Country file..pony meat to keep a breed going

fraggle bells rock

fraggle bells rock

Well-Known Member
Joined
13 March 2009
Messages
4,961
Visit site
I love ponies and horses and as a principle won't eat horse meat but.....
If it's a sensible way of regulating a breed and saving the breed do you think it's the way forward. If it's regulated and the ponies are kept in the best conditions then personally I think it's the way forward. Again I reticulated I wouldn't eat it. But if the market is there....
Discuss??
 
Personally I have no issues with eating horsemeat, as long as...

1. It is not a horse I personally know.
2. It has been produced ethically.

In my view, once you, or a horse, is dead you leave the body.
 
Came on to post about this. Why don't they geld the majority of the colts instead of leaving as I assume they do, would keep numbers down. Im of the opinion that the horsemeat market should be considered, although Im pretty sure we wont eat it in the UK. As long as there is no live export.
 
Wish they wouldn't keep calling them Dartmoor Ponies and saying the breed is worthless, these are crossbred hill ponies living on Dartmoor.
 
Oh if DHP why would we want to keep the 'breed' going beyond the market there already is for it?

and yes, a bit of gelding wouldn't go amiss :p
 
Snuffles said:
Came on to post about this. Why don't they geld the majority of the colts instead of leaving as I assume they do, would keep numbers down. Im of the opinion that the horsemeat market should be considered, although Im pretty sure we wont eat it in the UK. As long as there is no live export.
Click to expand...

The lady from the Dartmore Pony society / association said that they are too wild to ensure that all the stallions are accounted for when they round them up (and it only takes one...) which is why they dart the mares with contraceptives.

Personally, I'm comfortable with ethically raised and slaughtered pigs, goats, sheep, cows and chickens as food, so I don't have a moral issue with horse if the same principles apply. My OH, who is not horsey, said that he wouldn't eat horse meat - having met my horses, he said that something of who they are is part of him now and he thinks it would put him off eating a horse. He is comfortable with pig, cow, goat, sheep and chicken because he "doesn't know any of them personally".
 
It's amazing how every other group of hill kept ponies can manage it though.
Have they stopped using the 'otherwise it doesn't keep bands of mares together' etc etc excuse?
 
fraggle2 said:
I love ponies and horses and as a principle won't eat horse meat but.....
If it's a sensible way of regulating a breed and saving the breed do you think it's the way forward. If it's regulated and the ponies are kept in the best conditions then personally I think it's the way forward. Again I reticulated I wouldn't eat it. But if the market is there....
Discuss??
Click to expand...

If this is about the DHP, they keep coming back to this every couple of years or so, the DHP is NOT a breed, it does not have any set breed standards, registration of breeding, they are just feral ponies of various types with no reason to be saved as such, a few go on to make riding ponies but the majority are poor quality, of fairly wild nature and need to be reduced in some way not encouraged, the Dartmoor pony is totally different, are generally bred responsibly to breed standards and have recorded bloodlines going back generations.
 
Don't let me get going on this............. just don't.

Back in the 1960's - and others on here who're Devonians will remember this - Lady Sayer warned about the pure-bred Dartmoor breed getting diluted by allowing sub-standard coloured ponies to run onto the moor and interbreed with the pure Dartmoors. Dartmoor ponies, the proper Dartmoors, were at that time a really useful breed and desirable for children's ponies, driving etc. Nowadays they are a real rarity and you cannot find one actually running on Dartmoor itself!

As a result of these coloureds running on the moor, over the years there has evolved a sad little runty breed of pony that sadly no one wants. At Tavistock Market a few years back you practically couldn't give them away, no-one wanted them and if they were attracting a bid they were fetching a price like £5 for a pony! FFS. In succeeding years I understand that the farmers have been shooting them because they cannot afford to keep them due to the fact they are getting such low prices for them and they are costing to upkeep.

Lady Sayer could see what was happening, and spoke out about it. Sadly she was ignored. Now, fifty or so years on, what have we got: an awful situation which has got out of hand and could have so easily been avoided. And who suffers? The ponies of course. :(

It makes my P!ss boil it really does :( :( :( :(
 
Last edited:
Could they be used in the pet feed market to increase the quality of meats used? Or is it the same thing that people won't buy pony meat.

Although I wouldn't eat cat, dog or horse, I do think them having a value may reduce their risk of some of the inhumane treatment we see currently.
 
