Colic surgery - would you? Have you?

[{97702}]

Just considering changing insurance companies, and the one I am considering offer vets fees of £3k per incident - now I've had horses long enough to know that it is scarily easy to rack up that much in vets fees

The one expense which came to mind first was colic surgery, but I've always suspected that if it came to that I wouldn't go ahead and would have the horse PTS instead.

I don't wish to upset anyone, that is very much a personal view, but I just wondered how many people had elected to go ahead with colic surgery? Do you feel now that it was the right choice? I suppose what I am getting at is whether I am being too narrow minded not considering it.

 

[be positive]

I had one operated on many years ago, he went in with suspected grass sickness once in and scanned it proved to be an intussusception and the only option was surgery, he survived then had a setback so went in for a second operation 48hours later, he then failed to start his guts working so was going to be pts, the staff took him for a pick of grass and he picked up immediately so came home a week or so later, he had lost loads of weight and looked fairly dreadful but was an excellent patient, made a full recovery and enjoyed a totally normal active life for the next 12 years.
Would I have put him through it if I had known what it would entail, I have no idea as it snowballed once he was there as often seems to be the case when horses get into hospital it can be hard to make a decision to stop treatment when the vets take control, finances would come into play now as his 2 ops and extended stay would probably be in the region of £10k, at the time it was almost all covered by the £1k?? insurance but I think it was slightly different in those days, at a training centre money was not as important as getting experience so I think many ops were done at a far lower cost than they will be now when every swab, dressing, needle, etc will be charged for often at huge mark up.

As for the horse I now own he will never go into hospital again, very bad experience last time he went in, so I have just stopped insuring him there is not much they would pay out for and as colic surgery will not be considered there is little point, having seen the worst of what can happen when a horse goes in for treatment means my views have changed rather.

I would certainly not discount surgery for another horse as long as they are fairly young, are happy to be stabled and the yard has suitable facilities to allow recovery to be well managed, which not all yards can offer, then I would consider it.

 

[ycbm]

A horse I used to own and loved very much even after having to rehome him was operated on. He colicked again at two weeks and was put down. His last two weeks of life were of pain, confinement and confusion. I would never have one of mine operated on.

 

[EQUIDAE]

I know of an eventer who had a horse that had two lots of colic surgery, plus and infected wound. The horse came back to full health and won his first event post surgery in 2015. Less than 12 months between surgery and the win!

 

[HashRouge]

I wouldn't with my current mare, as she is nearly 23 and I would be incredibly worried about her prospects of a healthy recovery. As for a younger, fitter horse, I don't know. A friend of mine lost her mare fairly recently when she came through the op okay but broke her leg in recovery . It is a big decision.

 

[Flame_]

My horse was found in the morning having been ill too long for surgery to have had a good prognosis, however the two horses that went to Leahurst for colic surgery from my yard, one in particular, did not have a good time at all between becoming ill and being put down anyway, so I am glad I could spare my horse that and have him put down quickly at home.

That said, he had a GA and operation to remove a keratoma as a 5 year old which cost the full £5k of vet fees. That did have a good prognosis, was not a traumatic ordeal and was a total success.

I am glad that that money was available when surgery was the right thing to do.

 

[Mrs G]

I had my adored 6yr old tb operated on when he had a sudden, severe colic; he nearly didn't come out of recovery but he rallied and after a week we took him home. Aftercare was hard on him; his incision got infected, then about 6 weeks after the op he started colicking again, then again, and again, getting more frequent and more severe until neither of us could stand any more and he was finally pts. If I could go back I would never have put him through all that suffering, £7000 later (insurance covered £5000 of that) and I still lost him.

 

[Jnhuk]

I was put in this situation last week with my 14 year old gelding who had never colicked to my knowledge before. I have always thought I wouldn't go with colic surgery. On the drive through to the vets, I discussed things with a knowledgeable friend so I was willing to consider it if given my lad was given a reasonable chance. If the vets had given me a more positive outcome following further tests, I probably would have considered it. However, I was advised from their experience of this type of surgical colic (EFE) , outcome was poor and even if went to surgery, vet said from his experience that when they saw the actual damage that they would recommend PTS on the operating table. My vets were brilliant and I am lucky that they are an equine practice and hospital.

