Colic Surgery - experiences, am I being selfish?

[DirectorFury]

Arrived at yard this morning, found my 5yo Sec D mare colicing. She'd only passed 5 poos in the night (6pm-8am) and had clearly been rolling/pacing by the state of her stable. Also hadn't eaten much or drunk anywhere near her normal amount.

Vet was phoned and came out straight away. Checked vitals and said all was good, though her guts were working overtime. Diagnosed spasmodic colic and administered buscopan and an anti-inflammatory painkiller, both IV. Walked her for about 30 minutes and gut sounds were going back to normal on one side but not the other. Given more buscopan and walked for a further 20 minutes, at which point all gut sounds were normal and horse had perked up and was feeling better. Vet left yard at 10am with instructions to not give horse anything to eat for a few hours.

Horse was checked on every 15 minutes for the first 2 hours, and then every 30 minutes for the next 2 hours. All seemed OK so was given a small haynet at 2:30pm. At next check (3pm) horse was clearly in distress again and was COVERED in hives. After finally managing to get hold of vet (long story) she appeared at 4pm. Horse had passed 3 v small poos from 10am to 4pm. She phoned the nearest equine hospital to get their opinion - they wanted her sent to them straight away.

Much faffing (on the vets behalf - including disappearing for an hour with no explanation!!) later and horse is loaded at 6pm, arrive at equine hospital 7:30pm. She's checked over and all seems fine apart from obvious colic. No impaction/twisting apparent. She's been left there for observation overnight.

I discussed colic surgery with the head vet. I was completely against it as I don't think it's fair but was pushed to consider 'basic' surgery. Eventually agreed as long as there is no resectioning or something 'big' has to happen. Currently no surgery will take place but that might change in the night. I'm now having 2nd thoughts about agreeing to the surgery, especially seeing how many people wouldn't put their horses through it . Am I being selfish? I want to give the horse a chance (she's young, good chance of recovery, etc) but don't want to compromise her quality of life because I'm too attached to let her go. She really is my heart horse.

Help me please?

 

[YasandCrystal]

Hugs to you. Everyone has their own opinion on colic surgery and it is an emotive debate. Friends of mine recently put a beloved aged cushings pony through surgery successfully. The pony has rehabbed brilliantly. Now I am unsure I would have done the same, however that's easy to state when one is not emotionally involved.
I cannot advise you, you need to follow your own heart.
Good luck and good vibes for your horse x

 

[FfionWinnie]

It's not something I would consider either as I don't think the outlook for a full recovery is good.

I hope she recovers ok. Poor you.

Is she eating and drinking ok? What was the cause of the hives?

 

[bonny]

It doesn't sound like your horse would require surgery anyway but in a worst case scenario then I see no reason not to operate.

 

[ozpoz]

I honestly don't know what is best but you sound as if you have your horse's best interest at heart, whatever happens.
It is so hard to know you are making the right decision when you are in a stressful situation to begin with but the adrenaline probably increases your capacity to think it all through quickly.

BTW, most people in the other thread were against surgery for their older horses.

Fingers crossed that she'll do well without needing any further intervention. x

 

[DirectorFury]

Hugs to you. Everyone has their own opinion on colic surgery and it is an emotive debate. Friends of mine recently put a beloved aged cushings pony through surgery successfully. The pony has rehabbed brilliantly. Now I am unsure I would have done the same, however that's easy to state when one is not emotionally involved.
I cannot advise you, you need to follow your own heart.
Good luck and good vibes for your horse x

If she was older or had other health problems I wouldn't even entertain the idea. She just seems to so young to give up on . And she was calling to me as I left her there.

It's not something I would consider either as I don't think the outlook for a full recovery is good.

I hope she recovers ok. Poor you.

Is she eating and drinking ok? What was the cause of the hives?

The further risk of colic after the surgery is what really worries me - I don't want to put her through it and do months of box rest, only for her to colic again and have to be PTS.

Hives they suspect is a reaction to the buscopan (vvv rare/almost unheard of, typical). She's drinking very little and isn't interested in food. She can't have further buscopan in case the next reaction is worse so there's not really anywhere to go from here in terms of drugs she can have.

