Degree of fetlock drop during movement

[BBP]

BBP clearly knows I have been having dark thoughts about his future, and has decided he is no longer depressed, he can extend his forelimbs to land heel first and can get up ok thanks very much. He has a vet workup on Monday and I’ve had some generous input from various experts and therapists so far.

But the degree of natural fetlock drop, now it has been pointed out to me, is a big concern to me. I question whether, had I been more aware, should I ever have asked him to carry my weight as well. How does it affect the structures above, does it destabilise them or put more stress on them. Or not? I’m now utterly obsessed with staring at fetlocks during movement. Obviously we all know that a degree of drop is normal and healthy, it’s part of the natural shock absorption process. And at speed, or when jumping, that degree increases as the forces on the joint increase. But during your average trot or canter what degree of drop is acceptable to ask the horse to also comfortably carry a rider? I now see so many top level dressage horses with fetlocks touching the ground even in working paces, I wonder about their long term soundness. I wonder if you might share any pictures of your horses at trot and canter, at the point of the stride where the cannon bone is vertical and baring the most weight, so I can get some comparative views of ‘normal’ horses?

 

[ester]

front or back or both?

 

[BBP]

Both/either! Back is where BBPs issue is, but a picture of Glocks Zonik had me looking at fronts in other horses.

 

[Meowy Catkin]

You may have seen this but the section from 16 mins 16 seconds might help. It does include a slow trot vid (16 mins 53 secs).

When he stands square with his weight evenly distributed between his limbs, are his fetlock angles a matched pair of fores and a matched pair of hinds?

When he moves, do you have even drop and even spring back up again with each pair of limbs?

 

[Jeni the dragon]

Quite a lot here.

 

[BBP]

You may have seen this but the section from 16 mins 16 seconds might help. It does include a slow trot vid (16 mins 53 secs).

When he stands square with his weight evenly distributed between his limbs, are his fetlock angles a matched pair of fores and a matched pair of hinds?

When he moves, do you have even drop and even spring back up again with each pair of limbs?

What an amazing demonstration of tendons and ligaments under pressure. I’ve only watched minutes 16-19 but I’ll definitely be going back to watch the rest at some point.

Visually they do appear to be even pairs. Fronts are not even with backs.

looking at that leg in the press, I would say bbp appears in trot as that horse does at higher speeds. So I wonder once he (BBP) reaches harder workloads/speeds, he has nowhere else to go in terms of shock absorption and elastic ‘spring’ back, and hence why his canter is quite weak behind. Like a few people on here, Expert vet suggested from videos that the degree of drop suggested stretched and/or degenerating suspensory apparatus. Hence in to the hospital next week.

Didn’t stop him leaping around like a pogo stick yesterday.

 

[millikins]

Good luck with his scan. But for flexible fetlocks in horses with a reputation for long term soundness look at some pictures of hackneys in action

 

[Meowy Catkin]

In old photos, does he have different angles to his joints (hind limbs) compared to now when he stands square?

Has he always been 'weak' behind?

I'm sure the vets have thought of this anyway but the issue could be his back? Something pressing on his spinal cord in just the wrong way could cause a hind limb, bilateral weakness.

 

[BBP]

In old photos, does he have different angles to his joints (hind limbs) compared to now when he stands square?

Has he always been 'weak' behind?

I'm sure the vets have thought of this anyway but the issue could be his back? Something pressing on his spinal cord in just the wrong way could cause a hind limb, bilateral weakness.

I’d say he’s never been a strong horse. He can trot for hours, he’s an absolute bundle of energy, but ask him to canter up a hill and he just doesn’t have an engine. Never has.
I can’t seem to find a comparable photo at the moment. He doesn’t looked particularly low when standing.
Vets want to do the full nerve block works which I understand is the correct process to follow, but I’m concerned after how bad he was to block last time. I don’t want to stress him out further or put the staff at risk. Plus I already know he has issues in feet and in sacroiliac, so I’m not sure how much clarity blocks will bring.
Ideally I want them to run a neuro assessment and then to assess the fetlock drop and integrity of suspensories and give me a view on those initially, rather than doing the full works. But I’m not a vet, I don’t hold much clout, and I could easily be wrong!

 

[Meowy Catkin]

I would write down all your observations about BBP (changes, things that haven't changed, symmetry, anything that isn't symmetrical, things he finds hard/easy etc...) and also any questions that you want to ask. It's always super frustrating when you forget something that might be useful to the vet or even something that you just want to know the answer to. Email them any videos or photos that show your concerns.

Then you've done your best to get them fully informed about his background. Then it's really down to their expertise.

I wish you (and BBP) the best of luck.