PM showed this to be the case.

Horrid situation, such a shock and heartbreaking but at the same time, I just knew it was the right decision to have him PTS.

I think it is one of those things until you are in the situation what you say and what you do may change depending on vet advice, age of horse and also financial impact even with insurance cover.

 

[Pinkvboots]

I wouldn't put one of my horses through it.

 

[Jnhuk]

I had my adored 6yr old tb operated on when he had a sudden, severe colic; he nearly didn't come out of recovery but he rallied and after a week we took him home. Aftercare was hard on him; his incision got infected, then about 6 weeks after the op he started colicking again, then again, and again, getting more frequent and more severe until neither of us could stand any more and he was finally pts. If I could go back I would never have put him through all that suffering, £7000 later (insurance covered £5000 of that) and I still lost him.

Hugs

 

[pepsimaxrock]

I did, and I would certainly consider it again, despite a difficult and uncertain recovery which is ongoing.
We are nearly 6 months from surgery and my mare has had vets consider PTS 5 times. Each time the vet has pulled back from recommending it despite initially suggesting it to me.
I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
This decision takes extraordinarily careful consideration. My dear little mare is now being worked, will start canter this week, is still on steroids and may not yet make a full recovery, if any recovery at all. But she has never (apart from when colicking) been unhappy or miserable and is enjoying life. So it is good we have come this far.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

 

[pepsimaxrock]

Hugs

So so sorry. This could easily - still could be - my situation. Insurance goes nowhere near far enough. Im on around 8k (5k insurance) and she is still with us, but on steroids, coming off them this week. Time will tell. xxx

 

[zigzag]

I wouldn't. Known several horses who have had it and all have been PTS within 3 months of having surgery

 

[jrp204]

No I wouldn't put a horse through it.

 

[ycbm]

I did, and I would certainly consider it again, despite a difficult and uncertain recovery which is ongoing.
We are nearly 6 months from surgery and my mare has had vets consider PTS 5 times. Each time the vet has pulled back from recommending it despite initially suggesting it to me.
I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
This decision takes extraordinarily careful consideration. My dear little mare is now being worked, will start canter this week, is still on steroids and may not yet make a full recovery, if any recovery at all. But she has never (apart from when colicking) been unhappy or miserable and is enjoying life. So it is good we have come this far.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

I am sorry your mare has difficulties recovering, but it is precisely because of stories like yours, which I read at length on your thread that I would not put a horse of mine through it.

I have considered the alternative. I have the money. I care for them as much as you care for yours. There is only one alternative, it's a quick clean death. It's what I will choose for any horse of mine which has serious colic.

I realise that you have written this in an emotional state, and seem to be taking the fact that other people would make a different decision as some kind of criticism, but you have been downright offensive in this post.

 

[Wagtail]

I don't think I can answer this question until I am faced with it. I lost a horse a few years ago after colic surgery. He was a very big lad at around 800kilos and just being on his back through the surgery paralysed him and he couldn't get back up again so was PTS. I so wish I had had him PTS at home and saved the long journey the night, and him being PTS surrounded by strangers. If my little mare needed surgery, I really don't know what I'd do. She's a much smaller and lighter horse so hopefully the same thing wouldn't happen, but I don't think she's do well at box rest. My head says that if faced with the question, I should let her go. Then I hear the success stories and I waver. I think every person who really loves their horse will make the decision in the best interests of the horse. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't. But it is unfair to say those who decide to PTS do not love their horses as much as those who choose surgery. The horse I lost was not insured. We paid for his surgery on our credit card. It was not money we had spare. But probably, despite my mare being insured, I would have to follow my head on this one.

 

[Buddy'sMum]

I am sorry your mare has difficulties recovering, but it is precisely because of stories like yours, which I read at length on your thread that I would not put a horse of mine through it.

I have considered the alternative. I have the money. I care for them as much as you care for yours. There is only one alternative, it's a quick clean death. It's what I will choose for any horse of mine which has serious colic.

I realise that you have written this in an emotional state, and seem to be taking the fact that other people would make a different decision as some kind of criticism, but you have been downright offensive in this post.

Couldn't agree more.

