Colic surgery = pts?

Paint Me Proud

Paint Me Proud

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I spoke to someone today who said that if their horse needed colic surery they would rather put them to sleep as they will never be right after, colic will always return and it is cruel to put them through all that.

Obviously Chico having had surgery 5 weeks ago I suddenly felt awful that what if I shouldnt have put him through the surgery and he will just get colic again. :(

Moral support needed...
 
Load of old tosh!
My old loan horse suffered for years with colic.
Owner sent him in for surgery during a nasty episode and he came back better than ever!
And not had colic since....he is now nearly 30
 
Unless they are a vet I would ignore them. If you are worried I would speak to your vet and get their opinion as to whether it is likely to reoccur.

Personally I would do what you did and get the op done. If it kept happening then maybe would reconsider.
 
hey, dont worry, just ignore them, everyone is entitled to their views on dealing with things, and when they find themselves in that situation they may well not find it as easy to not atleast try and save their horse. Me, I would go to any lengths I could, and have done in the past, that way I have no regrets about the situation. If I hadnt tried everything, i couldnt live with myself.
 
Thats good news Joeanne. I'm sure have done the right thing for Chico OP, given the same circumstances I'm sure i'd have done the same.
 
Paint Me Proud said:
Moral support needed...
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It's your horse, your decision :) I know a lot of people who won't put a horse through colic surgery under any circumstances, as their experiences have been bad in the past. But surgery is getting better all the time and I believe (though have no data to back it up) that more horses are returning to a full working life after surgery. One of my friend's ponies had colic surgery about 5 or 6 years ago (caused by retained testicle torsion) and is happily out eventing :)

I wouldn't put my horse through colic surgery, but he's in his 20s. With a younger horse I would :)
 
You're vet is the best person to advise as they know you and your horses individual circumstances.

I do have a friend who had her horse pts rather than go through colic surgery but this was a very agressive and difficult horse who if forced on box rest could have injured himself or someone else. Vet agreed this was the best course of action and a pm showed that the surgery would must likely not have been a success anyway due to the damage done.

Your horse is obviously recovering from the surgery so it sounds like you've made the best decision and only time will tell if there will be any future problems.
 
Two words bull and sh it :D
I know of a horse that had colic surgery and went on to have a very successfull sj career. What they did with their horse was up to them, personally if mine needed it, theyd get it, i hope chico is continuing to improve :)
 
If there's hope i'd always give my horses the chance, when I lost my old girl years ago to a ruptured splene, the vet said she could have surgery but he couldn't promise she'd even make the journey there, i asked him, if she were his horse would he try, he said no, that was enough for me to know that although it was going to tear my heart in 2 that I couldn't put her through it, so she was PTS, I do sometimes beat myself up thinking "what if" i gave her the chance, etc, but if I had of given her the chance and she died in a horsebox i'd have beaten myself up more. IF he had of said "yes" I would have gone for it without a doubt.

Feel happy in what you done, you did what was right for you and your horse, and I hope he makes a speedy and full recovery x
 
Dont for one second think you did wrong thing. My girl had it in nov last year. Small intestines entrapment. Non was taken away as got it in time. She has had one small bot of colic, by time vet got there it passed. I was crying my eyes out just before she went in for the op and i wanted to give her the best chance to stay with me for a few more years as she is only 11. I did not see her when she was rolling in pain. That morning i was late down yard. Girls said it was good job i was not there as i would have been no help to see my girl in so much pain. The girls said they have never seen anything like it or wish to again.(i am never late down , but that day i was) She is doing great now and happy and got so much closer to me. I did right thing and so did you. The saying goes dont give up on those you love .
 
Depends on the horse, depends on the colic, depends on the surgery, and depends on the circumstances.

If your vet is happy with how things have gone then your lad has as good a chance as any. None of us know when they will be taken from us, so think positively and make the most of every minute of this second chance you have both been given rather than worrying about when it will be over.
 
Please don't listen. We all do what is right for OUR horses. I lost mine a few weeks ago to colic and it was awful, still is when I think about it. However surgery for her was not an option, had it of been who knows as I would certainly have her here with me now than still trying to come to terms with losing her.
May you both go on enjoying life together for many more years.
 
carthorse said:
Did the person know your horse had colic surgery .
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yes, her horse is being treated for peritonitis at the moment and when i said Chico had had colic surgery she said she would never put them through that.

Chico is recovering so well it is unbelievable, the vet said she had never seen a horse cope so well with so little swelling as Chico. You honestly wouldnt know there was anything wrong with him and its only been 5 weeks.

At the moment I know i did the right thing but am worried about him colicing again (vet said it will happen but could be 5 months of 15 years!). I will just take each day as it comes i guess.
 
