Cold Backed Youngster?? / Bucking Rodeo

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HorseyStar

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I have a 5 year old Welsh D - he was backed by prev owner in 2010 competed lightly in BD in 2010 summer and sold to me...i mainly done hacking etc with him as he is very green, however since i have got him in July 2010 he has bucked and broncoed with me every so often (not all the time when ridden) some days he is perfect the the day after like a raving looney! lol...he had 6 weeks off in November as he ha pulled his back broncoing in field, and came back into work like a looney! i had to literally hold on for dear life and keep him forward, leg on, head up and ride him for 2 solid days through all the silly behaviour, after this he has been a dream, untill today where he decides to go on one again...he just seems so unpredictable..and it is quite violent when he does it! :( he is definately opinionated and likes to think he's boss! but once ridden thru and he knows he cant get you off he submits and goes lovely...he has had all back checks twice, both by vet and physio, he had a new saddle fitted then another new one last week, he's had his teeth done recently and all tack checked, i ahev also bought him a new girth as he has filled out a lot. He seems to resent being tacked up too? turns his bum when he sees the bridle and seems a bit girthy? ears back grumpy to girth up? i am wondering whether he may be slightly cold backed? but dont know to much on this? has anyone similiar problems they could help and pass advice on?? he is also ridden in a polypad which is what owner gave me for him? (she also advised me to lunge him 10 mins before riding him)? hhmmm which makes me think he maybe?? if he is, thats fine i just need to know how to deal with it...? p.s i also tried him bareback and he rodeo's me off! and he also does it on the lunge with and without a saddle and tack on..he is v v silly at the moment :( thought id got thru teh other end, but after today it seems not :( confidence now slowing going too! boohoo!
 
When you had your saddle fitted did the saddler say what type of numnah to use? If fitted with the polypad then it's ok, if not the saddle may be too tight with the polypad underneath.
My previous horse was cold backed but fine if lunged for 5 mins before being ridden. My current horse started to run downhill when we first set off on a hack (it is downhill out of the yard) and felt like she was going to buck. She then refused to trot and bucked if you touched her behind the saddle (I only hacked a few minutes down the road when this happened and called the saddler), I found that as she had put on some weight her saddle was too tight. It has taken her a while to realise that she has a new saddle that doesn't hurt.
I did try my horse bareback after the refusing to trot and she was fine - so I guess your horse is being naughty or remembering pain from the past?
 
thanks hun, yeah i am 90% sure that it is naughtyness having checked all routes with vet, physio, saddle fitter etc and with him doing ti so randomly it makes me think if it was pain then it would be when he is ridden every day! :(

he really seems to hate that girth being done up and seems pretty resentful being tacked up too! just at wits end cos in back of my mind, i feel awful riding him thru the bucks, if he is trying to tell me something that he could maybe be in pain? but then again after 3 professionals in diferent fields state that he isn't im really not sure? and can only think its a behaviural issue...

to be honest since i galloped him full speed arond menege thru the bucks, he hasnt tried it with me since, but he did the broncs with loan girl today who is also v experienced, this is 1st time he's done this with her, so maybe he's just clever and is testing her out? wudnt mind only the other day we were cantering and jumping i the menege without a problem..

he does seem to have a bit of anxiety with mountin too and will try and walk of b4 youv barely got your leg over....which is also leading to being cold backed.... x :eek:
 
My first horse acted cold backed, you would literally see her back rise/hump when you put the saddle on her. I found that I needed to start tacking up 15 mins before I wanted to set off, I used to put her saddle on and leave it loosely girthed whilst I groomed the rest of her, did feet etc and then very gradually kept tightening the girth. When I then went to lead her out of the stable she would shoot forward and be a bit stressy going into the school and then I always lunged her for about 5-10 mins just so that she could settle in her own time without my weight on her. This was all whilst she was a 4 yo and was due to a badly fitted saddle. All her back teeth and tack (new saddle) were checked and fine and she did grow out of it after about 18 months of having a properly fitting saddle ( I hasten to add I nearly sued the saddler that fitted the original one but he settled out of court!!) – so there was probably some pain memory, which might be the case with your boy. Having said that she never had bucking fits, she was just very unsettled and forward and would do a few small bucks on the lunge but that would be all and once warmed up you would not know she was cold backed to start with.
 
IMO 'cold-backed' is just a term used to describe horses whose behaviour indicates discomfort for some reason.
I had a 4 yr old TBxWelshD mare, who was never really happy to be girthed but became more uncomfortable as she changed shape. She got a new saddle and settled down again. However we coped with lots of unpredictable behavioural issues over the years with her until we changed her diet to exclude all cereals/sugar when she became a delight to handle in all ways. Unfortunately she never did get over being 'girthy', even when being rugged - this may have been learned behaviour.
Many horses are particularly sensitive in the girth area.
If all checks have been made, I would look at diet and feed nothing but hay/lage for about a week, then gradually introduce any other feed ingredients, one at a time to see if there is any change.
 
