complete mistake in gifting a horse

[honetpot]

In my experience it matter what you sell a pony for, I sold one for £2,500, I had done all my research, the person had been recommended by a friend , they had competed at the highest level. The pony is back in my field, I paid less than 10% of what I sold him for.
People will do anything not to admit they can not cope, will rationalise black is white to contort themselves out of the situation. I would send someone else, they have been caught out so may not want to deal,and stump up the money, they will not want to lose face. She sounds the sort they will put in foal, to get some money out of her. Good luck

 

[touchstone]

I have no issues in the op buying the pony initially, but would anyone 'rescue' a pony, which then is proven to rear and pass it on as a ridden prospect without resolving it's issues? It screams a recipefor disaster to me. Plus to say that it is okay to pass on but would like to be told first doesn't smack of securing this pony's future. It would have been better to have not bought the section A as a companion and kept the mare in the first place.

 

[ihatework]

I would get a friend to go and buy her back, or a partner or whatever, if they are going to be funny with you. That way you get her back and they don't get to avoid you.

I think this is a sensible suggestion - send a friend with the £400 and ask them to haggle but not come home without her

 

[madlady]

OP I think you've had some uneccesarily harsh comments - you thought you were giving the mare a chance at a good home where she would be brought on and eventually ridden, nothing wrong with that at all.

If you want her back to secure her future then go for it. As others have said might be better to send someone else with money as the current owner could get defensive if you turn up yourself. Is there someone who could go on your behalf? Send them along with £150 and I'm sure they will bring her home for that. Worst case scenario it might cost you a little more but personally I'd pay it.

Good luck, hope she is home with you soon.

 

[Maesfen]

I think this is a sensible suggestion - send a friend with the £400 and ask them to haggle but not come home without her

Spot on!

 

[windand rain]

No wish to be harsh at all and yes getting her back will secure her future but sadly those buying pathetic, ill bred, badly produced ponies with the view to rescuing them just condemn twice as many to a miserable existance and if no one bought them even for a few pennies the trade would stop. Mind you for every filly there will be a colt who will likely be dumped and or knocked on the head or starved to death and that applies not just to the lower end breeder but those who breed for the magic perfect one. Only way to stop it is to stop the market and have a pts for free policy from the charities so those that are not going to find a home die without the suffering.

Sorry OP I know your intentions started out good but like many other heart overruled head and it resulted in another pickle for you and the pony. Get her back if you have the resources to keep her for the rest of her days but I agree she is about valueless so the best thing to do is make your offer and either get a friend to inquire or just pay up

 

[jrp204]

[

Sorry OP I know your intentions started out good but like many other heart overruled head and it resulted in another pickle for you and the pony. Get her back if you have the resources to keep her for the rest of her days but I agree she is about valueless so the best thing to do is make your offer and either get a friend to inquire or just pay up[/QUOTE]

Not sure she has 'ended up in a pickle'? The pony was advertised with its issues disclosed and was taken on by someone who probably was a little dishonest with the truth (they probably thought they could turn the pony around for a fast buck) when they were proved wrong they sold the pony on for peanuts, probably to someone else who thought they could do the same. OP should actually be praised for trying to get the pony back as opposed to getting flack from the H&H judge & jury. Fortunately the pony has only been handed on a couple of times and will hopefully be back with the OP soon where her future will be secure one way or another,

 

[RunToEarth]

Not sure why OP is coming in for the HHO treatment - she acted in good faith.

Recognising the horse had complex issues and then giving her away free to a good home after "rescuing" her is not my definition of good faith.

I agree with Shils, I wish people would stop encouraging the breeding of indiscriminate horses by buying "rescues" and then giving them away to idiots. It just fuels the cycle of breeding utter crap.

 

[unicornystar]

I can't get my head round why you sold something with rearing issues and behavioural issues and expected it to make a good riding pony?!

Anyway, personally I would pay the money if it means that much to you, for me if I cared that much, other than finding the money there would be no decision to be made, I would just do it. £400 for horses these days is a month's livery or a few bales of large hay!!!

