Confused about my horses behavior in the school!

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Gina0915

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Hi guys

I have a lovely 16.3hh kwpn who is 8! he is the most loving horse I have ever owned and has come from a showjumper back ground.. I have had all his back treated which was very bad when I bought him, his teeth done, his saddle re flocked and re fitted and is very spoiled :) I started re schooling him as he was very tense and went round like a giraffe and did not want to accept contact.. when it was asked he went even more above the bit.. after months of training and hacking and going out and having fun jumping (his fav thing in the world) he started to really work beautifully and stretching into a lovely contact and out canter become balanced and he carried himself lovely.. all of a sudden about 2 weeks ago he has just given up with schooling and does not want to do it!

He starts off lovely for about 10 mins and then just goes nope and chucks his head in the air and refuses to come down and runs around with his head above the bit! He is very difficult to ride when he is doing this and wobbles all over the place and refuses to listen! His canter has become heavy and unbalanced again!

Now I don't know what to do about it! I have tried pushing him through this and into the bridle and he refuses to listen, i have told him off as was thinking he was taking the mick and he just bucks and gets even more tense.. I have tried giving up and leaving the school and hacking and starting again the next day but he just does the exact same thing!!

Its very frustrating as we were doing so well and now we have taken 10 steps back and he is not interested (unless he is jumping or hacking). His temperament on the ground has not changed and he is still wonderful. It is like he has gone on schooling strike!

He has no pains anywhere... I wonder if he gets fed up of schooling after 10 mins...

He is ridden in a Neue Schule Starter bit and was ridden in a flash.. but now am trying a Micklem comp bridle to see if the flash was uncomfortable.

Any ideas?

Thanks guys!
 
The sudden change is screaming that it hurts. What you have to so is figure out where and what.

My first port of call would be the vet and then maybe a bute trial to see if that changes things and take it from there.

Hope you can sort him out
 
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I know you say he has no pains, but the reaction does sound very typical to pain... Have you tried getting someone else to ride him? Or going to a lesson in another arena? Is he the same?

Have you had the physio out since it happened? Could have pulled a muscle or something, and just love hacking/jumping enough to ignore it then!
 
He has been having Mctimmoney treatments he has has 2 since i bought him 4 months ago I have also had his saddle re fitted and re flocked about 2 weeks ago and have had his teeth floated, he had some hooks but they were sorted out.. his feet are done every 6-7 weeks.
 
Did the reaction start after the re flocking?
I think a full lameness check by vet is indicated here, unless you are 100% sure he is fine, it does sound like something physical.
I would try another saddle or bareback if you feel up to it.
 
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Gina0915 said:
He has been having Mctimmoney treatments he has has 2 since i bought him 4 months ago I have also had his saddle re fitted and re flocked about 2 weeks ago and have had his teeth floated, he had some hooks but they were sorted out.. his feet are done every 6-7 weeks.
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So you had his saddle re-flocked two weeks ago - isn't 2 weeks ago when you said the behaviour started? Could it be the change in the saddle?
Not saying it's defintitely that - just try to think about what happened right before it started. Did you do any more heavy work than usual, was he stabled for longer than normal, did he get shod, etc etc. Then you can try to find the root of the problem :)
 
As others had said discomfort most obvious. However if you have only had him 4 months it may be now he has settled decided to test a few boundaries and has gone bit sour with schooling.

If still happy jumping etc see what he is like schooling out in a different envoiroment and if happy to work in outline out hacking.
 
no it started a few weeks ago! he is very nosy and interested in everything thats going on around him.. his head goes in the air and his ears are pricked right forward and he completely ignores me! I do wonder if it is boredom.. I do not school for more than 2 days straight I always hack or jump on the 3rd day and he has 2 days a week off.
 
actually thinking about it the saddle was reflocked only about 1 week ago not 2 weeks! Silly me.. and the silliness started about 2 weeks ago! he was very stiff when I bought him and very tight through the saddle area poor thing.. he had no turn out before I bought him at all and now goes out every single day for around 6 hours..
 
Is the McTimothy treatment also muscular, or only looking at joints? Asking because I don't know! Could be helpful getting a 2nd opinion from a Physiotherapist or equine massage person? What about the vet? Could be worth giving them a call. Ulcers have been suggested on many other posts - no personal experience of them though.

Alternatively, I'd definitely try getting someone else to ride him to see if he's just testing you. If he is, some good lessons might be needed :)
 
the person who does his treatment is also a equine massage person :) lol she does both! my friend bought some ulcer supplement from equine america because someone suggested this could of been her mares sudden stopping at fences problem and major napping and now she has nearly stopped this.. i might buy it and give it a try it cant hurt!
 
i will have some flat lessons with my old dr trainer.. i have been having jumping lessons but he concentrates when he is jumping so it is no good for this sudden problem.. i will stop these for a few months and have some flat lessons i think :)
 
Rather take a scatter gun approach first do everything to ensure not pain related. Assume whoever treating your horse has informed your vet and you have discussed this with your vet. I would then look at behaviour especially as horse had no turn out etc and have only had for 4 months
 
Gina0915 said:
the person who does his treatment is also a equine massage person :) lol she does both! my friend bought some ulcer supplement from equine america because someone suggested this could of been her mares sudden stopping at fences problem and major napping and now she has nearly stopped this.. i might buy it and give it a try it cant hurt!
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Gina0915 said:
i will have some flat lessons with my old dr trainer.. i have been having jumping lessons but he concentrates when he is jumping so it is no good for this sudden problem.. i will stop these for a few months and have some flat lessons i think :)
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Lessons sounds like a plan, do have a word with your vet before the ulcer trial, hopefully you have a good vet who will know whether or not it's a good idea.
Four months isn't too long so may be some muscles he's been building up differently, or a behavioural reaction to having to work rather than being in his field, etc.
 