 

[{97702}]

I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
This decision takes extraordinarily careful consideration. My dear little mare is now being worked, will start canter this week, is still on steroids and may not yet make a full recovery, if any recovery at all. But she has never (apart from when colicking) been unhappy or miserable and is enjoying life. So it is good we have come this far.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

Wow - well I am sorry that you have gone through such a difficult time with your mare, but as others have said that is incredibly offensive and factually incorrect

 

[Tiddlypom]

Whether you would send a horse in for colic surgery aside (I wouldn't), it seems to be rather easy to rack up 5k of vets bills for a number of other conditions, eg PSD. Just something to consider.

 

[Starzaan]

Wow - well I am sorry that you have gone through such a difficult time with your mare, but as others have said that is incredibly offensive and factually incorrect

This absolutely. Your post has really upset me. I had my darling six year old PTS when he was colicking and battling toxic shock. I had the option of surgery but I would never have done that to him. Watching him suffer just whilst waiting for the vet was hard enough.

That does NOT mean that I didn't care about him or that I 'didn't give a ****'.

How nasty. I understand that you are writing this from an emotional place, and I'm sorry to hear you've had a hard time with your mare, but please don't tell others they are heartless just because they made a different decision to you.

 

[PorkChop]

I couldn't say yes or no until I was faced with the scenario tbh - though all I would say is that I would always insure for 5k Vets fees. It can be easily racked up to this in a short space of time with many injuries/illnesses.

What I am saying is if you are going to bother to insure, then get the best policy and coverage you can.

 

[MotherOfChickens]

I did, and I would certainly consider it again, despite a difficult and uncertain recovery which is ongoing.
We are nearly 6 months from surgery and my mare has had vets consider PTS 5 times. Each time the vet has pulled back from recommending it despite initially suggesting it to me.
I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
This decision takes extraordinarily careful consideration. My dear little mare is now being worked, will start canter this week, is still on steroids and may not yet make a full recovery, if any recovery at all. But she has never (apart from when colicking) been unhappy or miserable and is enjoying life. So it is good we have come this far.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

I wish you and your horse many more happy years together.I've known some come back very well.
Well, personally I would not although I'd not judge anyone else for doing it. As an equine VN I was present at maybe 100 surgical colics back in the 90s, probably more over three years tbh, most of which went on to make some sort of recovery, some of them also came back for further surgery.

My horse is insured right now, but I will not put myself in debt or put myself through the same emotional turmoil that I did with my last horse (over something else) with a condition that has a very guarded prognosis, or a horse through the same level of box rest etc that he went through. It doesn't mean that I am tight, uncaring or ignorant-I would be doing whats right for me and mine.

 

[twiggy2]

I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

I would defend your right to choose, but I work at a vets and would not consider colic surgery an option for any horse in my care, the medical notes for my horse and pony both say no colic surgery in case I was in the unlikely position as to be uncontactable if the worst happened. Cost would not be an issue due to working at the vets, I have considered it often as I have witnessed many horses and ponies before and after surgery, I have had many frank discussions about it with my vets, I care enough for my horse that I have given it the thought I have and IMO the surgery is too invasive, the recovery too long, the life long management to restrictive (for the horse and me) and the risks too great. So it is not an option that I would take, this does not make me 'holier than thou' it just means I have a different view to you.

 

[CBFan]

I did, and I would certainly consider it again, despite a difficult and uncertain recovery which is ongoing.
We are nearly 6 months from surgery and my mare has had vets consider PTS 5 times. Each time the vet has pulled back from recommending it despite initially suggesting it to me.
I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
This decision takes extraordinarily careful consideration. My dear little mare is now being worked, will start canter this week, is still on steroids and may not yet make a full recovery, if any recovery at all. But she has never (apart from when colicking) been unhappy or miserable and is enjoying life. So it is good we have come this far.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

Holier than thou? Have you read your own words?? I too am very sorry for what you have had to go through with your mare but please don't judge people for making the decision for a quick, clean end to their horse's suffering. Many of us would pay much more than we have to keep our horses with us and choosing to let them go is one of the most selfless things we can do.

