colour question please

Stinkbomb

Stinkbomb

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Inky has another mare coming on saturday. Fingers crossed for next year after our disapointment this year!

Anyway she is a little "blue and white" mare. Ive no idea what this colour actually is??

Im trying to work out foal colours but dont know what to put in for the mare. Are blue and whites just greys or are they classed as colourdes???

Ive no picture as yet but trying to get one.

many thanks
 
Generally blue and white is a 'grey coloured' - so if your using one of the online foal colour calculator you would put the mare 'genetic base coat' if you know it down then tick the box for grey and coloured.
 
I know it sounds odd, but in the last pic of your sig, Inky (I assume its him???) looks almost 'blue and white' so the mare could actually be similar to him?
The only proper 'blue' I hav seen has been like a blue roan and white....so that base colour would be black wouldnt it?
I'll stop now - I think Im confusing matters somewhat!! ;)
 
It's hard to know for sure. The mare could be any base colour with tobiano (or other 'coloured' pattern and going grey, this is what a lot of 'blue and whites' are. She could also be blue roan tobiano which would be completely different. Can you ask the owner what colour she was born? Either way she will be classed as coloured I think.
 
Rosehip said:
I know it sounds odd, but in the last pic of your sig, Inky (I assume its him???) looks almost 'blue and white' so the mare could actually be similar to him?
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Thats not Inky!!!:eek:
Ooohhh stick around, you will soon know all about his Inkyness!
He is the dappled mini NEXT to the coloured mini in Stinkbomb's sig!
Colour......not a clue:D
 
joeanne said:
Thats not Inky!!!:eek:
Ooohhh stick around, you will soon know all about his Inkyness!
He is the dappled mini NEXT to the coloured mini in Stinkbomb's sig!
Colour......not a clue:D
Click to expand...

Thats Ty my gelding :) Inky is Silver Dapple, no grey :)

These are some pics of the mare, darker in winter, lighter in summer.

Her sire was a spotted and we believe the mares dam was also a blue and white but not sure. So even though she isnt spotted could she still pass on spots to her foal?? Im totally confused now :confused: How do i put spots into the equation?

IMG00636-20110417-1336.jpg

150231_1684021149289_1500441854_31678074_3358964_n.jpg
 
Stinkbomb said:
Thats Ty my gelding :) Inky is Silver Dapple, no grey :)

These are some pics of the mare, darker in winter, lighter in summer.

Her sire was a spotted and we believe the mares dam was also a blue and white but not sure. So even though she isnt spotted could she still pass on spots to her foal?? Im totally confused now :confused: How do i put spots into the equation?

IMG00636-20110417-1336.jpg

150231_1684021149289_1500441854_31678074_3358964_n.jpg
Click to expand...


The mare looks grey and white to me (as opposed to blue roan and white). Aside from seasonal changes is she getting lighter overall as she gets older? If so her foal has a 50% chance of grey. Add in the spots to the equation and we NEED KarynK!!

It will be so exciting waiting for the foal :)
 
Oooops!! My bad! Sorry! I just presumed that was Inky when he was younger? Duh!! So sorry Stinkbomb!!
I would also say that the mare was grey and white rather than blue....but I have no idea at all! Sorry! xx
 
Sorry been a little busy! You don't make it easy Stinkbomb do you!

The easy bit
50% chance of Tobiano (If dad wasn't a pintaloosa of course)
50% chance of grey (she is grey)
50% chance of inheriting the silver (or is inky homozygous?)

Questions do you know if Inky carries chestnut?
The mare might be black based, but we don't know for sure since grey turns most of the hair dark and by her age you probably wouldn't know her base colour unless there are foal pics. But she might be/carry chestnut. Do we know any more about her parents?

Actually I have a question for people with greys does anyone have a horse that is/was dapple grey that was born a chestnut?