I have a horse that is known to rear and cost me £1, I would NEVER dream of selling him on, not ever.....he is way too complex!

 

[Equi]

2. A horse that has no value to you, is unlikely to be valued by another. Its the horse equivalent of throwing your horse away. And the sort of people who will take a free horse are idiots, opportunists looking to lie about it and sell on fast, or (possibly the best option) meat men.

This is not true of all of them. Not by far. My little mare was old and fat and had not had the farrier for a year or teeth done ever and not wormed in years. She is basically a big endless money drain with her issue of lameness and hyperthyroid things and she is for lack of a better word utterly usless to anyone. But i love her with all my heart and she is here for life, health issues or not.

I don't however claim to have rescued her. Her owner had dementia, and pretty much forgot she exissited most of the time. I just brought her from that home to mine, and helped her get in a bit better condition. Bought the owner a drink in the pub to seal the deal as it were. Funny thing was after she left, he remembered about her every day and would ask anyone he knew how she was doing.


OP i think you have realised it was pretty silly to gift the horse with her issues to someone as a riding horse. She may be fixable by a professional rider who you PAY not give to. I would personally keep trying the lady to get her back and be bold and tell her you know where she is from and you want her back. IF it backfires, get £400 and send a friend to buy her.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

This poor pony seems to have met more than her fair share of dishonest numpties in her relatively short life. But there is no point in going over that all over again.

OP, if you want the pony and genuinely intend to either keep her as an unridden companion or pts FGS send a friend with £400 cash and a vehicle to buy her on your behalf. They will probably get her for about half that if they go about it properly.

Then make a resolution that if you ever have another equine that is companion only material, you will not pass it on except as a loan with a water-tight contract, or better yet, pts..

 

[Jaymarie]

Thanks so much for supportive comments.

I fully understand I'm hindsight I shouldn't have let her go in the first place. I didn't think loan was her best option as generally people like to be on control.

And it was foolish of me to think that her bad habits could be cured, but her rearing was by no means extreme and I am generally an optimist.

I if course have the money to buy her please do not assume I do not have the means to afford her, I was just wondering whether anybody else would bother trying to barter the price down, as surely she can't think that 350 pound increase in one week is right. I really don't feel she will get the money for her but I don't think its worth risking now.

So now it's just a question of getting a friend to go and try and barter a but but either way bring her home or going myself. I managed to get contact with her today after telling her I would increase my budget which is a good sign.

As for the "fuelling the breeding of rescue horses" travellers have always and will always overbreed and buy and sell and generally don't like to sell to the public so I don't see how this particular case has funded the market. But I appreciate that is your view however I am of the opposite view, life is too short to think of the politics of it all, if a horse is in need rescue van only be a good thing in my eyes.

Thanks again and touch wood I will have her back over this weekend.

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

I think legally you can claim ownership as no money changed hands, that is why most horses are sold even for a £1.00.
I sympathise with OP, she did what she thought was best at the time, it was the friend who could not cope, and then did the wrong thing.
One way out is to tell the woman you will give her £100 more than she paid and will come and get it now, thus indicating OP has knowledge of the horse, and muttering about the ad and how people lie etc etc. How trading standards have views on people who sell horses, and then dealers have to declare their earnings etc etc..... How facebook is so public these days etc...........

If this fails, the woman would not usually be able to tell if someone else was sent by OP, and even if she did suspect it, she would probably take £100-£200 in order to get rid of it.
After getting the horse back wait two months then alert Mr Taxman and make a complaint to Trading Standards, that is the best way to stop these people.

 

[Morgan123]

Good for you for having her back. Not sure why people are being so harsh, you've only tried to act in the horse's best interest throughout. It's kind of you to stump up the money to get her back again and let her live out her days with you, good luck and I hope it goes well.

 

[SpringArising]

It's very easy for people to say "Oh golly gosh, how dare you do that?", without having been in the same situation.

You made the best choice you thought you could with the knowledge and feelings that you had at the time. That doesn't make you a bad person. You thought you were doing the right thing, just as other people think their way is the right way.

