death 2012

the poor girl died. Does the judges verdict now mean that all "equipment" ie tack and carriages needs to be inspected by a competent person at any horse competition.? the implications are massive.
 
Backtoblack said:
the poor girl died. Does the judges verdict now mean that all "equipment" ie tack and carriages needs to be inspected by a competent person at any horse competition.? the implications are massive.
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Well the organisers will need to have permission to use the land for starters….
 
Backtoblack said:
the poor girl died. Does the judges verdict now mean that all "equipment" ie tack and carriages needs to be inspected by a competent person at any horse competition.? the implications are massive.
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I think they key bit is here

Mr Farrer said the equipment used in the event was not inspected by organisers before the competition and those taking part were not required to wear safety equipment.

"Participants were allowed to choose whether to wear such equipment. On the day of the event it was a warm, hot day and Angharad chose not to wear a helmet."

Experts instructed by the prosecution said the route was not suitable for carriage driving and was unsafe because it was too narrow and too steep, the court heard.

She was allowed to compete without a helmet and on an unsuitable course. There is a reason why affiliated events/ BRC etc check and tag hats etc and courses are inspected to a given standard.

Very sad for all involved.
 
Backtoblack said:
the poor girl died. Does the judges verdict now mean that all "equipment" ie tack and carriages needs to be inspected by a competent person at any horse competition.? the implications are massive.
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It is already at driving events. I lived and worked in the afan argoed national park, its not somewhere I'd want to be carriage driving. Its incredibly steep and twisty. Its in the top ten places in the world to mountain bike due to the terrain! I didn't even really like riding in a lot of it despite how beautiful it was.
 
so a fun 'ride' organised by the local riding club that was also affiliated to BDS? and as the riding club no longer exists fault automatically to BDS?

BDS don't have the same rules re. safety equipment as other bits of driving.
 
I wonder 🤔 if tack inspection will be implemented by other disaplines in view of this judges ruling. And local shows might have to ensure all competitors have tack checks by a suitable qualified person? How does anyone decide who is suitable to do this?
 
Backtoblack said:
I wonder 🤔 if tack inspection will be implemented by other disaplines in view of this judges ruling. And local shows might have to ensure all competitors have tack checks by a suitable qualified person? How does anyone decide who is suitable to do this?
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As I mentioned up thread tack inspections are already done at affiliated events, BRC and PC. Stewards are trained to do it.
 
All organisations I know, down to the smallest local show these days, require everyone to wear a current standard hat while mounted and body protector for cross country. There's nothing in that judgement that suggests any greater equipment check is needed that that, or am I missing something?
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Endurance used to have tack and hat checks then they stopped doing them. Does anyone know if they still don't do them?and who decides who does them in other disaplines ( sp)?is there a recognised national certificate of competence? An sqp like for those selling wormers?
 
What is anyone reading in what's been pointed to so far that a tack check was recommended? The only thing I can see is that she should have been required to wear a hat. Her death may have been avoided by wearing a hat. The accident was caused by the terrain, not by any tack malfuction.

The steward tack check at dressage is for dressage legal bits and nosebands and the judge might spot a colour/style non-compliant saddle. The noseband and bit check is done after competing, not before. I don't think there is any tack check for show jumping or the jumping phases of eventing, is there? It's the competitors responsibility to have tack that works.
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In british carriage driving novice competitors are required to have a harness/safety check before starting, not sure they'd pick up if a wheel was going to fall off, might depend what the rest of the carriage looked like.

(BDS is mostly driven showing, so certainly less of a helmet culture and they no longer cover timed events- this is maybe why)
 
Backtoblack said:
Endurance used to have tack and hat checks then they stopped doing them. Does anyone know if they still don't do them?and who decides who does them in other disaplines ( sp)?is there a recognised national certificate of competence? An sqp like for those selling wormers?
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They haven't done tack inspections at endurance rides for many years now and still don't do them, they don't check the safety standards of hats either.
Edited to add I'm not sure anyone would want the job of tack checking, what would happen if something did go wrong after a check, or the rider disagreed with the tack checker.
 
webble said:
2 wheelers always made me a bit nervous just using them for showing, cones and dressage. It amazed me people did the marathon in them
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I have driven a marathon with a two wheeler. The manouverability is superior to a four wheeler. The problems come with keeping the balance right on hills, the groom needs to be well versed in where to position themselves not to make matters worse.
 