Then the spots, you can't really tell from the pics if she has any appaloosa markings herself, or any characteristics, but all you need is the tiniest bit of mottled skin (JanaNI will tell you that!) and the skin can be anywhere including in the mouth! Then if there is something in the mating that adds power to the appaloosa genes away you go, but probably when appaloosa fades that much then it will be the varnish that you get as opposed to spots or snowcaps, so born all or very near solid and gradually colouring out.
 
I have a grey/chesnut Karyn, she was dappled until she was about 10 with a black mane and tail and is now very very very liver spotted (chestnut spots) and her mane and tail are pure white :). She is now 31 and is heterozygous grey.
 
Actually I have a question for people with greys does anyone have a horse that is/was dapple grey that was born a chestnut?
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Oooh! I can help you there! :D My filly's sire is a dapple grey and he was born chestnut. :) Another interesting point about both of them- they had/have dorsal stripes.

Calimeer (arab)
Calimeer.jpg


Calameershow.jpg


As a foal (yes, he is in the kitchen. The photo was taken and then he was put back to his paddock- the joys of having your land right by your house! ;) ).
flossyssire.jpg
 
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My stallion Scallys Missile was born liver chesnut with blase and two hind socks....he was more browny liver than reddy liver.
He was bayie greyie roany as yearling by 4yo was very dappled grey, the dark bits were black and not much evidence of chesnut.
He then started getting chesnut flea bites and the black dapples faded.
At 20yo he is white almost with chesnut fleabites.

His 2009 son out of bay mare, was normal chesnut at birth but had grey hairs already and went very light grey early.

His 2005 son out of bay mare was born bay but has taken same route as his dad so far..he is dappled with some bay but looks dark chesnut fleabites coming through on forehead at 6yo.
 
My stallion Scallys Missile was born liver chesnut with blase and two hind socks....he was more browny liver than reddy liver.
He was bayie greyie roany as yearling by 4yo was very dappled grey, the dark bits were black and not much evidence of chesnut.
He then started getting chesnut flea bites and the black dapples faded.
At 20yo he is white almost with chesnut fleabites.

His 2009 son out of bay mare, was normal chesnut at birth but had grey hairs already and went very light grey early.

His 2005 son out of bay mare was born bay but has taken same route as his dad so far..he is dappled with some bay but looks dark chesnut fleabites coming through on forehead at 6yo.
 
ooh like Faracat I had a chestnut turned grey arab! Born chestnut (sire grey and dam chestnut) from Shadwell Stud and it said chestnut on her passport. I got her at 2 and she was "pink", then turned dapple grey and now with her new owners at about 7 she is pretty much white.
 
I wish that I owned Calimeer, he's lovely. I do have his wonderful daughter though. She's a grey (born chestnut) too but I don't think that she'll ever have dapples. :( She is getting some rather striking chestnut fleabites coming through in her summer coat, which I love (she was almost white last year). :D

ETA
I got her at 2 and she was "pink",
Click to expand...

^ That sounds like a good excuse to post a photo of my filly in her 'pink' stage. ;) :p

Flossygrazing.jpg
 
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Loving this thread, v interesting.
My mare's chestnut, out of a grey & a bay, I've put her to Rubin Star N, he's black. Any ideas what might come out? Sorry hope I'm not hijacking this thread:-)
 
The chestnut mare can only pass on chestnut. Is the stallion homozygous (has two copies of the black gene) or heterozygous (one black and one chestnut)? Has he got any chestnut foals?
 
KarynK said:
Actually I have a question for people with greys does anyone have a horse that is/was dapple grey that was born a chestnut?

My arabian (Al Hakkim/Gemma Rose) was born chestnut, was faintly dappled as a 10 year old when I bought him, by 12 he was pure white, by 14 his chestnut colour fleabites were popping out daily! At 10:
scan0004.jpg


Then if there is something in the mating that adds power to the appaloosa genes away you go, but probably when appaloosa fades that much then it will be the varnish that you get as opposed to spots or snowcaps, so born all or very near solid and gradually colouring out.
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Interesting about the appaloosas colouring out, I have a Boarder here, a yearling QH/Appy that appears chestnut but with all the the typical mottled sclera, as he is shedding out his rump is going noticably roan which his owner says he didn't have last summer.
 
