Competing in Germany - under BD membership - how does this work?

[Andiamo]

Hi all,

I've moved to Germany, and would like to ask if anyone knows about how to compete here (low levels! not FEI!)...

I spoke to BD, and they said I just have to keep my BD membership going, and I have to speak to the German authority (what's it called?) to find out about competing on the BD membership. Firstly, I don't know which authority to call, secondly, I'm going to struggle with this phone call, because I may not understand everything they say... (German conversation)...is there any benefit to staying on the BD membership? or is it better to get a German membership for competing?

It'll be with a young horse, 4 years old, so starting at the baby levels obviously, Prelim (E) / Novice (A) this year.

Many thanks! Lots of German choccies to those who can help

By the way, I'm in Tack Shop heaven over here! They're massive, with rails upon rails (each rail about 40 feet long) of every imaginable size and colour and length of Pikeur and Cavallo jods... it's pure bliss!!! (bad for the credit cards though!)

Andiamo xx

 

[TarrSteps]

I don't know how it works specifically in Germany but if you are going to compete in recognised completions anywhere in the world you are supposed to be a member of your national FN and then get dispensation to compete abroad. You may or may not also have to be a member of the FN where you are competing, depending on the rules.

In practice I suppose people do just join the new FN but presumably you will need competion history to determine your rider level etc so just ignoring the issue isn't likely to work.

I would suspect someone in the German FN speaks perfect English. You might be best to start with an email and get the right contact, rather than phoning. Forgive my impertenence but do you not have a German OH who can handle this for you?

Edited because I forgot to add the link to the FN!

http://www.fnverlag.com/

 

[Andiamo]

Nice one TarrSteps, you've got an incredible memory...

I'll try to call the FN, and hope to find someone who speaks English, otherwise I may have to resort to having a German-speaking non-horsey person call on my behalf, although they may not understand the responses they get, for an entirely different reason!

Thank you for the link

 

[TarrSteps]

Your messages are full!

 

[Andiamo]

thanks for letting me know - I've just done some mailbox maintenance! there should be space now!

 

[Andiamo]

I think actually the link above is for the publishing arm of the German FN - they are the publishers of many riding books. I think this is probably the FN page - http://www.pferd-aktuell.de/ - I will try to ring someone on Monday.

 

[TarrSteps]

I think you're right! I did it quickly on the phone so probably stuck in the wrong link, sorry!

 

[spookypony]

I can help translate, if needed...

I'm in the opposite boat, with added complications: I have dual Canadian/German citizenship, and want to join BD. What I've been told is that I don't need to actually join the Canadian and German federations (would be prohibitive, paying a total of 6 memberships, for 2 disciplines in 3 countries!), but need to provide evidence of my competition record (or lack thereof). The German endurance body actually seems unsure if I need to be a member of them or not; the form for the "Foreign Country Competition License" would seem to indicate this, but it might only be for long distances. The Dressage people were quite clear that I don't have to join, but I am supposed to provide paperwork that doesn't appear to exist in the UK. Since SERC don't appear to care about nationality, I'm just going to hold off until the Ballerina Mare and I are ready to affiliate.

One thing I know is that in Germany, to compete above a certain level (it may be above E), you have to have sat specific riding exams analogous to, but not identical to, the Stages. As far as I am aware, they do not recognise qualifications from the UK (fair enough; the UK don't recognise German ones). The other thing to be aware of is that many Prelim-level tests (E) are ridden in a ride (Abteilung), rather than by oneself. Having never competed in Germany, this is something I found quite startling when I joined a German horsey forum, but apparently, their comps can have hundreds in each class, so I guess it makes sense.

 

[Booboos]

Going from my vague recollection of FrodoBeutlin's posts from when she was in Germany I think you either have to pass the rather demanding German exams or apply to compete on a foreign license which I think is restricted to 6 competitions per year.

 

[GermanyJo]

You need to join the fn, then if you want to compete above E level, you need to take an exam (klein reitabzeichen), they are several more exams to take on order to move up the levels, and you also need to get above a certain mark to 'confirm the exam in order to progress, sounds a lot of faff, however to compete here, you pay your fn membership, horse registration, and this is for sj, dressage and eventing, so much cheaper than UK ;-) give me a shout if you want some more info, whereabouts are you?

 

[GermanyJo]

Forgot to say, you also need to maintain bhs membership, I have the cheapest option possible, and then fax the 'allowance to ride' to the bhs to stamp and sign, send on to fn every year,

 

[Andiamo]

Thanks Booboos - I wondered about that - if I ride under BD, then am I limited to a certain number of comps in a year in Germany.

Thanks GermanyJo - very helpful. But riding under BD should mean you don't have to do the Reitabzeichen, no? I don't want to do the Reitabzeichen for one main reason - the jumping part of it (after breaking my back whilst jumping, I'm terrified at the thought of it). I like to keep all 4 feet on the ground. I understand that to avoid the jumping part of the Reitabzeichen, you then have to ride at L (Elementary level), and then you only have to do the dressage part of the test. That would be fine...but my new horse is only 4...which would mean we can't go anywhere for 1-2 years... I would like to get him out to some comps, just to get him used to the whole environment.