It doesn't sound like your horse would require surgery anyway but in a worst case scenario then I see no reason not to operate.

I'm praying she doesn't need it.

I honestly don't know what is best but you sound as if you have your horse's best interest at heart, whatever happens.
It is so hard to know you are making the right decision when you are in a stressful situation to begin with but the adrenaline probably increases your capacity to think it all through quickly.

BTW, most people in the other thread were against surgery for their older horses.

Fingers crossed that she'll do well without needing any further intervention. x

Best case scenario at the moment is I get a phone call at 9am telling me she's fine and to come and pick her up. I was so against any form of colic surgery until she actually got there and I was discussing it with the vet - it all becomes very real then, iykwim?

Thanks for the well wishes everyone, it's funny how these animals steal our hearts.

 

[Spottyappy]

If you are insured, or can afford it if not, I would give a young horse a go with surgery.
I had a yearling operated on over 20 years ago, before the huge advances in medicine, and he recovered to lead a normal and full life. It's something i would do again if insured or could afford it if not.
I hooe your girl is ok, and recovers without the need for surgery,thus saving you the dilemma of the decision for her.

 

[be positive]

I hope your horse is doing well and makes a full recovery, I had a successful surgical colic experience, the horse was operated on twice, long story but he came through, coped very well with the box rest and went on to enjoy a normal and very active life for a further 12 years, he was 10 when he was taken in with suspected grass sickness, I am not sure I would have taken him in if I had known it was going to end up with him going under GA twice in 3 days but the outcome was good, it was all covered by insurance, not the case now with rising costs.
Would I do it again, I am not sure, I have only 1 insured and I would not put him through it as he has had a traumatic couple of years with injury and I don't think I could put him through another stay at a vets under any circumstances, if I had a young horse that I felt would cope then I would consider it, I just hope you don't need to make a decision for your horse, please let us know how sh is in the morning.

 

[glenruby]

Has your horse had previous bouts of colic? Frequent ( >1-2 per year) episodes would definitely make it a no for me. It sounds like the vets may be expecting it to be a displacement. These often require surgery but this is the simplest form of colic op. It is the only type I would put my horse through. Even then there can be adverse complications, but I would give a young horse with a displacement a chance.

 

[Montyforever]

I know how you feel, its hard to say no when confronted with the situation. I ended up at the vets clinic with my mare late one night and it was left with she may or may not need surgery.
I said to the vet before i left that surgery was something i was very unlikely to put her through and that insurance wouldn't cover it, and that they were to ring me before doing anything. Thankfully she was fine the next day and was able to come home. But if i had ended up getting called in the middle of the night to say surgery or pts i don't know which way i would have gone.

 

[noodle_]

mines insured - but a lot go over the insurance....


in all honesty i wouldnt put mine through colic surgery - even if it was an endless pot of money...

but thats just me.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

One reason that we don't insure, these days, is because in the cold light of day, we don't think that travelling an extremely ill horse to the horsepital, in order to operate, then potentially (if the op is 'successful') put it through months of box-rest, with the strong possibility of further colic episodes, is something that we want to do.
Of course when your horse is colicking, in the middle of the night and the vet is pressing you to set off, it is very difficult to know what to do.
Currently we have 2 older horses and 2 youngsters.
A friend took a 2 yr old to horsepital and she died on the operating table after the vet said that she had a 1% chance of recovery but the insurance company said the op had to go ahead. I would rather pts at home than add to the stress of a seriously ill horse, young or old.

But our decision is for us and our horses, only you know what your horse can cope with and what you are prepared to put both her and you through.

I do hope that she is recovering and you can bring her home in the morning, please let us know.

 

[SusieT]

as a young fit horse, there is little justification to not put them through it compared to, for example, flushing an infected joint.
All risk them standing up and breaking a leg so no difference there.
If it is a 'simple' fix the recovery rate is getting higher all the time - yes it is a surgery and recovery period is not two days then fixed but it's not as bad as a lot of people make out..

 

[SusieT]

ps- I recently saw someone on here comment that having seen a colic horse walking briefly while they were dropping another horse off they wouldn't put their horse through colic surgery - i.e with no idea of what was actually going on.