Last edited:
Echo be positive comments. The DHP is not a breed.

Here on the forest, colts have to be removed before a certain date and only licensed 2yo's are allowed to run out after inspection and DNA testing.

Commoners have to take responsibility for their stock. Sub standard animals are just not worth breeding. It seems that the best thing would be to remove all these ponies from the moors and return them back to how they used to be. How they would go about that would be interesting.
 
Not being able to catch them sounds like the most bizarre cop out. As has been said, there is no breed to preserve, shoot the poor little beggars now. If ponies are needed to maintain the integrity of the moors then why not use proper Dartmoors?
 
The 'breed' needs keeping going? I know some cracking ones but on the basis there is no 'breeding' or standards they're not great because they're DHPs, they're great despite it!
 
To me this is utter madness, for the reasons a lot of the other posters have already mentioned.
From a marketing perspective how would you sell the meat? Our meat is sold on high welfare standards, tractability, from farm to fork. To sell for human consumption they would have to be tagged, or else the rest of the livestock producers would go bonkers, rightly so. You can not give a wormer without its recorded, you would have to comply with all the regulations. The chances of being able to do this for basically unhandled animals is not realistic, or economic. They do not grow quick enough so the slaughter weight would be poor.
Then if you comply with all that, where is the market? There is a enough problems selling dairy calves, no one likes the thought of eating cute small animals.
So then you are left with the pet food market, so we want to encourage the breeding of animals with poor welfare standards, for pet food? This problem is not just confined to Dartmoor, the dumped animals in Wales are just as big a welfare problem. Contraception for the mares seems to have worked in Wales, then if someone dumps a colt the cycle does not start again.
The New Forest shows when there is a will and some sort of rules change can be affected, but while there is no will to enforce it I can not see anything changing. Now that's were the RSPCA could spend some of it money.
 
Id have no issue eating horse meat. In fact with so much drama surrounding it id nearly go out looking for it just to bloody eat it and prove to the people who say you can't/shouldn't eat it that i will! Am i going to start frying up my ponies? Probably not. But i would rather eat a horse thats been fed for the purpose and fetched a decent price than have it shot when its been starved to the point of death because noone wanted it.

I do think though that some people keep breeding some ponies in the hope the market will pick up some day and that they will suddenly have loads to sell on. Im assuming theyre much like cattle in that there is a certain age range to cull, and after that the taste is effected - but i could be wrong.
 
In defense of the DHP, I have met a few and all have had excellent temperaments. Surely though, the problem is that they are all owned by someone, and a deliberate choice is made not to geld/restrict stallions etc. unlike the New Forest ponies who again are owned but a collective decision has been made by those owners to restrict numbers and maintain the quality of the stock. I believe that permission of the owners has to be sought before they can be darted with contraceptive or gelded. Since they are not grazing illegally they cannot just be rounded up and gelded or sold for meat.
 
I should imagine many of us may have already eaten horse meat without even knowing it

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/horsemeat-fraud-jailed-628057

Not so sure I would be very happy if I was the previous owner of the horse whose microchip was found in one consignment of meat

I can't see a huge market for horse meat in this country, even in Carrefour in France there was very little horse meat on offer but there was loads of other meat for sale,
go into a pub, chicken and chips, steak and chips can't see horse and chips catching on anytime soon
 
The breeding needs reducing and I think if there was more of a meat trade it would just encourage more breeding.
There is already a trade in horses going for meat in this country and they are exported live too (via Ireland sometimes) Perhaps I wouldn't mind so much if laws were brought in to stop the export of live animals full stop.
 
Cecile said:
I should imagine many of us may have already eaten horse meat without even knowing it

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/horsemeat-fraud-jailed-628057

Not so sure I would be very happy if I was the previous owner of the horse whose microchip was found in one consignment of meat

I can't see a huge market for horse meat in this country, even in Carrefour in France there was very little horse meat on offer but there was loads of other meat for sale,
go into a pub, chicken and chips, steak and chips can't see horse and chips catching on anytime soon
Click to expand...

This is true. My local supermarkets sell just a few packs of horse meat - 2/3 BUT it never comes from the EU. It is always imported from Argentina, Mexico, sometimes Canada.

What is sad is that the minimum value legislation makes it difficult to export ponies, yet there is a big market here for ridden ponies. French children are on average much smaller and lighter than British children. Pony Club is hugely popular here and ponies which jump fetch good prices.
 
