constant howling.. going insane !

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millies

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my mum and dad have two very lovely dobermans who are the loveliest dogs iv eve met. however iv moved back home now and they bark and howl every time some one walks past the window or a leaf drops off a tree. when ever its time for them to go for a walk or some one puts on their shoes and they assume its walkies time the noise is horendous. it sounds like theyve had their toe nails ripped out and in beating them with a cattle prod.

there both 3/4 year old now and petty much been like this since my parents got them. are they too old to change?

any tips to shut them before i go mad !?
 
Sounds as though they take their duties as guard dogs a little too seriously, and that can be the case where they don't trust the human householder to be in control of the environment. One of the things every dog of mine has to learn as soon as we can manage it is a "down" - as fast as possible, and that puts me in control. A behaviourist might look at the arrangements within the house - are you or your parents inadvertantly giving them reason to think they are pack leaders? Are they allowed access into every room or is there a no dog zone? And are they allowed on the furniture ever, or if they help themselves, will they get off when told to? And do they have tug of war toys that the dogs usually end up with? And do they have their meals before the humans? These are all ethological signals which, subtle as they sound, are powerful signs to dogs.
A properly trained Behaviourist from the APBC list can probably help, and if the dogs are insured for vet fees, the insurance might cover it.
 
I have a friend with eleven dogs..two Dobes the rest MinPins..her lot are SO noisy she cannot leave them in the house alone.Ridiculous,a prisoner by her own dogs.Dobes are extremely noisy by habit.:(
 
jillA... you have it spot on i think. the dogs do literally rule the house. they are allowed in evey room except mine, and they are sometimes allowed in my mum and dads bed. they arnt suposed to be on the sofas though my dad lets them slowly edge there way furthe on till they have there front legs on. they are feed after us, though when we eat the dogs are hovering round drooling at our feet and my dad often gives them some of his. when theyre taken out for a walk my dad just holds the end of the leads and lets them play/jump around and generaly piss about.

amymay... they go out at least 30 mins in the evening to run around a big field and i try to take them out before work for a quick run if i can. do you think they could do with even more excesise ?
 
Sounds like you need to sort out your parents before you can sort out the dogs. :)
At least one dog-free area (usually upstairs and if you can borrow a stair gate that will help enforce it), their own beds in a kitchen or utility, no tidbits except for training purposes, train a "down" so you can interrupt unwanted behaviour like getting on furniture. A good enlightened dog training class would be a huge help, but all of the above will enable them to realise they don't make the household decisions, you do.
 
we tried a stair gate but both dogs scrambled over it, on of them got stuck once to we took it down. as we are in the process of redecorating there is no door on my paents room and the kids always forget to shut their doors. so thats dificult to enforce at the moment.
they do have beds in the kitchen, whick they sleep on at night usually.
we did try taking them to a group training class but they barked constantly and i dont think my parents took them again.

i think your right though, everyone in the house really does need to lay down the law instead of everything being done so the darling dogs get exactly what they want.
 
i have honestly just watched one of the dogs lick my dads plate as he was eating off of it and all my dad did wa say 'no ruby, dont do that. its my tea not yours' as if he was talking to a baby, and then scratch her ears.
no wonder the dogs think theyre in charge.
 
It sounds like there is no discipline in that household, my Dobes bark at people going down the road or up my drive but if I say quiet then they are, being noisey isnt a Dobe thing but they will run rings around you if you let them.

God help me but sometimes my dogs eat before me, they are allowed in most rooms and are allowed on the sofas but will get off if I want to sit down. I dont go along with all this pack leader stuff, my dogs are dogs not wolves and are treated as dogs, they have bounderies and we have rules.

I would suggest OP that the dogs are trained separately and are given consequences if they dont conform, they need bounderies and they need rules, in short they need to know their place in your household.
 
ive never had dobermans but a half hour free run doesnt sound much to me. i have a lurcher and a collie cross, they get an hour mostly off lead in the morning and about half hour mostly off lead in the evening and if my hips were not so painful they would get more.....
 
30 mins for big dogs does not sound like enough exercise to me. Do they get to use their brains at all with training/tricks etc? Sometimes its about wearing them out mentally aswell as physically!
 
One other thing, do just get them to a vet and get them to (will take 2 secs) check their heart rate. Only because Dobes are very prone to heart problems and one of the symptoms in my Dobes case was howling a lot. I'm sure it's nothing to do with that with yours but it's worth just ruling out, ESP if you are going for annual jabs or something anyway.

It's likely not as they would be very young for it to be the cause, but worth ruling out.
 