Does Unaffiliated exist in Germany?

 

[GermanyJo]

Sadly unaffiliated doesn't exist :-(, although you can compete at E level with no qualifications (preliminary), although as someone has already said, you have 3 or 4 people riding one behind the other in the test , which is a bit of a shock to start with .
There are some centres where you can do a week course and use one of their horses, or get friends with someone with an L horse and ask if you can do on theirs ;-) the test is fairly easy, just the theory in German was a bit challenging for me at the time :-D.

 

[Andiamo]

ah right, I hadn't thought about that - using a horse at L level for the test...there is a horse I ride that could probably borrow... does it matter what level the horse is at? can it be higher than L (this one's PSG).

I actually really like the thought of having three doing the test together in the arena - it's perfect for a youngster - they don't have to go into a big scary arena on their own. It should make it much easier for them in terms of nerves.

@GermanyJo - do you know the name of the Reitabzeichen that lets you go in at L? - so I can order the theory book and start trying to understand what is written )

 

[spookypony]

Here is the link for "Guest Licence" for foreign competitors: http://www.pferd-aktuell.de/fn-serv...er-auslaendische-turnierteilnehmer/gastlizenz

And for the contact you want, go to this one: http://www.pferd-aktuell.de/fn/ansprechpartner/ansprechpartner, click on FN-Service - Jahresturnierlizenzen; the one you want is Ralf Sennhenn.

 

[GermanyJo]

Doesnt matter what level the horse is to go to L you need the bronze

 

[GermanyJo]

You are right with the multiple horses, but it can back fire if you have a nutter behind you who starts to buck, or (and I had this) you have to ride behind a pony, and then you get a comment of 'walk restricted'.. I was trying to avoid actually walking over the pony!!, but hey, that's dressage ;-) . The eventing comps are not so full so they are normally individual dressage so i don't mind much ;-)

 

[Andiamo]

Thanks @ SpookyPony - very helpful link....now can you explain what it says? There's something about a year's licence...but then it also talks about getting a pass for 4 shows, for 82€. I'm not sure I understand.

GermanyJo- yes, I can imagine these examples would cause some complications in the multi-horse test! every horse's pace is different, so it could be tricky to avoid running over everyone or getting lapped - depending on the size of your equine partner.

 

[Andiamo]

example of a multi-horse test in Germany... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgUUttH-Q4Q


This is more interesting...two doing the same test (but they are a mirror reflection of each other - one starts it facing in one direction, and the other rider is facing the other direction) - somehow it works with no collisions! - tip - switch the music off unless you're a big Celine Dion fan...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZzPlOthxaM

 

[spookypony]

Thanks @ SpookyPony - very helpful link....now can you explain what it says? There's something about a year's licence...but then it also talks about getting a pass for 4 shows, for 82€. I'm not sure I understand.

Ah, I just read it in more detail. The issue seems to be that especially near borders, peeps from across the border might want to nip across for a competition. So those peeps can buy a license to cover up to 4 comps; if they want to do up to 8, they need to pay the same fee again.

For those actually resident in Germany, there is another option:

Ausländische Reiter, Fahrer und Voltigierer, die in Deutschland leben, können ab dem Beginn ihres Aufenthaltes in Deutschland eine FN-Jahresturnierlizenz beantragen. Voraussetzung ist eine schriftliche Einverständniserklärung der FN des jeweiligen Heimatlandes. Ansonsten gelten die Bestimmungen des § 20 sinngemäß.

Foreign riders, drivers and vaulters who live in Germany can apply, from the beginning of their stay in Germany, for a FN-year-long competition license. Prerequisite is a written statement of agreement from the FN of the home country. Furthermore, the rules of paragraph 20 are applicable.



Bei der Erstausstellung erfolgt auf Antrag die Einstufung in eine Leistungsklasse (Reiten/Fahren)/KLasse (Voltigieren) gemäß § 63 auf der Grundlage bisheriger Erfolge im Heimat- bzw. Ausland; rechtfertigen die Turniererfolge diese Einstufung, sind ausländische Reiter und Fahrer von der Nachweispflicht des Reit-/Fahrabzeichens gemäß § 20.3 befreit, andernfalls ist eine entsprechende Prüfung nachzuweisen.

When [this license] is first issued, on application the rider is classified into a level [...] according to paragraph 63, on the basis of previous results in the home country or, as applicable, foreign country. If the competition results justify this classification, then foreign riders and drivers are exempt from the burden of proving that they hold the [applicable] riding or driving qualification, according to paragraph 20.3. In other cases, evidence of having passed a corresponding test needs to be provided.

The way I read this, if you have affiliated results with BD etc. then the requirement for the Reitabzeichen can be waived, and you can be put into a rider group on equivalence. This actually makes sense, therefore I am suspicious!

 

[TarrSteps]

. This actually makes sense, therefore I am suspicious!

That made me laugh. . .because I thought exactly the same thing!