I have attended BDS drives and events for the last 15yrs and the only time I have seen anyone drive without an up-to-date safety helmet is in driven showing classes, so it is tragic that she was not wearing a hat.

It does sound like the organisers were completely irresponsible and negligent in their choice of course/route, and didn't take the terrain or ability of the drivers into account. These sorts of events are usually run and staffed by volunteers so it will be interesting to see how the BDS improves this in the future. I have seen a few dodgy decisions at local BDS driven trek and also branch drive-outs which I think would have been seen as H&S negligence if an accident had happened, but it is completely dependent on the knowledge and experience of the volunteer committees arranging them so rather hit and miss.

As a tangent thought, I do think it would be a good idea to introduce thorough tack checks at all ridden PC activities/events. The participants are mostly minors so can't be expected to take responsibility themselves (or have the knowledge to do so, or the money to replace worn items), and I have picked up a few shockers over the years which could have resulted in a nasty accident if the rider had continued. If parents knew it was mandatory then they would be more likely to replace items before they became dangerous, which would also protect the child when riding at home and at non-PC events.
 
ester said:
In british carriage driving novice competitors are required to have a harness/safety check before starting, not sure they'd pick up if a wheel was going to fall off, might depend what the rest of the carriage looked like.

(BDS is mostly driven showing, so certainly less of a helmet culture and they no longer cover timed events- this is maybe why)
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And you have to pass a competency certificate before you can compete.
 
Backtoblack said:
and who decides who does them in other disaplines ( sp)?is there a recognised national certificate of competence? An sqp like for those selling wormers?
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No, because they are checking standards, not fit (there is a qualification for tack shop staff for fitting hats). It is a very simple job. The hat checkers are provided with a list of the legal up-to-dat hat standards, which they check against the sticker in the hat. If the hat has the right sticker they're good to go, if it does not have the right sticker then you don't get to compete. Same with body protectors. Every single hat and body protector is checked at every single BRC competition, then coloured tape is put on the harness so that when you are mounted stewards can see that it has been checked. At BE you get the hat checked when you first buy it, or first compete, then the coloured tape is put on, then it is not often checked again so long as the tape is visible to denote that it has been checked.
 
Steerpike said:
or the rider disagreed with the tack checker.
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That bit is simple. It's the rules of the competition. Whether or not you agree with the tack checker is irrelevant really. You either compete with the legal tack, or you don't compete. The rulebook sets out pretty much exactly what you can and can't have.
 
Unless it's a myler combination ATM but confirms what you say as what checkers has said has been final word.
www.horseandhound.co.uk

Concern and confusion as FEI bans bit used by top riders - Horse & Hound

Stewards’ different and contradictory decisions about a certain bit at international competition have highlighted the grey areas and inconsistencies that can exist in FEI rules. At the Kentucky Three-Day Event in April, Canadian rider Katie Malensek was eliminated from the four-star in relation...
www.horseandhound.co.uk www.horseandhound.co.uk
 
What a tragic outcome to what should have been a fun horsey day out.

I do think this will have some wider implications. Not least around affiliated riding clubs and their governing bodies. In this case it looks like the incident happened at an event organised by an independent but affiliated club and which didn't follow any of the governing body's rules, didn't carry out any risk assessments and didn't even get permission to use the tracks, but when the club folded the governing body were deemed legally liable for the incident. British Riding Clubs have a similar relationship with their clubs.
 
That just sounds like a horrifically organised event. It does seem unfair that the people actually responsible (ie the club that decided to use unsuitable land without permission, not employ enough first aiders, not require safety gear) seem to have not been penalised. They have just disbanded and the BDS have to pick up the pieces. As the governing body, they should have strict rules in place to say that events must have xyz safety checks, but where is the comeback for the people who actually organised it? Or am I missing something?
 
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