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i am going to try and take schooling back to basics, let him warm up on the lunge and work long and low.. do half the session on the buckle and work on relaxing. he is very compact and has a short back my saddler said he has a typical show jumper back very short not much wither so maybe i am asking him to much at the moment and he is saying no its to hard.. we are still learning each other (if that makes sense).
 
You say that this behaviour started about 2 weeks ago and that you had your saddle reflocked about 2 weeks ago. Perhaps there is a connection. I would suggest getting your saddler back, or getting a 2nd opinion. Sometimes the horse does not agree with a saddle-fitter.
 
Pearlsasinger said:
You say that this behaviour started about 2 weeks ago and that you had your saddle reflocked about 2 weeks ago. Perhaps there is a connection. I would suggest getting your saddler back, or getting a 2nd opinion. Sometimes the horse does not agree with a saddle-fitter.
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I said the same, but she has clarified later (top of this page) that it started before the saddle fitter came.
 
I have been thinking and realized that my saddler came only 1 week ago.. silly me. I am trying to think of any changes that happened 2 weeks ago and I cant place anything.. I do think that he is just taking the mick.. he doesn't look uncomfortable and the fact he is bouncing around with his ears pricked locking onto the bit maybe suggests that he is laughing at me.. haha.
 
he has suddenly gone from no turn out to a lot of turn out with good grass.. no back massages with knots and very tight spots to good treatments and no tightness, a saddle that fits and is comfortable and to comfortable teeth.. he has put alot of condition and weight on and i wonder if all of a sudden he is feeling fresh and sprightly.. he has come out of his shell a lot he was quiet and now he is cheeky and is the yard clown :) haha. I just sometimes think that he is feeling good and excited.. i dont know if he has ever been asked to do to school properly before and now he is being asked he is putting up a bit of a wall... i will see but if things do not improve i will call my vet to see what he suggests.
 
I posted something the other day about my lad misbehaving. It turned out to be something as simple as his cheek pieces had stretched over time, resulting in the position of his bit changing. The amount was tiny, and i'll be honest it took me a couple of hacks to work it out. But after changing them for new ones, the difference in his behavior was amazing, back to his very well behaved self. I'm not saying this is the answer to your problem, but it can sometimes be the really simple things that make a difference to them.
 
oh really! that is good to hear you sorted your boy out! I will have a good look tonight at his tack and see if anything is bothering him.. I have changed his bridle to a micklem and he seems a little more settled but the silliness starts after about 10 mins of lovely work.. so it could be something that starts to feel uncomfortable after it has been worked in a little.. the thing is with him it is never nasty! just head up ears pricked and dancing around :) haha
 
My gelding exhibited similar behaviour when he had unfortunately done something significant in the SI region - this after sitting down in the field. At first we thought he had pulled a muscle. Gave him six weeks off with acupuncture and massage. Started again and found the behaviour above. Sorry. I would get the vet for a thorough check over. Please note, though, that SI injuries in the main are diagnosed by MRI.
 
Would definitely have some lessons, as it's hard for us to judge his behaviour without seeing it. And think as hard as you can on little details that might pain him, seek advice from people including the vet, your physio etc - just chat to them first, seeing what they think.

Then it's a case of giving him time to settle - he's had a lot of changes and 4 months isn't a long time :) You're probably right in working him long and low and building up slowly... Good luck!
 
I don't really know what McTimoney does or what it's based on but I doubt it replaces a diagnostic vet. For the sake of a callout charge and a work up isn't it worth getting a vet out to discuss the behaviour with them? I doubt it's much more than two back treatments to be honest.
I can't help but think it sounds a bit odd that two weeks ago he decided he was 'bored' and wanted to 'laugh at you'....more likely he is struggling to round due to a pain issue somewhere (and doesn't necessarily have to be the back, a friend's gelding struggled to take a proper contact when his back feet were out of balance - you don't know where the compensatory effect could be).
 
Gina0915 said:
he will happily do it when he is hacking or when he is warming up to jump
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Horses will be different when their attention is on something, the adrenaline can take their mind off of any discomfort, it certainly sounds pain related to me, they do not tend to decide they are bored and become difficult in order to get out of work, that is giving them the ability to rational thinking, a horse reacts to what is happening rather than plans ahead, if he is fine for 10 mins then becomes difficult that suggests something starts to become uncomfortable and from that point he cannot work correctly.
Just because the therapist found nothing does not mean there is nothing to find, they will not have been going through a lameness assessment they will just check basic soundness then move on to treat the obvious areas of concern.
 
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