There was a horse at my yard who had colic. She went for surgery and the only bad thing that came out of it was she's now scared of trailers (she's being helped to get over this fear and doing well!)
Like others have said, it depends. My old pony got colic at 30 and pulled through and I even rode him again! But I have heard of others who haven't survived.
 
i agree its your decision and to ignore them however if someone asked me now i would say i wouldn't put mine through it simply because in my area iv'e only known one horse come home from colic surgery and he is currently standing with a rather large hernia on the scar line and so his recovery is still in limbo although he looks fantastic apart from the lump

but then again i lost a very special horse to me through a twisted gut , she was found dead in the field so too late to do anything but if i'd have found her through the night i can without a doubt say i would have taken her straight in for surgery and tried to save her although would have been terrible if she'd died on route :(

very best of luck with your horse he sounds like he is doing well
 
A good friend had it done on a 25 yr old pony, against the vets advice when they realised his age. She's never been one to avoid tough decisions & to this day can't explain why she did. He made a full recovery & lived over 10 years after. I doubt I'd put my 23 yr old through it but otherwise I'd always be willing to try based on vets recommendation.
 
Paint Me Proud said:
yes, her horse is being treated for peritonitis at the moment and when i said Chico had had colic surgery she said she would never put them through that.

Chico is recovering so well it is unbelievable, the vet said she had never seen a horse cope so well with so little swelling as Chico. You honestly wouldnt know there was anything wrong with him and its only been 5 weeks.

At the moment I know i did the right thing but am worried about him colicing again (vet said it will happen but could be 5 months of 15 years!). I will just take each day as it comes i guess.
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My girl recovering so well vets love her as she is so easy to work with. Like with any surgery theres always a chance it will happen again. I had surgery on my back for sciatica. There is a chance it will go again in months or years its a chance i took with my girl as well as my own health. I did it for the best chance at what life has in store for us . Good luck and stop worrying. Lifes for living now live it.
 
Dont feel awful, as you've said Chico is recovering well.

I've known 2 horses to have colic surgery, one in this country and one in another. Both went well, both horses recovered, 6 years down the line they are still going strong and out competing in dressage and sj.

Both owners are extra cautious though and are always on the look out for any signs of colic but fingers crossed no repeats so far.

Good luck and hope the recovery proceeds without a hitch.
 
Paint Me Proud said:
they would rather put them to sleep as they will never be right after, colic will always return and it is cruel to put them through all that.
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:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

At some point, when I've calmed down, I'll tell you about my boy who had surgery aged 12. His chances with surgery weren't great but he had no chance without it (twisted gut).

He's now 18 and has never looked better. In the last few years he's show jumped (not competed for a while admittedly - but the year after his surgery he did!), hunted and is now a happy hacker going out for 2-3 hour rides, including canter and gallop, and the odd small show. At some point I'll get transport sorted and we'll do beach hacks :) No special dietary requirements, no wrapping in cotton wool.

If - my worst nightmare - colic returns, then yes, I will PTS rather than operate again. But to say they will "NEVER" be right afterwards - in 100% of cases - is simply wrong. No other word for it.* The choice has to be based on each individual horse and situation as it occurs (and I hope for most horse owners it never does).

*Well. I can think of one or two.

So glad your boy is recovering well - fingers crossed it continues :)
 
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You do what is right for YOUR horse. I personally wouldn't do it, but with Chico I can totally see why you have given him that chance. I would never tell someone not to go for surgery, I would support them in their decision. How dare someone question your decision.
Yes, some horses do die on the table or just hours after surgery, some do get colic again and some go on to have full working lives with no more trouble, and you won't know which your horse is unless you give it a chance. Try to distance yourself from the negative people. Your horse = your choice. I have enjoyed your blog BTW. I really hope all goes well and continues to do so for your lad.
 
It depends very much on the situation. I lost my horse two years ago, due to impacted colic which tore him internally. Surgery was an option that was mentioned, but I chose not to put him through it. Not because I don't think that any horse should be put through colic surgery, but because I didn't think THAT horse should have. He already had significant internal trauma, a full thickness rectal tear which was allowing faeces to leak through - so it was highly likely that he had peritonitis brewing. The surgery would have involved transporting him to the RVC, them making a hole in his flank, cutting his bowel, and re-routing it through hole, then trying to repair the rectal tear. If that was successful, he would have to have another major op some weeks later to re-attach his bowel. He was 14 years old, had had a lovely life, and was a really special horse. He was in absolute agony, yet still managed to whicker at me when I arrived at the vets.
I had to make a quick decision, but even if I'd had all day, I still would have had him PTS, rather than put him through that amount of surgery, when it was highly likely that he had a massive infection that was going to kill him anyway. Although I was devastated, I feel I made the best decision for my horse in the situation. I defy anyone to have a go at me for the choice I made. I regret losing him, but I don't regret signing the consent form.

