, maybe I should too. I hate to see it.

I can sort of understand in a desperate finish, but shouldn't they keep their backsides off the saddle otherwise, apart from riding into a fence?
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Why do you think NH flat races are also called bumpers ?
 
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