Cribbing and Windsucking - explanation please.

[horsegirl]

but I don't understand how you can possibly know this? Is door kicking because the food is being prepared also pain related? What's the difference?

I am very interested in this as would like to stop him cribbing, not because I think he is in pain but because it is annoying and he damages his stable/fences.

The only experiment I have seen was the one where they fed the horses rennies and the results of that didn't make any sense and negated any value in the study.

 

[horsegirl]

why is it less likely that the horse is getting pleasure from the cribbing (like smoking) than he is doing it to relieve pain?

By the way my vet agrees that it is an addiction and rubbishes the indigestion theory.

 

[sunflower]

Actually I don't think the smoking thing is that far wrong. With smoking it is not just the nicotine that smokers crave - it's that smoking activates dopaminergic reward pathways in the brain. When smokers give up it is not just the nicotine they miss but a lot of people miss the habits and learned behaviour (within a few days the nicotine withdrawel is over)
Horses may start cribbing due to stress / gastric problems etc but how do we know that it does not then just become learned behaviour and that they then crave the sensation of cribbing itself which is no longer to alleiviate pain or discomfort. Therefore removing this original cause may not stop the horse from cribbing if it has become an ingrained habit.

 

[barkinghorse]

Can't see on my post where i said it was "catching"....... was it an answer to another post?

 

[druid]

Ok..I recently purchased a TBxConnemara who windsucks.

He windsucks before eating. Now, he couldn't have had any idea when food was going to arrive in the first few days of being here..and no wind sucking. Once he learnt a routine he sucked again whne food was arriving. We started feeding him Gaviscon/Bisodol an hour before feeds...no sucking.

QED in my view!!

 

[horsegirl]

Sorry, are you saying that it is learnt or indigestion related? I'm not quite sure from your post.

That may have come over a bit rude, it isn't meant to be!

 

[Weezy]

Sorry was using QR!

 

[druid]

Acid reflux rather than indigestion (They may be one and the same thing but I'm not sure..)

Early days - he didn't get reflux becuase he wasn't anticipating food
When he learned a routine he started refluxing again
Now - given antacids before feeding (which, if it were a habitual response would only increase the likelihood of wucking) does not WS...

 

[Weezy]

Well when we were away at a show for example he didnt ever start windsucking to demand a feed! Show stop overs are notoriously stressful but he didnt suck (and certainly not at 4pm) as he didnt know when the feed was coming - its like when you are getting to suppertime - you hear someone in a kitchen, your tummy starts to rumble - same thing

Now, I am talking about sucking here, NOT cribbing - I DO think that horses cribbing are more difficult to stop than suckers - for example, you wont ever see (well in my knowledge) a sucker standing in a field sucking - he will be eating - a cribber is happy to forego the eating and just stand and crib - I need to do more research into cribbers as I do think they are a different ballgame altogether, even if on a level the thing they are DOING (sucking in air) is the same!

 

[horsegirl]

but you could use the same arguement to say it is learned. In fact more so IMO as his stomach would start to "rumble" at some point even when he doesn't know when he is going to be fed.

As soon as he links your routine to feeding he ws in anticipation again.

 

[horsegirl]

Also one more thing If I feed him some rennies he cribs immediately exactly the same response as if I gave him a mint.