Another horse, on another day - I might choose to operate. No-one can make the call until they are in the situation.
 
What you think you would do, and what u would actually do is often very different.

I thought that if my 17 yr old semi retired horse had a serious injury, I would have to call it a day (he just doesn't travel - and I thought then he'd had a good life and I'd just say good-bye)

Then he sustained a serious fracture in the field. Against all the odds we got him on a box ( heavily sedated - we just about had to winch him on) - he spent 10 weeks at the vets cross tied and then another 6 months on box rest. I never once thought about giving up and every day just willed him to get better.

17 months on he is all better and loving life as a happy hacker - and on Friday we had our first teeny canter in over 17 months. Best thing we ever did giving him a chance to get well again. Hopefully we'll our boy to pamper and enjoy for many years to come. I wouldn't have cared if I could never ride him again - I just wanted him to get better and come home x
 
What a silly thing for her to say. There are too many variables to make such a general statement true. My mare had a displacement and vet was hopeful of her chances at the time, despite arguing with us that he thought she was closer to 25 than 15. We gave her a chance. She sadly didn't make it a week after that, but that was due to her individual circumstances.

This year someone I know had their older horse go through colic surgery. He's colicked regularly in the last ten or so years I've known him. He's now alive and well. I really doubted he would make it!

All you can do is what you've done - consider options with your vet and make the best decision for your horse. With a bit of luck you'll be laughing at her in a few years' time ;)
 
EstherYoung said:
Depends on the horse, depends on the colic, depends on the surgery, and depends on the circumstances.

Very well stated. I lost a Shire mare, 2 days short of her 19th birthday, 2 weeks ago. She had colic, but not in an horrendous way. Buscopan helped dramatically earlier in the day, but she needed more several hours later. Two vets, one in the morning, one in the evening, gave her extensive examinations. I decided to go with surgery for 2 reasons: I lost my beloved Clyde gelding to colic in May of 2010. He was in the most heart-rending agony and none of the medications administered to him offered any relief. He was 18hh and weighed over a tonne. The ramifications of surgery, much less getting him into a trailer in his condition, weighed heavily against him. I had him pts that night. I've always wondered "what if?" In the more recent event, when I asked the vet what he would do if my mare were his, he thought long and hard and said, given her less acute condition, coupled with her excellent health, he would go for the op. I agreed. She loaded onto the trailer without hesitation, stepped off the ramp at the vet's and stood for ultrasound like a champ. They found what they suspected: nephro-splenic entrapment. It was almost midnight when they started surgery, after sending me home. The vet rang at 3am, to say the surgery went well, but they were concerned because she wasn't getting, or staying, up. The vet rang, again, at 7am, to say she didn't make it. Apparently, the heavier the horse, the more problematic it is for them to be on their backs during surgery. It's a question of oxygen deficit, among other things. Obviously, I'm heartbroken. However, I trust my vets and have no reason to doubt their expertise. It wasn't meant to be.

Given the size of my Shires (I have 4 more, even larger than the mare I lost), I will probably opt for euthanasia in the event of colic in future. But then, again, "depends on horse, depends on the colic, depends on the surgery, and depends on the circumstances."
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Don't listen to tat. You have done the best for Chico.

Do horses that have had colic without surgery colic again? Sometimes. Same as ones with surgery. Sometimes when they're on the table vets put them down as damage is too bad. But it all just depends. You have given your boy the best chance of more happy days with you and so far it's been going well so why are you doubting yourself? You did the right thing.

Terri
 
Its really good news that Chico is doing so well, I saw the wound photos and thought that it looked good.

There are so many if's but's and maybe's with colic, we've only done surgery with a youngster which we operated on at 6 months because she was so young. She herniated and we ended up with 2 further operations and finally putting her to rest at 18 months. What you need to decide is what is best if it does re-occur again. We couldn't do any more for our little one as the repair site would have broken down again and in the early stages of healing this is something you need to consider, also I don't know if your vets gave a reason for the colic (i've read so much I can't honestly remember) - if it was something likely to re-occur then think carefully as when it does happen we tend to make snap decisions in the heat of the moment because we don't want to loose them (I have had to make the decision to not operate twice on other horses due to predicted outcomes and have to live with that decision!)

You can't change that you have decided to operate, it all seems to be going well and long may it stay that way! I hope that Chico goes on to prove the person wrong who told you.
 
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