Crufts- a step in the right direction for health?

[ester]

And with regard to that green carpet, it may have improved now but when I competed in agility at crufts my Gsd actually fell over on a turn one year, and really struggled on several occasions .

This might be a completely daft question but why do they use carpet!

 

[misterjinglejay]

I showed at crufts a few years ago, and yes, the carpets are a bit slippy - my samoyed, a breed designed for snow and ice, moved carefully on it.

Whilst I agree that the breed standards of certain breeds needs to change, the dogs health and wellbeing being paramount, what happens to the dogs that don't meet any new standard, or fit into a new breeding programme?

Will they end up in rescue centers, or even dumped?

This, I feel is an issue that needs to be addressed before we start changing things too drastically.

 

[s4sugar]

Winning Clumber has been vet rejected; Wonder what was found wrong with this one?
http://www.dogsunit.com/index.php?o...id=740:r5-clumber-spaniel-females&Itemid=1937

 

[Dobiegirl]

Well according to another forum I was on they were all betting that the Clumber would fail also, not because there was anything wrong with it but the KC has to be seen to be doing the right thing after all Crufts is their show piece

 

[CorvusCorax]

Yeah a lot of the shep people are predicting that whoever wins BoB will get pulled, no matter how much testing and titling it might have.

 

[s4sugar]

I heard rumours yesterday that at least one per group would get bounced.

 

[CorvusCorax]

*sigh* that will be us then....I have never liked the idea of dogs of the calibre of Elmo and especially Zamp in that venue in the first place. JMO.

 

[EAST KENT]

The BOB Peke had a small blemish on it`s eye..possible brewing ulcer? The Bulldog also ,I`ve heard.Clumber..well I`ll find out ,have a good friend in those who also has a beautiful little red mini of mine..so I`ll get the full lowdown. Our bull terrier and mini bull terrier judge is all rounder ..Feffie Somerfield..so I doubt any exagerated "banana" heads will go up.Pity really,it would be fun to see what the vets made of that one! Surprisingly it does`nt affect the adult dog at all, just predisposes to birth defects that are fatal.
I think the coverage is great by the way..good old Clare,so sensible and erudite.Glad that appalling scottish git..the "comedy" act from last year is removed this year Hated him.

 

[s4sugar]

FS judged the Clumbers...

 

[cremedemonthe]

Whilst I agree that the breed standards of certain breeds needs to change, the dogs health and wellbeing being paramount, what happens to the dogs that don't meet any new standard, or fit into a new breeding programme?

Will they end up in rescue centers, or even dumped?

This, I feel is an issue that needs to be addressed before we start changing things too drastically.

This is what I was thinking too, if they decide the dog's of no use where will it go?

 

[ester]

where do dogs go now that turn out not to make the grade for breeding or are no longer required for that purposed? I'd assume that responsible breeders (as given that they aare showing I would hope they were) would rehome them responsibly.

 

[CorvusCorax]

What happens to them now most likely - dogs who are too big, too small, off colour, soft ears, curly tails - go to pet homes. But right now - I don't think MORE litters and more experimentation is a good idea.

 

[sprytzer]

According to the KC and Crufts the vet inspection was to be a 'visual' inspection only, no 'aids' allowed.....therefore how did the vet get away with using a torch? A torch would be classed as an 'aid' would it not?
Or have i read it all wrong?

 

[Bosworth]

In my opinion if it is not to breed standard it should then be neutered before being found a family home. Not rehomed entire so it can fall into an irresponsible breeders hands and be bred from again creating the problem.

 

[ester]

but east kent stated banned by the breed club, which is true, she never mentioned it was a committee decision

 

[SusieT]

Another name change grass-proof? Surprise surprise.
So CKCS are not excessively prone to disease? How can you give a dog a bad name about facts? Hiding the facts does not help the dog.

 

[Dobiegirl]

I heard the Bulldog had an old injury to his eye which everyone knew about.

 

[ester]

East Kent it would be useful if you could get your facts right before posting on a public forum

Where did I suggest that EK said it was a committee decision? I was merely clarifying that it wasnt

Obviously semantics then, said woman was not banned she was voted off the committee and was asked to leave the club....however if you prefer the emotive phraseology thats fine

Well you suggested that East Kent had her facts wrong, in fact you are now suggesting she used the word banned instead of asked to leave as an inaccuracy. From which one presumes said lady could re-join the club if she wanted to (but presumably chooses not to). If she cannot rejoin it rather amounts to the same thing as banning.

