Colic surgery = pts?

I think it's a very individual, personal situation.

When Meg had what seemed to be colic/mystery illness the other month, we had 3 options:

1. Continue trying to diagnose and treat
2. Open her up
3. PTS

She's 19 and uninsured. Owner didn't want to put her through an op and couldn't really afford to. Vet agreed, and told us that she could have the op, stay on boxrest, decline and then end up being PTS anyway.

We went with treatment and she luckily improved dramatically. If Meg was insured and younger, I would have had the operation in a heartbeat and I'm sure her owner would have done too.

Obviously having Chico operated on was your best choice at the time and he's doing well, so you have nothing to beat yourself up about.
He's young, fit and healthy, and should recover fine.

Ignore the ignorant person, hate people that blanket term everything and don't look into personal circumstance!
 
I think it is most important to weigh up the decision to operate vs PTS carefully. The op if you are insured will quickly exceed your maximum. If not insured you could be out of pocket £5k+ and your horse could still not survive. During the emotional period while you are trying to decide, it is difficult to be rational, but somehow, you must. I do agree with the poster about size: smaller horses/ponies seem to cope better & if someone with a large horse decided to PTS, I would respect that. No easy answers, but am delighted Chico is recovering so well.
 
At the end of the day it is up to you and your horse.......but after seeing two horses in 10 months both go through colic surgery and had to be pts i have told my vets and yard owner that if ever one of mine got colic bad enough for them to need surgery i want them to pts if im not there......that is my opinion after my own experiances.

My vet has said 99% of the surgerys done come back fine but again that it is my choice.

Hope your boy makes a quick recovery. Hugs.

X
 
My two horses have both had colic surgery, one in 2007 and one in 2010. They suffered very little in recovery - after the first two or three days post surgery they didn't even need bute. They are both still here, and doing fine (although one has allergic issues which caused the colic initially).
For stats about surgery try the site below (the link is to survival rates but there's lots of other useful info).
http://www.liv.ac.uk/equinecolic/post_operative_survival/

S :D
 
No it doesn't always = pts.

I hope Chico is well on the mend now.

New Years Eve 1991 I had a 5 year old mare operated on at Rossdales (wonderful place and Vets) apart from sulking horrendously and refusing to talk to anyone for a week she came out of it fine. As she also recovering from a horrid tendon injury the Vets recommended that when she was healed she was put in foal and turned away.

She came sound, went on to have 4 foals, hunted hard with me for 4 years, did 50 mile endurance rides, went back into race training and never once was she lame through exercise, and she never, ever, had another colic episode either (although I was pretty careful with her feeding)

She lived another 12 very busy years with me and would, no doubt, have gone on for many more, but for an unfortunate incident in the field.
 
Oh here is a good example of someone offering their opinion as fact. I had a horse that had colic surgery over 20 years ago and he came through and never looked back. Colic is too wide a term for anyone to make such a sweeping statement.

I would not put my old (24) year old through it but would a younger fitter horse. Good luck with your horses recovery,
 
All horses are different. I know one that colics all the time and has done for years since her surgery. The other one had surgery four years ago and not so much as a grumble since. Both are still alive. I cannot say for sure what I would do if either of mine needed it. I lost a gorgeous horse four years ago after colic surgery and with my two's other problems (one has cushings and is retired through an injured shoulder, the other is still recouperating after KS surgery), I think it would be wrong of me to put them through colic surgery. I know for sure I would have my gelding PTS if he faced it and I would HOPE I would have the guts to do the same for my mare, but if either were otherwise relatively young and fit, and with no other condition that could compromise them, then I would probably go for it.
 
Depends on the type of colic - what caused the colic- how your horse/ pony is- what damage is done or if things are going wrong.

Colic surgery if caught early can have an amazing result , many of these animals never have another episode.

Allot depends on what caused it.

A livery I had had colic surgery to remove dead portions , everything went fine. However she has had 2 repeat colic attacks both nearly fatal.
My pony who I only had 6 weeks colicked in the first week. Rushed to Potters Bar. Luckily she didn't need to have surgery.

Came home , had a muzzle on - gradually removing over the next few weeks . Then one day came in from the field like normal. checked her 7-8 o'clock still fine.


9pm came , we hear bang bang from the stable , I went out- she had colic again. Called vet who came , rectal etc injection etc was about to leave but I said can you wait as last time vet left she colicked again after her left. He did and she did.

To cut a story short she was PTS at 2am on that night.

Turned out the hole in her gut was bigger than normal and her intestines went through the hole got cut off and started to go toxic.

All horses have a hole in the gut , and a few get it so its abnormally big which is when this problem arises.