I think that if you really want the horse back, you're going to need to be prepared to pay the full price. She's worth nothing on paper but she obviously has sentimental value to you - is that worth £400? If she was £1000 I'd say walk away, but £400 isn't unreasonable really. She might just need someone with a sticky bum for a few weeks.

 

[Irish gal]

Don't know what the current owner is like but make sure and offer over her value in meat money, in case that is at the back of their heads when selling her. No need at all for the rough time you've been subjected to here. I do hope you get her back OP.

 

[misskk88]

OP. I can't really add to the advice other than what other posters have said about sending a friend to haggle and bringing her home, if that is what will really put your heart and mind at rest. To me, if I was that concerned about the horses welfare the £400 would be a drop in the ocean for the peace of mind.

I do understand that you trusted in these people who came across as honest and truthful (heck I probably would have to in a similar situation), but unfortunately there are many a dishonest folk in the equine world, particularly when it comes to problem horses or 'free to good home' types, and the only way to really ensure your horses future is either to keep them or PTS. Even loaning has its risks, but is a far more amenable option when it comes to certain horses.


Hindsight is a wonderful thing, and yes, you could have considered your options slightly differently, but you made what you felt was the best decision at the time, and that is all anyone can really do. Being berated for what has already happened won't help the situation or mare currently. Perhaps take it as a learning experience and ensure not to follow the same process again in future?

I hope you manage to get her back if that is what you decide to do OP. Let us know how you get on. x

ps so sorry to hear about the loss of your youngster to AM too.

 

[Equi]

Good luck, i hope it goes well. Also, just a thought, i know a few cobby type horses who refuse to ride but drive like a dream. Some are just made to drive and that mix of breed will be one of them. She is still young enough to consider it - so she is not doing nothing the rest of her life and you have a fun new hobby.

 

[LittleGinger]

I think this is a sensible suggestion - send a friend with the £400 and ask them to haggle but not come home without her

If you really want her, and can afford the £400, then this is what I'd do. You could go yourself with transport/cash, depending on how you feel the phone conversations have gone. I know it's frustrating, knowing how little that lady paid for her and knowing she seems to be making a quick buck, but if the house is worth it then that doesn't really matter. And to be honest, £50 for the pony plus a week's livery/two weeks by the time she sells - the seller probably isn't really making a massive profit on her, especially if you can barter.

Good luck, OP.

 

[Sherbie]

Thanks so much for supportive comments.

I fully understand I'm hindsight I shouldn't have let her go in the first place. I didn't think loan was her best option as generally people like to be on control.

And it was foolish of me to think that her bad habits could be cured, but her rearing was by no means extreme and I am generally an optimist.

I if course have the money to buy her please do not assume I do not have the means to afford her, I was just wondering whether anybody else would bother trying to barter the price down, as surely she can't think that 350 pound increase in one week is right. I really don't feel she will get the money for her but I don't think its worth risking now.

So now it's just a question of getting a friend to go and try and barter a but but either way bring her home or going myself. I managed to get contact with her today after telling her I would increase my budget which is a good sign.

As for the "fuelling the breeding of rescue horses" travellers have always and will always overbreed and buy and sell and generally don't like to sell to the public so I don't see how this particular case has funded the market. But I appreciate that is your view however I am of the opposite view, life is too short to think of the politics of it all, if a horse is in need rescue van only be a good thing in my eyes.

Thanks again and touch wood I will have her back over this weekend.

Poor little mare, I really hope you get her back this weekend and you are able to keep her for life. Or as another poster said PTS if you need to.

Also Pics please when you get little mare back

 

[Elbie]

I would be tempted to lay out to the seller all the lies you know she is telling and offering to give her £50, the price she paid, for the mare back.

 

[MagicMelon]

2. A horse that has no value to you, is unlikely to be valued by another. Its the horse equivalent of throwing your horse away. And the sort of people who will take a free horse are idiots, opportunists looking to lie about it and sell on fast, or (possibly the best option) meat men.

Think you're being pretty harsh Shilasdair and I especially disagree with this point. 2 of my horses I was "gifted", I am no idiot and I do not intend to "sell on fast" for a quick buck. One, I have had for 3 years now and has cost me a fortune (and will continue to do so until the end of his days!) and the other is my little mare who I have put a lot of work into and enjoy very much - both horses I adore. It's very ignorant to paint everyone with the same brush.