 

[Inthemud]

East Kent it would be useful if you could get your facts right before posting on a public forum "That brilliant Cav Health Officer" was voted out of the CKCS club by club members (NOT the committee) after an extraordinary general meeting was demanded by club members who were concerned about the damage she was doing to the breed by her approach to health issues in the breed.

Members of the committee did not all feel that this was the right course of action, but the regulations governing the club mean that the members had to be listened to, and their actions were therefore acted upon.

Whatever the subtleties of semantics, the way that lady was treated is a disgrace and her loss will be to the long term detriment of the breed.

 

[SusieT]

Easier to ignore the questions than face the truth. (And then hide behind a new name..)

 

[Dobiegirl]

For gods sake SusieT you are never happier unless you are mixing it, just let it drop.

 

[EAST KENT]

Whatever the subtleties of semantics, the way that lady was treated is a disgrace and her loss will be to the long term detriment of the breed.

My point exactly.Until breed clubs face up honestly to problems,and not villify a Health Officer DOING HER JOB,the breed is the loser in the long run..oh and all the grieving pet owners of defective cavs. This counts for all breeds BTW,face it chin on,deal with it..had quite a few set backs over the forty years in my own lines..but,faced it and bred it out..THAT is the way of progress. Committees are an anathema..little people trying to be someone and trampling on anyone in their way.That lady was a star. In my opinion in cavs every one should be MRI`d and only clears bred from,it may be severe ..and it will take time..but it is the only way forward. And of course..start raising money for the AHT to do the work on the DNA of it,we did it in mini bull terriers..and so too can cavs.
I would imagine "the members" wanted her out BTW because their nice little earner of churning out good sellers like cavs was threatened.We are quite forgetting the multiple heart diseases that breed can suffer and eye disease as well,the breed has a very very long road of honest breed assessment before it could be called healthy.Such a shame,a perfect first dog for most families too.

 

[EAST KENT]

I said she was asked to leave.....she can rejoin if she wishes to do so...

And,as no doubt new applications are discussed at committee ,she would be refused!!

 

[Alec Swan]

I'll admit to having a rather jaundiced view of the show bench,..........
.....
I suspect that the answer would be to re-define those breeds at risk, by using other and related breeds to widen the gene pool, and if needs be, the breed societies could look again at the standards which they set. Considering the Clumber Spaniel, for instance, an accepted introduction of perhaps Springer Spaniel, with a subsequent breeding out of the Springer influence, may well be a way forward. How anyone would correct the deformities from Pekes, Bulldogs or Pugs, would be another question though!! That's a "for instance".

I'm wondering what others think, and would welcome their views.

Alec.

I would be saddened to hear that those who have opinions feel unable to express them. Come on, surely there are those with a voice. There must be those who see the problem as I do, surely.

Alec.

 

[misterjinglejay]

I agree, Alec, and there are some 'old style' bulldogs and pugs etc around, but you won't see them in the show ring, as they don't fit the dreaded breed standard!

Maybe they could be used to breed out the faults, but breeders won't do that until the standard is changed, and as I said earlier, although this needs to happen, it needs to be slow. The dogs that don't 'fit' would need to be dealt with, as I can see rescues filling up quickly

 

[Tashza]

Dog World (dog showing paper) link re clumber

http://www.dogworld.co.uk/product.p...ulldog_fail_high_profile_vet_checks_at_crufts

Enlarge of clumber report link (for those that want to jump straight to it)
http://www.dogworld.co.uk/shopimages/products/normal/mainsite/certificate.jpg

Hope they work

 

[Custard Cream]

It's been announced that a Dogue de Bordeaux collapsed outside the NEC yesterday, was attended by vets and taken to a nearby vet clinic were it was put down.

 

[Dobiegirl]

http://www.chazhound.com/forums/showthread.php?t=151756&page=3

The American Kennel Club may take longer to convince, post 28

 

[s4sugar]

How many people know what ectropion is or that the Newfie shows more haw than the Clumber?

 

[MurphysMinder]

http://www.chazhound.com/forums/showthread.php?t=151756&page=3

The American Kennel Club may take longer to convince, post 28

That doesn't surprise me, many of the American "versions" of breeds are far more exaggerated than the UK ones.