I would advise take teh advise of a vet you trust rather than a lot of people on here who may or may not have any idea what is involved! The vets are best placed to advise

 

[OwnedbyJoe]

1. Do you have the facilities, heart and support network to deal with a long and potentially difficult rehab post op? Can you follow feeding and exercise instructions to the letter?
2. When you start down this road are you prepared to deal with possible wound breakdown, recurrent mild colics in the recovery stage due to post op ileus (gut standstill) (especially given the fact that she has had an allergic reaction to a commonly used colic medication).
3. Does your local vet have the expertise to deal with the post op stuff or will you be back and forth to the referral hospital every time she has an off day?
4. Will SHE cope with prolonged box rest and a restricted diet?
5. Ask the hard questions of the vet hospital. What is THEIR survival rate (it varies between hospitals). is that a 1 year recovery rate, a "they walked on the trailer to go
home so we called it a recovery" rate, or just a "it came round from the anaesthetic" recovery rate?

There is no shame in answering "no" to the first three questions... I know that my answer is "no" (And I'm a vet (!!), but I do sheep and cattle work). I have 6 horses on pasture and no stable (I'm in Oz). Mine are all used to running as a mob, and we have no real way to control dust contamination of a surgical wound. There are three valuable young animals (a yearling, a 10 year old and an 8 year old) in the mob but none of them would cope with a prolonged period of isolation from the others, and I work full time so I cannot commit to long term intensive levels of care. So my answer has always been no. Asking the questions above may help clarify what your answer should be. Go with your gut, not that they are pushing you to do.

 

[Possum]

I hope you've had good news this morning. FWIW, I think it depends entirely on the horse - I have 3, two I wouldn't put through surgery, one I imagine I would as he's young and has the temperament to cope with the box rest. I'd never have a hard and fast 'rule', and whatever you may have decided will be the right decision for you both.

 

[conniegirl]

Yes i would put a young horse healthy horse through colic surgery if the prognosis is good.
I've taken one for surgery for a friend and he was an flighty fidgety twit of an exrace horse. He came through fine and is still around now (8 years later), still as much of a twit as ever and regularly puts younger horses (now 17) to shame

 

[eahotson]

No experience of colic or colic surgery sorry.Feel for you.Horrible decision.Hope all goes well.Keep us all up to date.

 

[tinycharlie]

I've no experience of colic surgery although charlie had colic twice but recovered ok.
Hope your horse will be ok, let us know xx

 

[Silmarillion]

It would entirely depend on the horse and the circumstances, for me.
I put my mare through it a few years ago, and with hindsight I really shouldn't have. The vet who operated, and eventually put her to sleep a few days later, was convinced she was more like 25yo than 15yo. I am also almost certain she had undiagnosed cushings and she had a recurring tendon issue. Bad decision, but I adored her.
I wouldn't put either of my 19yos through it, and I loan a 9yo where the owner won't agree to it If it happens.
I hope you've had better news this morning.

 

[Boxers]

No experience of this so cannot offer any help or advice. However, I hope you have good news this morning.

 

[nikki.]

I do hope your horse is ok and you aren't faced with this decision. It is every horse owners worse nightmare And it happened to me in october. I did go for surgery - she had displacement of the large intestine and tympany (blew up like a balloon)....she recovered well and was home in 10 days. She then went down again 2 days after being home and ended up back at the hospital - we operated again although I knew it was likely to be a pts on the table.... I had a call 2.30 in the morning to tell me she had had a small intestinal torsion - no intestinal compromise so no resections and was recovering well!! She came home 2 weeks after that and we have gone through the box rest, complete wound breakdown and rebandaging every other day, in hand walking, controlled turnout and we are now in our 2nd week of riding again. Would I do it again? I have my horse back and the trauma of what we went through is starting to become a memory. She dealt with the whole thing exceptionally well. But I knew she would cope with the aftercare. My previous mare wouldn't have. You can only go with your gut feeling pardon the pun - but please consider the aftercare required as it is not just the surgery that should be considered. I wish you all the best and am keeping my fingers crossed for you x

 

[maree t]

How is your horse this morning ?
I hope it is better news . I have never been faced with this or the aftermath so no advice but if she is otherwise healthy ......