My 2 dogs are not allowed the run of the house they stay in the kitchen with the back door open for access to the garden during the day, but from 6pm after we have eaten our dinner then they are allowed in the living room with us. If someone comes to the door or there is a noise out side one of the dogs barks and the other howls, but I have trained them when I want them to stop when I say SHUT UP, and I don't agree as I read some where that you mustn't shout as it encourages them to bark more, because when I shout shut up they do stop.

When I first started training them to do this and they didn't shut up I would firmly send them both to their beds, and they learnt this is what was going to happened if they didn't do what I said. But I think it's their job to bark to warn us of strangers, but when I want them to stop then they do.
 
30 Mins a day is not enough for Dobes, mine get about 1.1/2 hrs per day plus lots of ball games etc, Im surprised your house isnt wrecked and it sounds to me these dogs are very frustrated.

Why on earth did your parents buy Dobermanns when their lifestyle is better suited to a Greyhound, I also wonder what they are feeding them on. Im sorry to be so negative but I get angry when the breed I love is chosen by someone as their dog without doing their research and then tries to fit a square peg into a round hole.
 
dobiegirl.... when we first got them my dad wasnt working so he had all the time in the world for them. then he went back to work full time and i moved away, so its only recently thattheyve had less excecise but the howling gone on since we got them.

thanks evey one for the advice, im taking them out 45 mins most mornings and they go out again in the evening for a long as my dad has time for.
dug out the old clicker thats been long given up on and will give it another go and persevere hopefully for longer than my dad did.
 
Dobiegirl said:
It sounds like there is no discipline in that household, my Dobes bark at people going down the road or up my drive but if I say quiet then they are, being noisey isnt a Dobe thing but they will run rings around you if you let them.

God help me but sometimes my dogs eat before me, they are allowed in most rooms and are allowed on the sofas but will get off if I want to sit down. I dont go along with all this pack leader stuff, my dogs are dogs not wolves and are treated as dogs, they have bounderies and we have rules.

I would suggest OP that the dogs are trained separately and are given consequences if they dont conform, they need bounderies and they need rules, in short they need to know their place in your household.
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This ^^ im not with the whole (feed 1st) and no chairs etc, as you can strike a perfect balance, as suggested (if they get up) then they must get down on command otherwise there is no issue, it sounds here like 2 very high energy and vocal/guarding breeds are literally bouncing off the walls with energy. Sure you need some structure but they need alot more stimulation and exercise (agility) a job to do and create some calmness indoors, do they have any (occupiers) inside, bones/kongs, do they have an (area) of their own for some (time out) as im picturing them just running riot in the house? and indeed your parents actually seem like they are the ones who need the training:D
 
Dotty123 said:
My 2 dogs are not allowed the run of the house they stay in the kitchen with the back door open for access to the garden during the day, but from 6pm after we have eaten our dinner then they are allowed in the living room with us. If someone comes to the door or there is a noise out side one of the dogs barks and the other howls, but I have trained them when I want them to stop when I say SHUT UP, and I don't agree as I read some where that you mustn't shout as it encourages them to bark more, because when I shout shut up they do stop.

When I first started training them to do this and they didn't shut up I would firmly send them both to their beds, and they learnt this is what was going to happened if they didn't do what I said. But I think it's their job to bark to warn us of strangers, but when I want them to stop then they do.
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Ditto ^^^, my rottie (a guarding breed) naturally makes her presence know if there is a knock at the door or someone looked through the window, if I holla form another room "quiet", silence resumes immediately, same with the rest to, it only takes one firm raised grunt from me. I don't mind them barking, it alerts me to whatever is there, but being overly vocal is a no no and easily controlled, when u are in control;)
 
millies said:
dobiegirl.... when we first got them my dad wasnt working so he had all the time in the world for them. then he went back to work full time and i moved away, so its only recently thattheyve had less excecise but the howling gone on since we got them.

thanks evey one for the advice, im taking them out 45 mins most mornings and they go out again in the evening for a long as my dad has time for.
dug out the old clicker thats been long given up on and will give it another go and persevere hopefully for longer than my dad did.
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As DG suggestes, try getting some focus (ball) and use/introduce a ball thrower, burns twice as much energy for the dog and less so for the human:)
 
millies said:
i have honestly just watched one of the dogs lick my dads plate as he was eating off of it and all my dad did wa say 'no ruby, dont do that. its my tea not yours' as if he was talking to a baby, and then scratch her ears.
no wonder the dogs think theyre in charge.
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The unhappiest dogs are all so often those with no boundaries, and no discipline. When dogs have the confirmation of their pack position, however it's achieved, then they are generally happier animals.