This is really interesting as I have exactly the same situation with my 9yr old Oldenburg I bought back in April last year!
When I went to see him and try him out his owner got straight on and he was fine, I then rode him and he was a dream so fell in love and bought him. Got him back to my yard a few weeks later and let him settle for a week then when I got on him (thankfully in our sand school as he's 17'2!) he went bronc the min I sat down and sent me flying! Since then he has bucked a few times with me, had the yard owners daughter off and regularly humps when ridden. Also has saddle, girth and mounting issues!
I have had vet, physio, teeth, chiro and new saddle fitted and checked etc and now he'll be a dream one day and an absolute horror the next, no ryhme or reason to it? I have tried lunging first, massage pads etc and again sometimes this works and others not at all!
Thanfully the bucking has stopped as this really knocked my confidence but, he still can be a pain to mount also walks off the sec i'm on before I've got my other foot in the stirrup and regularly skips and humps for the first circle or so, which can be a bit un-nerving as it feels like he wants to buck!
I am currently considering sending him to a back specialist for x-rays etc but just need to contact my insurance first as I'm sure won't be cheap. If nothing shows up I guess it is either pain memory or naughtiness, but I know exactly how you feel as it is hard to push them when you are worried about being thrown off!
Keep in touch to let me know how you get on and I'll do the same!
 
When I went to see him and try him out his owner got straight on and he was fine said:
Sounds like what happened to me although to be fair the previous owner did mention a bucking issue I just had no idea it would be as bad as it is and have now had to make the sad decision to sell mine after nearly ending up in hospital :( I've tried everything feed - back - teeth etc but if all these can be ruled out its usually as others have said i.e. a remembered pain or a fear of some sort so the answer is to use a NH method of groundwork which means no riding for as long as it takes to fix and in some cases it may go completely but there is no guarantee it won't still happen but you might get it down to a more manageable level. Re the mounting don't get on unless the horse will stand still - this might mean taking hours till it does so otherwise it will escalate where you could end up being flung off if it takes off and I've known people to get broken necks so make sure your inside rein is always bent so if they do try and walk off at least they can only go in a circle around you. Hope you find a solution as I know how frustrating it is!
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Oh I'm so sorry you had to come to that decision it's never easy but you have to be safe!
My boy was competing at novice level dressage before I got him which is what I bought him for lol! God knows when I'll actually manage to get that far!
Thankfully he isn't dangerous with me anymore and hasn't bucked for months (touch wood) so hopefully it won't come to that for me as he is the sweetest thing ever on the ground and fab when he is settled and behaving ridden!
If you decide to get another horse I really hope you have better luck. :o
 
have you thought back to anything you have done differently when he starts the broncing? Newly opened hay/haylage bale - colder weather - change of girth - just cleaned tacked - changed numnah? x
 
Welsh D's are known for testing new riders... perhaps he is just a little extreme?!

Just a thought though... is he clipped? Perhaps unworn tack feels particularly cold against his skin and that is what he is reacting to... I would ensure you take time tacking up... put numnah on first to warm up, then saddle and looseish girth... maybe even invest in a sheepskin girthsleeve and even a sheepskin lined numnah - some fabric ones really hold the cold! and tighten the girth gradually while you get ready and get his bridle on etc...

And if he is partially / fully clipped, maybe leave a bit more hair on next time!
 
I have a similiar situation going on I backed a 3 1/2 year old connemara, absolutley lovely temp etc. Was fine to back, perfectly behaved and loved it. I knew saddle wasn't ideal but for the first week I stuck with it, got a qualified master saddler out to fit a new saddle, after 2 weeks in this saddle my pony had bucked me off twice, totally out of character, knocked my confidence alot!! Got a full refund and am now back to original saddle with a riser pad!! Got to get a new saddler out but do not know who to trust, he is happier in the original saddle though not been bucked off. Am now having similiar problems with girthing up etc and humping when i get on though!! As I think he has remembered pain being an issue!!
 
One of mine has to have a few circuits on the lunge to get the broncs out before you can get on! He is now 8 and still the same - been to HOYS every year since he was a 4 year old - thats just the way he is!!
 
I would say he is being naughty, whether that is due to the warming up we are having at the moment and having a bit of grass coming through. As if he was cold backed it would only happen when tacked up so when you lunge without saddle he shoudl be going well. Although it could be anything but you have had him checked over, i wouldnt think it was the saddle as it sounds as though he is just testing the water if it was pain related then he wouldnt stop and just give in from what you are saying.
 
CBFan said:
Welsh D's are known for testing new riders... perhaps he is just a little extreme?!

Just a thought though... is he clipped? Perhaps unworn tack feels particularly cold against his skin and that is what he is reacting to... I would ensure you take time tacking up... put numnah on first to warm up, then saddle and looseish girth... maybe even invest in a sheepskin girthsleeve and even a sheepskin lined numnah - some fabric ones really hold the cold! and tighten the girth gradually while you get ready and get his bridle on etc...

And if he is partially / fully clipped, maybe leave a bit more hair on next time!
Click to expand...

funny you shud mention this, as i went to tack shop and bought a equi stretch girth sleeve which wicks away sweat etc, and yeah i was thinking of going sheepskin nuumed pad which physio also recommended, iw as readin up on cold backed last night and did recommended stuff today like tack up slow, allow pad saddle to warm up on back, put girth up 1 whole at a time....i also lunged him on both reins for 10 mins, he was bucking borncoin like mad and i was just stoof there thnking OK iv gotta get on that! ha ha...anyway got on him he walked back a bit when mounting, but then worked really well, altho with all his recent antics he has become resistant to going on the bit too!!

its so weird, im thinkin if it was pain it would be every day and he wouldnt be ridden out ot if etc, he does go lovely once ridden thru it, but must admit you can see the devil in his eye!! im hoping its young spirits which we can grow out of if ridden thru xx also its hard cos my confidence has been knocked a little even tho i can stay on :(
 
Forgot to say on my previous post that when I had the physio out for my horse she suggested a course of bute (she couldn't find anything wrong) and then if the behaviour stops when on bute you know that it is definitely a pain related issue.
 
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