Cost of Broodmares

Not much it would seem.
frown.gif

I've one with a proven competition record that I can hardly give away atm.
She is a 14.2 though not a horse but there are plenty of people out there breeding sports ponies.
confused.gif
 
i paid much more for the majority of my mares, however like bananaman says people are not willing to pay much for them. I have two for sale through no fault of their own. They are well bred one TB and one Oldenburg. The oldenburg is graded and has produced 5 quality foals in germany, the TB is very straight and could be a small ridng horse, hack or dressage horse, maybe some low level evening. They are both scanned in foal for 2009 to graded BWBS stallions, both took first time and are genuinely for sale due to change in circumstances but i cant give them away.
 
How long is a piece of string!

a quality Tb mare with good race breeding could be anything from 100K upwards. A rubbish ex-race type Tb mare could be 800 quid upwards, even though she may have very similar breeding.

I'm sure it's the same type of senario with WB's etc

The broodmare is the basis of any breeding program, so in theory should be the most expensive/ most quality part of the equation
smile.gif


I suppose it totally depends on what you are trying to breed!
 
I may be wrong but with WB's I doubt the price gets to the 100k mark for the majority of (but not all) broodmares, even well bred, proven ones. However I was surprised to find an unproven 5yo with no record at 22.5k. Plus if the foals aren't worth a decent percentage of the mare's value then there would be no point breeding as after you've taken keep, stud costs etc then you've negative equity. (I have heard the saying "fools breed horses for wise men to buy") but some people must make money or they wouldn't do it.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Plus if the foals aren't worth a decent percentage of the mare's value then there would be no point breeding as after you've taken keep, stud costs etc then you've negative equity. (I have heard the saying "fools breed horses for wise men to buy") but some people must make money or they wouldn't do it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well said
grin.gif
I guess that many hobby breeders don't really keep full account of the costs (which is fine as they have the pleasure of a beautiful foal to play with
cool.gif
) but they might be shocked if they really added up the costs involved
smile.gif


My yearlings keep and vets bills are terrifying... one of them jumped out of the field the other day and had to have her leg stapled, so not only will she scared and her value diminished, but I've got the vets fee's, the broken fencing to repair etc etc the whole episode will have cost the best part of £1000, so unless some lovely trainer takes a real fancy to her at the sales i'll be well out of pocket
crazy.gif
 
you would be surprised how much warmbloods make on the continent. Check out the PSI + AOS sales, off the top of my head and i could be a little bit out, a 3 year old stallion by balou de rouet made 316,000 euro, i think that was the figure but it was definitely 300,000 + and mares were making 30,000 +euro, however the foals do seem to sell for more money over there also.22.5 K for a well bred 5 year old doesnt sound too out of the way if she is sound etc and could have a ridden career also. At 5 she should have many years of potential breeding ahead.
 
Perhaps it is just me but for 22.5k I'd want her to come with a 5 stage vet & clean x-rays, preferably been graded even bottom level, and I'd also expect a 5yo (not been bred before) to have some sort of comp record, not sat in a field.
 
Depends on the quality of the mare, her bloodlines and the quality of the mare line. The last mare we purchased as a 3 year old was 5 figures, but her whole family line is proven and she has super bloodlines. On top of this she is such a nice type of mare. I also enquired about the full sister of Indoctro at the age of 19 in foal to Berlin, and she was sold for 80K (Ken will back me up on that one).

Saying that, one of my best breeding mares I got for nothing, and my "Ster" Goodtimes mare (who we also rate as an excellent breeding mare) which I got several years ago for a few £k has a daughter who is away to go International level showjumping next year in Germany.....so you can come across "finds" as well.....
laugh.gif


With some lines you could get over 5 figures for your foals (if you are one of the lucky ones), so some of these breeding mares do re-coup their money back over time. But like any livestock you have no guarantees on how long they will live, but I guess that is one of the gambles anyone takes.
 
thats fair comment, from your reply i assume she has not got a 5 stage vetting and clean x rays. i too would expect a vetting and x rays for that money.
 