OP, it's so hard to know what to do given the situation. If I were you, I'd probably say £100 is your final offer and its only on the table for 48 hours, that you know the horse well and you know its issues.

 

[only_me]

Clean up your mess and buy the horse back .
Keep her if you wish or PTS at least the she can not be mistreated further .
Don't pass on horses with complex issues .

This.

Oh, and shils isn't a troll, she might live in hades but actually gives very good advice and speaks the truth!

 

[Red-1]

This is going to sound harsh but
......
2. If she had so little value to you that you gave her away, you clearly didn't care much for her.
........

............

2. A horse that has no value to you, is unlikely to be valued by another. Its the horse equivalent of throwing your horse away. And the sort of people who will take a free horse are idiots, opportunists looking to lie about it and sell on fast, or (possibly the best option) meat men.

S

I disagree, I "sold" my last horse for £1. He had an issue where he would be sound for very light work, but was not suitable for eventing (collateral ligament repeat injury). As he was sound and could have passed a vet I could have got decent money for him, he was jumping Nov BE the previous year, and schooled to Med BD. I did not sell for £1 because he meant nothing to me, I sold him for £1 to secure his future.

I guess the difference may be that the person I sold him to was an honourable friend, and nearly 5 years on they are still happy and sending regular photos, but I don't think you can say that OP did not care because she gave the pony away.

 

[TheSylv007]

It's a rotten situation OP, and I'm not surprised you're feeling that you and the mare have been treated unfairly.
But in the grand scheme of horse keeping, £400 isn't much; one vet's or feed bill.
She was indeed lucky to have been bought by you, and now it's apparent that being ridden isn't her thing a life as a companion sounds ideal

I'd agree with this. Think there have been some slightly harsh comments, the OP explained her situation.

 

[ChesnutsRoasting]

Ok so first post maybe ever?

But desperate for some advice as I am in such a pickle.

The story's a tad long and I may get a lot of negative opinions but please refrain from sharing them if they are not helpful.

I rescued a pony 2 years ago from a traveller who had her tethered and she had an awful recovering wound on her hind leg. I needed a companion for my gelding who at the time I had retired early due to diagnosis of liver failure (later re-diagnosed as an infection and recovered but won't go there). Anyhow felt sorry for her and ended up paying 100 pounds when she was probably worth 10.

A month later she gave birth to a filly, I had my suspicions 2 weeks prior. This meant she had actually been severely malnourished. Because she had given birth in front of my riggy gelding this caused them to be inseparable and a nightmare.

I kept the filly as she was this funny looking mongrel and we fell in love with her, feeling very responsible for her. Gelding went back to livery because he was well again, and bought little section a gelding as companion to surprise filly. Which left the rescue mare. She had recovered and was looking healthy, was only 5 years old and had new lease of life. However was only 14hh (too small for myself as 5'11). She also had rearing issue which I put down to mix of bad past and complex relationship with my gelding.

I decided best idea was to find her a home where she could be ridden as she seemed too young to waste with me. Advertised her carefully with honest ad for several weeks, free to good home as that way I could be picky. After many many people I found someone who I thought would be ideal. They seemed to love her and there set up was fantastic. I told them whilst a forever home would be nice, I understand that she is only 5 and if the time comes where they feel she should move on then that's fine but I would appreciate them contacting me first which they actually were happy about. We keep in regular contact and everything seemed great.

So this week I find an ad for the little mare. And it's not from the people I gave her to. I see this happen a lot but couldn't understand it as we were still in regular contact. So I contact advertiser. Lady seems nice says she bought her from my friend, was advertised for 300, knocked down to 50 during viewing because she came off 3 times trying her out! The ad mentions nothing of rescue past, nothing of huge scar/proud flesh on leg, and states only just started rearing. She wants 400 pounds.