 

[Cortez]

Having cared for 2 horses after colic surgery (not my own), I would not put any of mine through it - and both horses recovered, one fully, the other was never the same again. It is the recovery period which is the most distressing and difficult for both horse & carer.

 

[stormclouds]

I hope you've had some good news this morning.

No experience of the rehab, but a woman on my old yard had her horse go through colic surgery when he was about 6/7. I knew him as a 16/17yr old and he was fine, had lived a good life going on to be successful in the show ring. He only colicked once since the op, and that was after the YM put him out on a field with lots of spring grass. He gorged himself and had very mild impaction colic (vet called but didn't come out). His owner simply managed him slightly differently (i.e. not putting him out for 10 hours on a field full of lush grass!!).

 

[eggs]

A young horse, then yes I would put through colic surgery. I had my three year old operated on but he was euthanased in the recovery room. It turned out that he had had a major intestinal twist (it was originally thought it was 'just' an impaction) and he had gone into massive toxic shock with associated organ failure.

I also had my six year old operated on for an impaction at NEC. I could not believe how well he looked when we went to collect him. Maybe I was just lucky with him but he made a full recovery with very sgraight forward rehabilitation and has had no repeat episodes (he is now 10).

In answer to your question I would put a young horse through surgery but not an older horse.

Hopefully your horse is on the mend.

 

[DirectorFury]

1. Do you have the facilities, heart and support network to deal with a long and potentially difficult rehab post op? Can you follow feeding and exercise instructions to the letter?
2. When you start down this road are you prepared to deal with possible wound breakdown, recurrent mild colics in the recovery stage due to post op ileus (gut standstill) (especially given the fact that she has had an allergic reaction to a commonly used colic medication).
3. Does your local vet have the expertise to deal with the post op stuff or will you be back and forth to the referral hospital every time she has an off day?
4. Will SHE cope with prolonged box rest and a restricted diet?
5. Ask the hard questions of the vet hospital. What is THEIR survival rate (it varies between hospitals). is that a 1 year recovery rate, a "they walked on the trailer to go
home so we called it a recovery" rate, or just a "it came round from the anaesthetic" recovery rate?

1. Yes
2. No, not with the buscopan allergy.
3. My local vet is completely useless, I suspect we'd be back and fore and it's not fair to keep travelling an ill horse.
4. Box rest yes, restricted diet no (she is a cob!).

I'm coming to the conclusion that I don't want to put her through any surgery if she needs it, mostly due to the buscopan allergy - it means we've not really got a way of dealing with any future spasmodic colic.

I don't have the mental capacity to reply to all the posts this morning, but thank you so much for the help and support for those that have replied. She's insured up to 7.5k vets bills so cost isn't a factor and I'm not concerned about getting a death/LOU payout as you've got to follow the BEVA guidelines and I think they're cruel and prolong suffering.

No news yet, I was told to expect a phone call between 9-10am unless something had gone wrong in the night. So no news is good news, at the moment.

I'm preparing myself for her to be PTS, I said my goodbyes when I left her last night. She really is my heart horse and I have to do the right thing by her.

Edit: horsepital phoned as I pressed post. She had a good night, poo'd and drank a lot and seems a lot brighter and is calling for food. They're going to start her on food today and, all being well, she'll be coming home tomorrow . Thank god. I'm not going to fully relax until she's back home and everything is fine, but it's a relief that she made it through the night.

 

[eggs]

Great news

 

[AmieeT]

No personal experience, but a lady on my yard had a 27yo cob that lived for 10years after colic surgery. He unfortunately went down with it again last year, but he had a good long life because of the surgery.

Good to here that she's better, hope she comes home soon!

Ax

 

[Goldenstar]

I have been exactly where you are ,a late night dash to the Dick with a heavily sedated colicing horse.
While I was there I told them no surgery without speaking to me again by the time I got home I had decided it was a no .
Thankfully the horse recovered and came home full of hell three days later .
I hope yours does the same .