 

[LD&S]

I did, and I would certainly consider it again, despite a difficult and uncertain recovery which is ongoing.
We are nearly 6 months from surgery and my mare has had vets consider PTS 5 times. Each time the vet has pulled back from recommending it despite initially suggesting it to me.
I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
This decision takes extraordinarily careful consideration. My dear little mare is now being worked, will start canter this week, is still on steroids and may not yet make a full recovery, if any recovery at all. But she has never (apart from when colicking) been unhappy or miserable and is enjoying life. So it is good we have come this far.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

Not only do I think your assumption is harsh I think quite frankly it is ridiculous, every case, every horse has to be treated as an individual, some have other medical problems that would make box rest a problem some are probably well enough under normal circumstances to potter happily round the field but may not be able to cope with surgery. My little mare who I lost last year had a heart murmur and COPD, there is no way I would have put her through surgery because I had 'considered it properly.

 

[Orca]

It is very unlikely that I would opt for colic surgery.

She is well insured.

I give a *****

 

[madlady]

I did, and I would certainly consider it again, despite a difficult and uncertain recovery which is ongoing.
We are nearly 6 months from surgery and my mare has had vets consider PTS 5 times. Each time the vet has pulled back from recommending it despite initially suggesting it to me.
I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
This decision takes extraordinarily careful consideration. My dear little mare is now being worked, will start canter this week, is still on steroids and may not yet make a full recovery, if any recovery at all. But she has never (apart from when colicking) been unhappy or miserable and is enjoying life. So it is good we have come this far.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

And you aren't being holier than thou and completely offensive in what you have posted?

I would never put any of mine through colic surgery precisely because I know all the risks and recovery issues but then I'm not a 'keep them alive at all costs' type of person - that is because I put the welfare of my horses in front of my emotions.

 

[Apercrumbie]

I did, and I would certainly consider it again, despite a difficult and uncertain recovery which is ongoing.
We are nearly 6 months from surgery and my mare has had vets consider PTS 5 times. Each time the vet has pulled back from recommending it despite initially suggesting it to me.
I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
This decision takes extraordinarily careful consideration. My dear little mare is now being worked, will start canter this week, is still on steroids and may not yet make a full recovery, if any recovery at all. But she has never (apart from when colicking) been unhappy or miserable and is enjoying life. So it is good we have come this far.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

Or because after weighing up all the options we know that it isn't the right thing for our horses. My boy is nearly 20, he has to have sedalin for box rest and is very prone to laminitis so cannot have steroids. Even if he made it through the surgery, which is a huge strain on such a large animal, his recovery would be miserable and as he cannot have steroids, it would be likely that there would be serious complications post-surgery. At the moment, I probably wouldn't put him through the surgery, even though it would completely break my heart. Your comments about not giving a s*** are really insensitive.

 

[supsup]

I did, and I would certainly consider it again, despite a difficult and uncertain recovery which is ongoing.
We are nearly 6 months from surgery and my mare has had vets consider PTS 5 times. Each time the vet has pulled back from recommending it despite initially suggesting it to me.
I find anyone who posts "I wouldn't put one of my horses through it" has either not considered it properly, isnt insured and cant afford it, or doesnt care for his/her horses enough.
This decision takes extraordinarily careful consideration. My dear little mare is now being worked, will start canter this week, is still on steroids and may not yet make a full recovery, if any recovery at all. But she has never (apart from when colicking) been unhappy or miserable and is enjoying life. So it is good we have come this far.
It actually angers me when holier than thou folks say they would never put their horses through it. Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

Actually, I sort of agree with some of the above statement - it takes careful consideration for each and every individual situation. Not that every horse should undergo colic surgery, but I don't understand why anybody would make a firm decision against surgery ahead of time. You can't possibly know what the situation will be should the question arise. I would arm myself with all the information possible, but still reserve the decision for the moment when it has to be made, depending on the type of colic, time that has passed, vet's opinion on the horse's chances etc.
I know several horses who had colic surgery and recovered fully. They continue(d) to live as normal a life as previously. I've also known a 45 year old donkey who came through colic surgery fine! (In his case, I'd probably have called it a day, but he did recover well and had a few more years.)

 

[Casey76]

Because I dont think they have properly considered it or the alternatives, or they dont give a s***

How dare you!

You have no idea what other people have gone through. Just because you put your mare through surgery, and months and months of difficult recovery, doesn't mean that because other people wouldn't do the same that it is because they don't give a ****.