connemara horse?

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stormox

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I have seen a lot of adverts lately for oversized connemaras- both in UK and in Ireland. I saw a dun recently advertised as a purebred 16hh connemara! Ive lost count of the ads for 15.2/15.3hh purebreds! A few years ago, when connemaras had to inspected for type (in Ireland anyway) to get into the CPBS breed register it HAD to be under 14.2,though the odd typy 14.3hh might just creep in as they could be inspected as immature 2 year olds.
Since Brussells legislation all connemaras from registered parents can be registered, although they are meant to be graded.
Are we losing 'type'? It is a connemara 'pony' after all- or should we introduce a new breed- the 'connemara horse'?
 
Agree it's a shame, you don't see many 13.2 connies anymore. Our 14.1 green book connie has a lot of TB blood in his pedigree so presumably the genes are there if people want to breed bigger.
 
There were TB and arab stallions used to refine the breed, but that is why they were inspected for 'type' before being allowed to be passed as connemara ponies.
Without this inspection, breeding for the height will bring too many other TB characteristics along with it, and the 'connemara pony' will lose its characteristic hardiness, common sense and sure-footedness.
There is a need for these bigger,lighter types, I have 2 connemara x TB's myself, but I dont think the 'connemara pony breed' as a whole should be allowed stray too far from the original....
 
The last time I went to an inspection they were pretty strict about what they were passing (this was a filly inspection), I went with a farmer to get his two fillies passed and only one did. They both had excellent breeding (Murphy Rebel lines) but they were very different to look at although both pony types which imo is what the Connemara should be. The one that passed (very pretty to look at but less bone than the other) had only one foal in all the time I've been here despite him having stallions out and sending her to stud, the one that failed (much coarser looking) has had a foal pretty much every year bar the last couple. Incidentally she failed because she threw a foreleg out in trot and not because she wasn't as refined looking as the other.
 
I bought my Connie as a 14.2 4yo from sales in Ireland. He kept growing until he was 8 and is now 15/15.1 hh. Granted he is a class 3 green passported horse but most of his relatives (grandsire earl or Castlefrench) are around 15h. I think they are just breeding them bigger nowadays. It does make me laugh that my boys dam was 13.2 and his sire 14h, I think my lad was just an outcast!
 
I am a breeder of connemara ponies and I feel we are loosing the true to type connemara pony. There are alot on Ireland that are over height I feel that if you want a connemara but want one bigger then cross the connemara with a nice Irish sports horse tb or warm blood. Overheight Connemaras are not the way forward. Pure breds should be no bigger than 148cm. Overheight pure breds cannot be shown in M&M classes and if a filly/mare will only be eligible for class 3
 
I think they are just different types, a lot of breeds such as haflingers and highlands seem to have two types - the traditional should be for showing and the sportier models for other stuff.

I would absolutely love a connemara but would have to be at least 15hh, I wouldn't be bothered about being eliminated from showing though (or at least not winning) I would be more interested in the general versatility of the breed.

If up to 16hh I'm not sure it could really look like a Connie though, I imagine more of a Connie x TB, so depending on the lineage why not just call it that... They are a great useful cross breed recognised in their own right.
 
No, celticdiamond, both sexes are all grade 3 till they are inspected. then those that meet the criteria can be passed into grades 1 or 2.
 
mcnaughty- both ID and conemmaras used to have to pass an inspection before they were even allowed into their respective studbooks. (Hence the old terms ID and RID for the draughts).
But EU directive said any foal born of ID (or connemara) parents must be an ID (or connemara). So they both have an introductory grade for all foals born, and then theyre graded 1 or 2 on inspection - and/or performance in the case of the ID
 
stormox said:
mcnaughty- both ID and conemmaras used to have to pass an inspection before they were even allowed into their respective studbooks. (Hence the old terms ID and RID for the draughts).
But EU directive said any foal born of ID (or connemara) parents must be an ID (or connemara). So they both have an introductory grade for all foals born, and then theyre graded 1 or 2 on inspection - and/or performance in the case of the ID
Click to expand...

Alright alright! I was only joking! Crikey - I do know the difference between an ID and a Connie! But .... basically IDs are just big connies - sorry but it is true! Starting with the most common colour through to temperament and on to where the come from.
 