I definately agree with the 'speculate to accumulate' thing, I wouldn't expect to get a lot of money for a poorly bred, poorly presented foal, so I do think it's well worth finding a nice mare with the breeding, temperament, record/gradings whatever you want kind of thing and spending the money on a good stallion to get (hopefully) a nice foal that can get some of your investment back and maybe the mare pays for itself after a foal or two (three) then you might make some £. lol.

So sorry to hear about your youngster, it's heartbreaking and I know it's a blemish but it shouldn't affect her too badly should it? and youch that is a huge bill!
frown.gif
I guess thats why you need a few mares/foals each year in case something does happen to one or more of them. Which is why I'm looking for another mare
smile.gif
and wondered what price people thought was reasonable to pay.
 
IMHO if you can purchase the best mare you can afford then you cannot ask for any more.

We are not arrogant (quite modest really) with regards to what we have because we started off with lessor quality mares around 14 years ago and we continue to try and improve on the mares we use in our breeding programme (besides the stallions). However this year the vets who help us with our AI were taking out their students to our stud to show them the quality of our breeding mares. One of the students was American and said that she had been quite "surprised" with the poorer quality of mares she has seen people breeding with in Scotland, and that it was a breath of fresh air to visit our stud to see the mares we use in our breeding programme.

For us it is quite nice when a complete stranger comes out with these type of comments because we hope that we are on the right lines with what we try and produce.

Breeding is always a continuous cycle.....that is what gives you the ups and downs..

Air78 - sorry to hear about your filly, know that feeling, one of mine went through a fence in the fog two days ago and ripped her back leg (and she is one I had ear marked for the Futurity). One of our foals last year got kicked in the eye and we had to have it removed. However, she is of excellent breeding and she will go into our breeding herd in two years time.
 
I had a budget of 10k when I was looking for a really decent mare last year. I do think people have a strange attitude to broodmares in this country, given how they are the most important part of a breeding program.
A bit like Anastasia, I've come across some bargins, but also bought some very nice mares for a decent amount.
 
A good commercial mare, 4YO no competition record, say Burggraaf x Heartbreaker x Ramiro Z in foal or free covering to a good stallion (my good) shouldn't cost you much more than 8-9K€. The top mares can be anything up to 70K€.

I generally won't buy a mare that I can't get at least 75% back on the first foal.
 
Madmare 22 - no she didn't, if she had I would be more appeased although to have it done myself is a drop in the ocean on her value anyway, and I guess since Lupicor is now deceased the value of his better-bred progeny will increase slightly.

Anastasia, thats a lovely comment from a stranger, really makes it all worth while and you know you're on the right track.

I think I may have to wait for a bargain lol, 5 figures is out of range for me unless my '09 foal sells for a fortune....lol It's not that I'm not expecting to pay a decent amount, I was thinking more 3.5 -7k unless we're talking top of the pile breeding or proven mares with all sorts of predicates and comp honours as I know I wont afford those. (though for 80k I'd have been temped to re-mortgage my house for Indoctro's full sister in foal to Berlin!)
smile.gif


Edited - that'd be ok Ken, I'd need an empty one for 7k though lol
 
I guess since Lupicor is now deceased the value of his better-bred progeny will increase slightly.

Not really, he made some nice stock but was a long long way from being a legend. It didn't happen with Darco stock and he is a legend.
 
I think many people see the foals that make top dollar, look at the sires and figure that's why they're bringing the prices they are. So using any mare with a top (or fashionable) stallion should produce the same end results or at least pretty close, right?

Not so much.

Top stallions can have hundreds of offspring - a "fashionable" stallion might be a reason to look, but it's not a reason to buy unless the quality is there in the actual foal. So having a "good" stallion but an average result is likely to bring . . . at best average money. Sure stallions can improve on the mare but you just don't see top foal - quality or value-wise - from average mares. I think some people really do just see the stallion and figure that stud fee is all they really need to invest.