So you see it depends on the type of colic and what caused it.
My lami mare has had compacted and spasmodic .

There is every chance your horse will never have it again. what caused the colic? if you don't mind saying?:)
 
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Animal surgery has come on leaps and bounds and so has after care treatment for them. I lost a yearling 30 years ago from surgery, mainly because his smaller bowel didn't work properly after, but I wouldn't let that thought put me off if one of my young ones needed it done.
 
I beilieve each horse is different... You as an owner know them best and know if they have fight left with them. One of my boys had colic 7 years ago and the vets gave him little chance, but we could see he still had fight so he had surgery. He came through and out the otherside amazingly even at the age of 19. He healed and even came back to work and jumping :-) We let him guide us really on the amount he wanted to do... but he was just his cheeky, lively old self. He had a few little colic scares over the years but then we started feeding him an aloe vera supplement (for his arthiritis) and that seem to help his gut as he didnt colic again! Well until Feb this year when sadly we lost him... but we could see he had had enough - he was led on the floor and had that look in his eye of please let me go. Was saddest and hardest day of my life and i still miss and cry for him everyday... BUT im so pleased we went down the surgery road 7 years ago otherwise i would have lost him then and we also created a much stronger bond as i think he knew what we had done for him.
Your horse = your decision. You know him best.
Good luck and all best with his recovery.
 
Its an idvidual choice on this and people have diffrent opinions I guessed based on their own experances and stuff they have heard.
I had two horses with major colic symptoms, my mare was a TB came down with servere colic and I was advised by vet to pts there and then as it was unlikely she would of made it to leahurst :(

I ignored this at wanted to try to give her a fighting chance, she pulled through surgery and it turned out she had a strangulated hernia and had a large portion of intestine removed.

Following surgery she was so thin and had minor colic eposides weekly sometimes 2-3 per week. Her wound was weeping for a while and I was just heartbroken watching her in the state. She coped well with rest and then suddenly seemed to pick up and eventually was back to normal looking better than she ever had :D

Then sadly just over a year later she went down again I had a battle with vet to pts, he eventually refused to come out as he had already medicated her and I had to give it chance to work, this was two hours after he had been out. Anyway it got really bad without going into details.

A few years later my boy had similar colic attack and I would not go through the colic surgery again, it may have turned out diffrent but I could not go through or put any other animal through what my mare went through.

On the other side of it though I have worked with a couple of ponies who had colic surgery and were in the late teens doing all sorts and they had never had a bout of colic and had completly normal lifes. :)

I wouldnt let any comment upset you, at the time you make the choice that you beleive to be best for the horse some pull through some dont. Its the same as anything really, am really glad your horse is doing so well :D
 
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Our 14.2 had colic surgery 6 years ago aged 16, six months later she was in full work and she's never had an attack since.

in my mind if there's a chance you have to take it.
 
Some people just dont think before they speak, generally those people who are so unknolwedgeable its ridiculous.

Each hore HAS to be taken as an individual and the risks weighed up for any surgery, particularly colic.
 
rhino said:
It's your horse, your decision :) I know a lot of people who won't put a horse through colic surgery under any circumstances, as their experiences have been bad in the past. But surgery is getting better all the time and I believe (though have no data to back it up) that more horses are returning to a full working life after surgery.
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My vet is in the thick of colic surgery and would not even put his own horse through surgery and reckons that it's only a 50% success rate for there not to be complications after surgery which causes the problems; for him, it's not the surgery that kills but the aftermath of it.
 
Maesfen said:
My vet is in the thick of colic surgery and would not even put his own horse through surgery and reckons that it's only a 50% success rate for there not to be complications after surgery which causes the problems; for him, it's not the surgery that kills but the aftermath of it.
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My vet also performs the surgery and isn't entirely sure they would put their horses through it. It seems to be a recurring comment from people who are actually friendly with surgical vets.

Although I think they have pretty good success rates, better than that, I'm not sure I'd do it. But that's my personal opinion on the matter and I certainly wouldn't expect anyone else to do what I would!

Chico looks like he's coping really well so just ignore them and don't worry about it if you can :)
 
This is a complete utter load of rubbish please ignore it!

My Boy had colic surgery in feb 2009, and although the next few months were slightly touch and go, he was back hunting and team chasing in November!

Understandably each horse will be different under the circumstances, but if they do make it, the majority go on to lead very successful careers, there are a fair few top racers who have made it back to full fitness after colic surgery aswell!

But then, he is my horse of a life time, so it was worth every penny. I guess if it's 'just another horse' people wouldn't bother.
 