Rollin said:
This is true. My local supermarkets sell just a few packs of horse meat - 2/3 BUT it never comes from the EU. It is always imported from Argentina, Mexico, sometimes Canada.

What is sad is that the minimum value legislation makes it difficult to export ponies, yet there is a big market here for ridden ponies. French children are on average much smaller and lighter than British children. Pony Club is hugely popular here and ponies which jump fetch good prices.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure it is sad for the bin end ponies that aren't being shipped live for slaughter. If ponies that jump fetch good prices they would be more than the minimum value?

And yes I know a few good DHPs they are the ones that lucked out on their random breeding (all are of the taller 12.2 up variety) the rest of them aren't so lucky and often aren't terribly well equipped for unattended hill living either.

I think part of the trouble is that if that horse hasn't cost you anything year round then every tenner you sell a foal for his profit, no different to the gypsy types grazing random land. Make them worth more and that is more profit so more reason to continue.
 
The meat industry the world over is just becoming so commoditised and the suffering in these feedlots is worse than anything you can imagine.

Should we commoditise horses? No. We shouldn't be commoditising any animal. I'm no vegan or vegetarian but I won't eat anything that I think has suffered so that strikes a lot of meat off my list. Meat should be a luxury. I'm sad that people think this will end the cruelty! Those people breeding these ponies are criminals themselves imo. Or else there wouldn't be a problem in the first place.
 
Goldenstar said:
Would I eat horse just to keep idiots overbreeding basically semi feral mongrel ponies no I would not .
Click to expand...

this

and what ester said about the every tenner profit thing.


there's no needs for these poor bred scraps. we have extremely good M&M ponies already-including proper Dartmoors. Of course, with the fashion for every adult to be on somethig 16.2h + and the lack of people with enough knowledge to turn the smaller M&Ms into good kids ponies I am far more worried by the future of Exmoors, Fells and Dales than these DHPs.
 
Certain breeds already do survive 'en masse' only because of the meat market; google 'poitevin' (sometimes called the mulassier) horse, a french breed of heavy. Stunning beasties imo! but they are only kept by a few dedicated individuals now, the majority are bred solely for meat now. Same with a couple of other french heavies too, e.g. the boulonnais (spelling is probably out on that, sorry)
Personally I don't believe in killing/eating any animal for meat anyway, even snails. (Mind you they get boiled alive so quite a lot of people object to that).
But I guess so long as slaughter is done locally - removing the need for long distance transport, which is barbaric - and slaughter is done PROPERLY and HUMANELY and there is CCTV is ALL abattoirs, it could be a tragic possibility until the horse market in this country sorts it self out.But ONLY until that happens.
When I was looking for my horse I went to see some cob yearlings - they were emaciated and actually probably not yearlings , probably younger, evidently had worms, feet like persian slippers, at least one or two had snotty noses, and I went off to think on them (owner wanted £500 per pony!!!! :O ) but by the time I went back they'd gone and a horse owner who kept hers in the field next door said he'd probably sent them for meat :( :( :( I still feel torn up about that. If only I'd been less indecisive :(
 
Last edited:
You drift them the same as everyone else does and pull out the boys the same as everyone else does.

Re the breeding for meat - those French breeds are massive and definitely bred for purpose, why would you choose to breed essentially a Shetland cross for the same purpose?
 
Diva&Rosie'sMum said:
Certain breeds already do survive 'en masse' only because of the meat market; google 'poitevin' (sometimes called the mulassier) horse, a french breed of heavy. Stunning beasties imo! but they are only kept by a few dedicated individuals now, the majority are bred solely for meat now. Same with a couple of other french heavies too, e.g. the boulonnais (spelling is probably out on that, sorry)
Personally I don't believe in killing/eating any animal for meat anyway, even snails. (Mind you they get boiled alive so quite a lot of people object to that).
But I guess so long as slaughter is done locally - removing the need for long distance transport, which is barbaric - and slaughter is done PROPERLY and HUMANELY and there is CCTV is ALL abattoirs, it could be a tragic possibility until the horse market in this country sorts it self out.
Click to expand...

Trouble with CCTV is its not fool proof and the ones going about their business in a decent way won't give a monkeys if the CCTV is there or not but as an example:
A camera and tracker was fitted to a van for business, the driver is suspected of various activities at the weekends, tracker was mysteriously broken and so far the camera has been fiddled with twice, magnets used or some such thing to stuff the system
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top