Add in a really good mare and the chances of producing a top foal increases exponentially - that's where the money (if one can say that with horses
wink.gif
) is. She's an investment in the future quality of the product and the long term reputation of the business.

I'm interested how many people "breed for themselves" i.e. for the amateur market but then go to very high profile sport stallions which might be totally unsuitable for what they actually want. Do they think they are going to get something that looks like Salinero but will happily live out, hack down the road, and be an RC horse? I think if that was possible the Europeans would be on it. (There are flukes that go like professionals horses but think like amateur horses . . . .and they are worth INSANE money because people know they're flukes. And generally they aren't out of ordinary mares.) Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating using "lesser" stallions, just questioning the theory that breeding, say, Heartbreaker or Quarterback to an average mare will produce a horse that looks like the stallion but will do for any purpose.

I've seen mares that produce exceptional foals every time, bred to different studs. They really are worth their weight and even super. Perhaps people generally don't see enough related horses to see the strength of those trends and how often one mare produces more than her share of good ones.

It would see much more sensible to start with a mare that is absolutely as close to perfect as possible, cross to a stallion that throws what you want and then hope to heck it all works out.
 
My trainer has just purchased a 6 yr old Oldenburg mare with excellent bloodlines, she scored a 10 for her jump and 9 for paces at her british warmblood grading and her first foal last year was top in his section at futurity and sold at 3 weeks as a potential stallion prospect. She is also in foal to Sanyo and he got her for £3k
shocked.gif
I'm not sure whether that is the market or just circumstances of owner but I could not believe it.
 
And here I was thinking that you were lucky getting meat money for a broodmare. Think I might have sold one of my horses a bit cheap seeing how at her grading she came out top.
 
i got one of my mares from a stud cutting back numbers, she is a ster mare grade a sjumper super temp, manners movement. by a ramiro x marco polo stallion out a a notaris ramiro mare?? she arrive to my door for less than £1500
 
I bought a mare from Germany for £1200 and sold both her foals for 5 figure sums abroad - unfortunately she died of colic when the second foal was a week old, she is still missed as she was such a sweet person. I think there are bargains to be found if you look carefully.

I don't think I would want to sell a broodmare in the UK because I don't think people want to pay much even for top breeding. I have just loaned out my Wenzel/Absatz mare to a friend as I knew I would not sell her.
 
i agree with delphipuppy. there are bargains to be had, but will still say that we should be prepared to pay for good breeding. I bought 2 quality mares for £5500, An A Jungle Prince(Argentinus) mare and a Donnerhall mare one was in foal when i bought her. I bought them in germany, i was lucky a breeder was giving up/downsizing. I had one covered with breitling and the other covered with sandro hit.
I am not ashamned to admit i would like to make money out of breeding and i that i would easily make back what i had spent, including stud fees, livery costs whilst in germany and transport fees. This was not to be. I sold the foal the mare came with but so far have had a bad year with a dead mare and foal and another dead mare and orphan foal. So in fact they turned out not to be bargains after all. I also bought another mare very cheaply, no world beater, but good breeding very trainable, lovely ride, in foal to benvenuto. She had a difficult foaling and so far has cost over £2500 vets bills, cannot be bred from this year and her foal has a cosmetic injury to her hock, therfore diminishing the value of the foal.
My mares are missed terribly.
Bargains can always be found but sometimes there is a price to pay for that bargain. i still maintain we should be willing to pay a good price for a good quality broodmare with proven bloodlines.
 
Well I've been looking for ages and can't seem to find another mare to 'upgrade' my stock that won't break my bank!!
Similar to you others guy's I want a graded mare with good show jump breeding, excellent conformation and some proven SJ ability herself - preferably from previous competition experience or at very least displayed from the grading. I don't mind an old injury perhaps but not a cripple !!
Where do you all find them for reasonable money ??
 
wonkey_donkey....depends on what you class as "reasonably priced"?

Madmare, sorry to hear about all your losses.....how terribly sad. We had a bad year two years ago and it can be soul destroying when things like that happen all at once.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top