It's a persona,l choice I would never presume to comment on anyone else's desiscion is a personal one and you make that decision based on many factors.
The time I was in that position we got the horse to hospital as it was wreaking the stable at home it was dangerous to try to handle her , I was recovering from surgery and very slow on my feet. The vet would not allow me in the stable I would not have gone in any way I just could not move fast enough.
She was deeply sedated travelled two and a half hours to hospital where their people who could handle her and I said no surgery without asking me first and went home on the journey I decided I could not care for her after so rang and told them to PTS if they felt there was no hope she recovered.
I don't know what I would do if it happened to me again I don't think you really can but I have heard enough horror stories to put me off .
But it's a personal choice and I don't think there's a right or wrong answer to this question.
 
My horse fell ill with colic on the 30th September 2010, he was rushed to hospital where he underwent life saving colic surgery. He recovered so so well! You wouldn't have even thought he'd had sugery just 12 hours after! He was so bright and alive! Shamey was given a 20% survival rate to survive the first year after colic surgery. Since his surgery Shamey has been back competing upto 1.15m! Winning XC's, SJ championships, competing in Open WHP at county level! This is the pony that had a 20% survival rate for the first year after the surgery!

He has had a few small bouts of colic for which we always get the vet out to be sure! He lives on hay and is fe pony nuts and bran for his evening and morning feeds. After hard work or competition he's fed a hot bran mash, really keeps everything moving! We worry about him everyday though, they have to be a fighter in themselves to survive and pull through.

Shamey has done so much for me, taught me loads, makes dreams a reality so there was NO way I was giving up on him! You wouldn't put a person to sleep if they needed an operation? I agree you should give them a chance!

xx
 
I would rather have my horse PTS not because of the risk of more colic (codswallop!) but because he wouldn't cope being on box rest for a long period of time, I don't think he'd cope mentally.
 
Dizzle said:
I would rather have my horse PTS not because of the risk of more colic (codswallop!) but because he wouldn't cope being on box rest for a long period of time, I don't think he'd cope mentally.
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If it had been my other horse then yes, he wouldn't have coped either! It completely depends on the type of horse you have and the circumstances you are in! The horse could have other on going problems aswell. So as much as I love to give them a chance, if they can't cope with recovery or wouldn't make it through the Op then you have to let them go <3 Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind <3 There is nothing to be ashamed of if you have your horse pts for some reason if thats whats best for the horse! <3 Every owner having to make that heartbreaking decision will know what's best for there own horse! Believe me, I know after having to recently let one of my best friends go to a pain free place <3 RIP Charlieeee, you were such a sweet horse <3 xxx
 
Having stood in on colic surgery during work experience at my vets I can say the treatment and advances are fantastic and the surgeons and assistants should be recognised for the amazing work they do. However, I would not put my horses through it, current and future.

My current ponies 20 and 22, would never cope with it. The eldest can only just manage a day in his stable without trying to climb out and the other suffers with arthritis and is a pain to get in the bloody trailer and wouldn't be able to move confined for so long. I would do my best as possible before surgery and the friend who looks after them when I'm away has also been told my choices.

I fully respect people who opt for surgery as they know their horse better than anyone and if they believe they can pull through and cope with major surgery then go for it. Your horse, your decision. It's just not for everyone.
 
Nah said:
There was a horse at my yard who had colic. She went for surgery and the only bad thing that came out of it was she's now scared of trailers (she's being helped to get over this fear and doing well!)
Like others have said, it depends. My old pony got colic at 30 and pulled through and I even rode him again! But I have heard of others who haven't survived.
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Nah- Mine is also nervous to travel now, he can cope but just dosn't enjoy it! :/ Loves it when he gets there to see jumpies ;) haha He's scared of you trimming and clipping his legs now too? Quite bizzare, he's certainly lost confidence..but not in his jumping ;) hehe xx
 
Only the OP can make the decision and it is wise to ask the vets for as much information as possible. But I can certainly think of 3 horses that I know personally who have had colic surgery (gut removal) and have gone on to be very susceptible to colic for the rest for their lives (usually changing onto a new field seems to trigger it). I believe adhesions are what cause alot of future problems.
 
rhino said:
It's your horse, your decision :) I know a lot of people who won't put a horse through colic surgery under any circumstances, as their experiences have been bad in the past. But surgery is getting better all the time and I believe (though have no data to back it up) that more horses are returning to a full working life after surgery. One of my friend's ponies had colic surgery about 5 or 6 years ago (caused by retained testicle torsion) and is happily out eventing :)

I wouldn't put my horse through colic surgery, but he's in his 20s. With a younger horse I would :)
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this ^^


personall choice.... i wouldnt put mine through it (shes 5), because i dont feel 8 weeks of box rest she could cope with...

As well as that, if my insurance dosent cover it - i dont have 5-6k+ im willing to bankrupt myself for my horse.