The Irish word for pony translates to 'little horse' :) there are many myths about what they originated from but as the west of Ireland had a long history with the Spanish it would seem reasonable to assume that there was a fair amount of Iberian blood already in the breed before we added Arab and TB. I got the impression from a family member who breeds them that they are very strict on the grading.
I think there is a good Market for oversized ones and I'd certainly like to get my hands on one.
 
capallin- little horse. certainly u are right, and both Irish Draught and Connemara have some Iberian blood, which shows in both breeds today as curly manes, front limb action, slight roman nose, etc. and there was inbreeding between the two breeds long before records were introduced. Until the ID stud book was closed in fairly recent times, connemara and TB (no foreigners!) were allowed to be used to produce supplementary draughts which could the be bred to produce a full draught.
So there are definite connections between the two. And both breeds are getting bigger- ID stallions are now commonly 17hh +, which was unheard of a while ago.
But a 15hh connemara generally has more quality than a 15hh draught, and the fact is it should be a 'connemara pony' and I think we must be careful not to lose 'type'.
 
i love connies and id hate to imagine them being bred so far from what they are. imagine a connieless world! my last pony was a 12.2 connie cross, more connie than whatever else was in there. im glad he was only 12.2 cos that cheeky pony attitude wouldnt have been as funny if he was 16hh!
 
I have a rising 2 year old standing at 14.2hh who will make 15.2-16hh. I think it partly to do with better nutirition etc these days. Humans are getting taller so i imagine its similar for the ponies.
Q
 
My mare is 24, & is out of an overheight connie. Afaik the dam was only ever used for x breeds, however despite a tb sire mine still only made 14.2. Much as I love the idea of a 16.2 connie, I wouldn't want them at the risk of losing the true connie traits. Pretty much every connie cross I've known has retained the connie traits, but I think if size became the main aim of pure breeding, it would end up watered down.
Also agree re the fact they've already become bigger. I've been keeping a vague eye on what's available, as in a year or so I want a 3yr old or unbacked 4yr old to bring on for my daughter, either pure or xtb. And from what I've seen, its not going to be hard to find one to make 14-14.2, rather the problem will be finding one that definitely won't go over. (excepting of course top blood lines, but as it will be an allrounder pc type rather than showing, don't want to spend that type of money)
 
I dont really see the problem. For showing, judges know what they're looking for so they'll still place the true to type ones correctly. Otherwise, it means people like me who are too tall for ponies are able to ride these sorts. I bought an "over-height" Welsh Cob, at 15.2hh. I did show him and although did very well at local / low level county level, I knew he'd never do well properly because he wasn't as typey. I love Welsh Cobs but simply couldn't of had a 14.2hh as they're too small. Same goes with connies, I'd have a big one of those.
 
Welsh sec D have no upper height limit- the connemara pony does! Its not a problem, an overheight connemara is lovely. But if people breed purely for size they are going to lose some of the true 'connemara pony' traits, and the larger ones will become a different type.
As the larger ones wont be able to get into 'grade 1', should the larger ones, as in the welshies, have a different section?
We dont want to lose our pony type....
 
Tbh if you have an overheight connie with a pure connie bloodline (both dam and sire connies) then ultimately the horse no matter what the size will always be a connie. All the overheight connies I know ranging from 15-15.2hh look true to type as much as the smaller ponies just with longer legs :)
 
This was my super size connie....

picture.php
 
I have a connie mare, if I want a 15 hander I would put her to a nice sports horse if I was choosing a pure bred I would like the stallion to be no bigger than 14h with loads of bone. In the 80's all connies seemed to be about 13.2 , if was 14h it was huge. The Irish breed for the market they are selling to.
 
Don't get me wrong, I'm sure there are plenty of overheight connies who have retained every single trait. And I would happily buy one. But, I think if they were to be developed into 16hh in large numbers, its logical breeding stock would be rated on its ability to produce size, rather than the actual traits being the priority.
 
mcnaughty said:
Alright alright! I was only joking! Crikey - I do know the difference between an ID and a Connie! But .... basically IDs are just big connies - sorry but it is true! Starting with the most common colour through to temperament and on to where the come from.
Click to expand...

?????


Most common Connie colour = grey

Most common I'D colour. Surely bay or chestnut from what I've met???


Later -seems not . Only chestnut predominance among my friends!!
 
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I've currently got 9 Connies on my yard for sale ranging from 14hh up to 15.2hh all pure bred. To me a good over height connie should still be very much a pony, but in giant form! I really don't like the larger ones who are very TB like. A few of mine are registered still as Stallions, but haven't made the grade or haven't turned out as breeders wanted, so have been gelded. Grading is quite hard, and they are very picky! I don't see the problem as there are two main types of connie now, the more traditional stockier type who tends to get graded and then the more sporty ponies. I personally like my sports ponies somewhere in the middle. Connies are great, clever, real characters and will give you their all if they are on your side. Everyone should have one!
 
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