It's very unusual for humans, once the situation's explained to them, to find their road to Damascus, because if they need to have it explained to them, it begs the question why they couldn't see the answer for themselves. Sorry if that's a bit brutal, OP, but I suspect that you're actually ahead of me on this one! ;)

Another thing that I've never quite understood, how when the cry goes up and the answer so we're told, is to give unruly dogs more exercise. More exercise means a fitter dog, and the fitter the dog, the more the exercise that's needed! :rolleyes: Exercise in itself, is rarely the answer.

The real answer is discipline.

Alec.
 
Because 30 mins for a working breed of dog is not enough exercise?

But I agree to a point in that the exercise should be structured and their brains need to be exercised as well. I have a very hyperactive, vocal, pushy dog. He does not get lots of free running around as that sends him boogaloo - he gets biked, swum, on lead walks, tracking, obedience training, bit of agility. He is in a heavy work schedule but the point is that I dictate the pace of everything, if I turn left, he has to come too, if I turn right, that's the way he has to go as well, if he misses a footprint/food on a track, then he misses it out of his daily allowance. The idea is that he doesn't get to fart unless I say so :p but it still isn't perfect and he still takes a mile if he gets a sniff of an inch!!

Whilst I don't usually equate noise to dominance, these dogs are doing a pretty good job of training the OP's parents, not the other way around.
 
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Good god your dad sounds like mine!

I agree with what most others have said regarding training, I think you need to give your parents boundaries too ;) these problems can be quite straight-forward to fix but they have to be consistent with it. It really doesn't sound like your dad will be. I often find they sneak scraps of food to the dogs when they think we're not looking. Argh getting me irritated just typing it!

Sorry, anyway, good luck!
 
Also, try to drop all the usual cues of taking them out for a walk. Drop all the usual signals which have taught them 'walkies - WAHHHHH!!!!!'
Use different leads, go out a different door. And only ever take them out when they are quiet. If you have to wait all day, wait all day - noise = nothing.
Reward the behaviour you are looking for.
 
thanks for all the advice whicjg me and my mum are working on putting into practise, however i reckon its all going to geca waste of time.
i showed my dad this thread to which he replied, 'theres nowt wrong wit dogs, there good guard dogs. '
he really cant see that theres a problem tbh.
me and my mum are really trying though !
found the clicker today, bought a few dog toys and have been teaching them to 'down' and just lay down imediatley on command.
even in the last day were having some sucess at getting their attention when theyre howling like mad'uns.
thanks guys
 
cc- unfortunatley its hard as weve only one door to go out of. but whilst were getting ready the dogs are sent to 'bed' until were ready to go. no more jumping around mad howling until we go out hopefully.
 
Hmm,guard dogs?No,the ones for villains to worry about are quiet and confident!I have boarded my friends so called guard dog Dobes..all mouth and trousers I can assure you!
 
PMSL, we only have one door too, which my mother insists on calling 'the front door' even though there is no back door....but I digress :p
That's the kind of thing I am talking about, give them a purpose, give them something to do, redirect all that energy into something positive.

Maybe when they are being really well behaved for you and your mum and are still leaping all over your dad being rude, he will change his tune ;)
 
haha theyre defo good guard dogs, everyone in a thirty mile radius knows theyre there ! thoug i guess the noise they make at walk time also alerts any potentual burgelers in the same area tobour empty house ! maybe mentioning that to the dobes will make them rethink their guard dog methods :')
any way, me and my mum are definatley trying and the dogs have actually learnt pretty quick that me and mum arnt putting up with their behavior anymore. told them about ten times to get of the sofa and they didnt bother trying again for the rest of the evening !

(they probs sound like right little horrors to you lot but trust me i conside that progess aleady!)
 
millies said:
haha theyre defo good guard dogs, everyone in a thirty mile radius knows theyre there ! thoug i guess the noise they make at walk time also alerts any potentual burgelers in the same area tobour empty house ! maybe mentioning that to the dobes will make them rethink their guard dog methods :')
any way, me and my mum are definatley trying and the dogs have actually learnt pretty quick that me and mum arnt putting up with their behavior anymore. told them about ten times to get of the sofa and they didnt bother trying again for the rest of the evening !

(they probs sound like right little horrors to you lot but trust me i conside that progess aleady!)
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Change that to "watch dogs".All mouth and trousers,my friend`s bolt if you sneeze...she thinks they are guard dogs too,I call them anti social nuisances.Mind,they gave up yelling here because I made it clear that their behaviour would not be toleated.
 
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