So i go back to friend/previous owner. Ask her to spill the beans. She apologises for not telling me shed sold her but it had only been a week and it wasn't a planned sale. A week! Yes she did sell her to this lady and her friend for 50. Was selling because even after 500 pounds of schooling was still rearing and becoming dangerous (Lord help me). Yes the lady cane off 3 times during viewing (why anyone would buy/sell a horse under these circumstances I cannot fathom). The friend says she was dismayed to find the woman trying to make a quick buck and had hoped she was going to land on her feet. By the sounds they've had words.

So I tell the lady I would be happy to pay 100 for the mare right now. I don't tell her that I know she's only had it a week (even though in our phone call she claimed to have had her months and had her back and teeth checked, and also a behaviourist who told her to sell on). The lady says if she doesn't sell she will come back to me. Have enquired again and no answer this time.

So yes I realise they both have had every right to sell, she is after all their horse however I do find it dishonourable. I would like to have her back now. Having lost her filly last winter due to atypical myothopy who we loved VERY much it would be nice to have part of her back. Plus the mare clearly has much more deep rooted issues than initially thought. She can live out her days with me. But the horse is not particularly pretty bless (coloured trotter x cob) plus her blemish and her behaviour puts her so at risk to ending up in the wrong hands. So the advice I need is: do I stump up 400 pounds on a horse I've spent near enough a thousand on in the past and gave away in good faith? Or do I hold out on the mare not selling (which I can't see happening for 400) and hope she comes back to me on offer I made? Should I warn people about the dishonest ad? But by causing this drama I risk never hearing about her ever again.

Please any advice would be appreciated. Sorry it's long. I suspect I've left out even more details lol.

I fear the following will sound crass. Is this poor, little mare worth £400 to you? No? Then get over it. If I had the chance to buy back a much loved friend, however ugly, £400 is no money. Sorry.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

OP I really wish that I knew what to advise you in this situation, but I couldn't leave without saying how sorry I am........

Never mind the rights or wrongs of the situation; I feel you've been thoroughly "had" by people who obviously abused your good nature and TBH other than stumping up and looking sweet I don't know what else you can do.

It certainly FEELS like you should have some redress, but had you "loaned" the pony instead of "gifting" her, the situation would have been totally different. It now looks like you have no option but to buy "your" pony back, OR leave well alone and let be.

I know I'm a softhearted old fool....... but I know what I'd do.........

 

[canteron]

OP I really wish that I knew what to advise you in this situation, but I couldn't leave without saying how sorry I am........

Never mind the rights or wrongs of the situation; I feel you've been thoroughly "had" by people who obviously abused your good nature and TBH other than stumping up and looking sweet I don't know what else you can do.

It certainly FEELS like you should have some redress, but had you "loaned" the pony instead of "gifting" her, the situation would have been totally different. It now looks like you have no option but to buy "your" pony back, OR leave well alone and let be.

I know I'm a softhearted old fool....... but I know what I'd do.........

I agree with this and it is all so difficult.

It seems as if the seller now feels uncomfortable with you. Could you get a friend to pose as a completely unaware unassociated buyer and buy it for as little as they can - they don't even have to know anything about horses, in fact probably best if they don't so the seller thinks they can con them! They may be in a stronger negotiating position and in this instance a little white lie may be the best way!!

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

I agree with this and it is all so difficult.

It seems as if the seller now feels uncomfortable with you. Could you get a friend to pose as a completely unaware unassociated buyer and buy it for as little as they can - they don't even have to know anything about horses, in fact probably best if they don't so the seller thinks they can con them! They may be in a stronger negotiating position and in this instance a little white lie may be the best way!!

Mmm.... this sounds a good idea!

 

[CinnamonChristmasCookie]

We are just going to have to agree to disagree on most of those points. I'm new here but a 5 minute look at the forums suggests your a troll by my standards and I don't need advice from a troll.

Trolls don't generally get to 20 000 posts.

Clean up your mess and buy the horse back .
Keep her if you wish or PTS at least the she can not be mistreated further .
Don't pass on horses with complex issues .

Exactly this. I'm shocked that someone would pass on a horse with known issues, no, I lie, I'm not shocked, but it's still disappointing, every time I read it.