A horse i know had colic surgery and its now back jumping/bombing about - no problem s:)
 
rhino said:
It's your horse, your decision :) I know a lot of people who won't put a horse through colic surgery under any circumstances, as their experiences have been bad in the past. But surgery is getting better all the time and I believe (though have no data to back it up) that more horses are returning to a full working life after surgery. One of my friend's ponies had colic surgery about 5 or 6 years ago (caused by retained testicle torsion) and is happily out eventing :)

I wouldn't put my horse through colic surgery, but he's in his 20s. With a younger horse I would :)
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Agree - when our 7 year old got colic we were set to whizz her to New market in our PJ's and would have tried what ever it took (within reason), however she went down before we got her on the lorry and never got up again. If it had been one of the old girls I wouldn't have considered it and PTS.
 
Poor you - never an easy descision.

My boy underwent surgery for colic just over two years ago now, brought on by pain caused by hoof abcess. The initial op went fine and his recovery was uneventful, however the vet called at 7:30am the next morning to say he had relapsed and would need further surgery, which I agreed to. When I went to see him, there was no recognition or reaction from him, in fact he was just an empty space and I thought that was it. He had several piles of feed to tempt him to eat, grass, hay, haylage, nuts, mix, but didn't eat anything. I placed a polo in his droppy bottom lip - nothing. I said my goodbyes to him and decided that the last thing I would do was make him eat the polo, there wasa a flicker and movement and the polo was crunched and swallowed, then a little bit of grass and a little bit of everything else. He didn't move around much because of all the tubes he was conneced to, but at least he acknowleded me.

I left him really thinking that I had said goodbye and the vet would advise euthanasia, how wrong could I be! The vet called the next day and asked me if I could come and collect my horse as soon as possible because he was trashing his stable and being a total thug!

Although he had extensive surgery, his stomach has regained its shape and you wouldn't know he had had colic surgery. He has had no relapses whatsoever; I am careful about his diet and make sure his mix is moist and he has access to fresh, clean water all the time. Unfortunately he is still a big but cuddly thug and knows he's the most important male in my life (hubby knows too).

He is nine and deserved the chance but I wouldn't subject my retired pony
(21) to surgery, and would probably not subject him to surgery again.
 
My 15yr gelding developed life-threatening colic three weeks ago and I made the decision to try and save him. The surgeon was honest - 50/50 chance of uncomplicated surgery and 10-day hospitalization. Of those that developed complications, they would expect to save 20-30% and eventually send them home.
Eight feet of small intestine were removed (it had migrated out a tear in the omentum) and resected. He was a a perfect patient during his thirteen day stay in the hospital. One episode of mild colic that disappeared even before they administered banamine. I was able to bring him home and he began his month-long stall rest. Feeding schedule was strict and other than a handful extra senior feed and 15 minutes grazing rather than 10 in the morning after the first five days, I kept to it and he was amazingly adaptable. I was beginning to believe he would be one of the lucky ones.
One week home, perfect morning graze - didn't even walk around, just stayed in one spot happily tearing and munching. Two hours later I got a call at work that he was in distress. By the time I got there he'd had banamine in his system for 15 minutes and wasn't showing any improvement. We gave him more and 30 minutes later I knew he was in serious trouble as there was no response to the drug. When the vet arrived he checked for gut sounds (very mild), heart rate (elevated) and gums... that's when I could see he was lost to me. An internal exam made it clear - the intestines were displaced.
My vet was experienced with putting horses to sleep and warned me that it could be dicey. But Rumor, as with everything I'd asked of him in the 4 1/2 years we'd been together, did his best and settled quietly to the ground.
All that being said, the reason I'm posting to your forum is to thank each and every one of you for sharing your experiences with and thoughts about colic surgery. I have been in agony this past week, thinking there was something I did wrong, something I missed, something I could have changed. I came upon this thread and read every entry. Until now I didn't know how often healthy horses can have successful surgeries, come home, do well for a while and then tragically fail, without warning.
I don't regret trying to save his life. In many ways he has saved mine. Three years ago I was diagnosed with breast cancer. He was there for me every day, after surgery, chemotherapy and radiation. Always willing to take my mind away from me and focus it on us. If I had it to do over I would do the same thing. He was not insured and we are of moderate means. It will take us some time to cover the expense - approx $12,000 USD. But I don't care. He deserved the chance to live and we got him home. He had one week of quiet rest, pasture mates in for the evening to keep him company, and the food he loved best.
 
Thats BS my old girl had it and was fine after until she was 35 years old when i had to have her PTS due to Cushings, You have one the best for your horse.

Hope he recover soon x
 
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