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KarynK said:
Sorry been a little busy! You don't make it easy Stinkbomb do you!

The easy bit
50% chance of Tobiano (If dad wasn't a pintaloosa of course)
50% chance of grey (she is grey)
50% chance of inheriting the silver (or is inky homozygous?)

Questions do you know if Inky carries chestnut?
The mare might be black based, but we don't know for sure since grey turns most of the hair dark and by her age you probably wouldn't know her base colour unless there are foal pics. But she might be/carry chestnut. Do we know any more about her parents?

Actually I have a question for people with greys does anyone have a horse that is/was dapple grey that was born a chestnut?

Then the spots, you can't really tell from the pics if she has any appaloosa markings herself, or any characteristics, but all you need is the tiniest bit of mottled skin (JanaNI will tell you that!) and the skin can be anywhere including in the mouth! Then if there is something in the mating that adds power to the appaloosa genes away you go, but probably when appaloosa fades that much then it will be the varnish that you get as opposed to spots or snowcaps, so born all or very near solid and gradually colouring out.
Click to expand...

Yes Inky carries the red gene hes been tested, and he is heterozygous Silver. Not sure about her parents other than her dad was a spotted and they believe her mum was another blue and white. She is now with me so ill check for any spotted characterists!!

Might just have to wait till next year for the answers to this one!!! :D

Now what would happen if the foal was tobiano, silver and grey?? As silvers dont fade but Grey does? :confused:
 
Stinkbomb said:
...
Now what would happen if the foal was tobiano, silver and grey?? As silvers dont fade but Grey does? :confused:
Click to expand...

Grey rules all in colour genetics so whilst you may get a coloured spotted dapple if it inherits mum's grey gene it will eventually fade to white.
 
KarynK said:
Grey rules all in colour genetics so whilst you may get a coloured spotted dapple if it inherits mum's grey gene it will eventually fade to white.
Click to expand...

Crikey! Let's hope this mare holds as I really would like to see what colour the foal turns out.

Imagine a horse with Inky's colouring and with lots of white!

Karyn, would the silver dapple be 'over-ridden' by the grey gene then? I love this colour stuff:)
 
Our foal this time looked bay (sadly died) def had a brown body and black mane & tail, so what are the odds then oh gurus! Assuming that we are lucky this time round ;-) fingers & everything crossed!!
 
Enfys said:
Crikey! Let's hope this mare holds as I really would like to see what colour the foal turns out.

Imagine a horse with Inky's colouring and with lots of white!

Karyn, would the silver dapple be 'over-ridden' by the grey gene then? I love this colour stuff:)
Click to expand...

Yes I'm afraid so grey is not actually a colour gene at all, there is always a coat colour or colours underneath it so to speak. What is does is strip all the pigment from the hair. Some go grey more slowly, some have patches on them that never go grey and some colour out a bit more with age getting "flea bites" of colour comming back into the coat and sometimes whole patches return. there have been a couple of horses that don't show any signs of greying until the are several years old but these are really rare.

The grey gene is very closely associated with melanomas which are tumours of the melanocyte cells that contol the black skin pigment and sometimes these turn very nasty. They think that the grey gene is from a mutation in a single horse and men liked the colour so bred more, so all greys will go back to that one horse!
 
Sorry Stinkbomb - Spotties are a rule unto themselves and can hide grey if they are born nearly white or are not spotted but have the varish (roan) coat pattern alone. spotties tend to ward off grey for a long time but eventually if they have it the spots will disappear, where as the varnish leaves those alone. I believe that there are quite a lot of spotted ponies that also have grey, but if the dad was spotty and never lost them then it's very unlikely that he did have grey. It will be interesting to see what happens with this foal!!!
 
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