Deposits

Nice vet- giving up his time and getting involved in a client's case, which may damage his reputation if any of the seller's friends use him.....write the 200 quid off op and move on.
 
Genuinely if I were you I'd walk away. You've lost £200 but it the grand scheme of things that's not much really. If you took this to SCC you may waste more money and put yourself under undue stress.
In retrospect you should have discussed the terms of the deposit with the seller, had you done this you would have realised both your ideas of what the deposit was for differed. Of course what good is retrospect now, but it may make you be extra careful in future.

Save yourself stress, walk away, look for another horse and be meticulous about any terms with next seller.
 
i would be amazed if a 17 year old ridden animal passed a flexion test ! and i should think actualy doing the test would indeed have made it lame . i cant see why the vet was digusted and he certainly seems to be taking it beyond his call of duty .
 
I would be amazed if a vet, with his duty of professional conduct were to attend a small claims hearing without being formally requested to attend by the court or any representative of either party....which would be unlikely anyway for SCC.

If this was over a 20k horse, I would pursue...but honestly, I would write this off.

I certainly wouldn't allow my vet to become involved in any legal action...I value my vets and would never put them in a position which could eventually lose them a good reputation and future business. If I were your vets boss, I would not allow it. If your vet is the boss, then he must not be that worried about his reputation.

I can't believe your vet emails you. No vet I have known...and I have worked for one of, if not the best equine vet in the uk...has the time to sit and do things like that. It is always a quick phone call or a letter sent out by admin staff with a report.

This just makes no sense...30 years with horses and never heard of a few of the things mentioned by the OP.

OP, put it down to experience and go enjoy your new horse...any further action on this will be taking your time away from a new horse you should be bonding with.
 
While I have viewed horses and gone through the motions when I have arrived on the yard taken one look at it and decided that the owner was deluded if I liked the person and did not want to appear rude , I may even take sometime to try to nudge them into to thinking more realisticly about the horse .
But I would never fork out to have a horse vetted to avoid appearing impolite that just seems silly to be either you want or a horse and pay for a vet or you say thank you very much but not for me and walk away.
 
If this is serious and you go to court I should imagine you'll walk away having lost more money. They will produce a vet to say it is fit for purpose (highly likely it is).

I'd seriously consider whether you have the money to potentially throw away. Even if you win you'll have lost time and money on such a small amount.

I'd chalk this one up. You say it wasn't what you wanted before you had vetted. If seller is on here they'll be laughing in court...
 
Having bought and sold dozens of horses I just cannot believe that a vet would get involved with a dispute between client and vendor. The money and your argument is nothing to do with him, either he's incredibly unprofessional or you're being economical with the truth.

If you give a deposit, it is usually to hold the horse until either you can get him vetted, or pick him up etc.
If you then decide not to go ahead with the sale, you lose your deposit. The deposit has done its job - they didn't sell to anyone else while you were organising the vetting, so why should they then lose their money?

I would also be dubious about a 17yr old hack failing a flexion test. Tbh you would struggle to find a horse of that age that didn't have any minor aches or stiffness.
 
Patterdale said:
Having bought and sold dozens of horses I just cannot believe that a vet would get involved with a dispute between client and vendor. The money and your argument is nothing to do with him, either he's incredibly unprofessional or you're being economical with the truth.

If you give a deposit, it is usually to hold the horse until either you can get him vetted, or pick him up etc.
If you then decide not to go ahead with the sale, you lose your deposit. The deposit has done its job - they didn't sell to anyone else while you were organising the vetting, so why should they then lose their money?

I would also be dubious about a 17yr old hack failing a flexion test. Tbh you would struggle to find a horse of that age that didn't have any minor aches or stiffness.
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On the flexion test issue OP has never said what happened on the flexion test I suspect the vet saw a marked difference between one joint on one leg and the others , that would be enough to fail a horse whatever the age whatever it's for it's also important to remember its not a vetting job to speculate on why the reaction was there just take a judgement on if it's relevant.
If the horse remained unlevel for more than a coupe of steps after flexion on one leg I would expect it to be failed.
The vet could well be an expert witness if experianced with horse as to what the normal course of action is concerning returning deposits but honestly I would not be bothering but shame on the seller not nice behaviour .
 
OP can you please explain this database you speak of??
I have been a vet nurse for over 10 years 6 of which in Equine pratice and i have never heard of sucha thing!? also i suspect there would be serious re-procussions if your vet or others were keeping such a thing. Data protection for 1! also a horse may fail a vetting for a event rider wanting to comp. same horse vetted for a happy hacker might fail vettings are suitability for a job.
can anyone shed any light on this database??
 
dolly-daydream said:
Thank you for all your intresting posts, I have copied part of the vets letter to the owner of the horse, as I told my vet what was going on, as yet the owner has not refunded the deposit.
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vets letter to owner
As you know fortunately I followed the official procedure for a 2 stage vetting (with full written records and identification of the horse) and I will issue an official BEVA certificate stating that in my opinion on the balance of probabilities, the conditions reported do prejudice this horse’s suitability for purchase to be used for for general riding and hacking (ie a fail), should the two of you not resolve the matter between yourselves.
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I will now go and copy her reply.
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I really don't understand your vets comment about issuing the vetting certificate. It's almost as though he is saying he will issue it as some kind of threat... When I had a horse vetted who then failed the vet left the yard without saying a word to the owner, she advised me that I was the client and as such they did not get involved with the horses owner. The vetting report, which I had paid for, was posted to me without me having to request a copy.

Also having seen the advert it states Hack / companion / broodmare. Given that 2/3 of these jobs are non-ridden it would suggest that the mare was not up for a lot of work.

Having been to the small claims court in the last 12 months I can tell you it was a lot of stress, the sellers could put in a counterclaim (cost of keeping the horse for the week, additional adverts etc). Whilst the initial cost to file via money claim is not too expensive you will need to make a further payment for the hearing, cost of sending out paperwork etc
 
That would be fab if there's a database of failed vettings.

Why would it be illegal? It could only say on X date, X horse failed a vetting for X purpose. Its more likely not to happen because vets will lose out on money of horses being vetted by person after person until they pass.

OP, I did this once, cheeky cow selling horse which wasn't right kept the deposit after failed vetting. Stupid me for not insisting on a receipt for it. Just learn from it.
 
The horse is NOT lame though....it had a reaction to flexion. And you know what, I am pretty sure most 50 year old people would be a bit lame if their leg was hoisted round their hip too!

10% or 1/10th lame on flexion is barely anything at all. A lot of horses would show as 1/10th lame WITHOUT flexion!!

Something really does not sit right in what you are saying at all!!
 
I'm another who thinks you'd have to search high and low to find a 17 year old TB who did not come up 1/10 lame on front flexions. That would be a pass, in my book. I think the sellers probably feel exactly the same and that's why they won't refund your deposit.

There are many, many people riding around on 1/10 lame horses who don't even know it. It really is hardly lame at all, in fact by definition it's the least possible amount of lameness that you can have without being lame at all. It takes an expert or someone very familiar with the horse's normal action to even spot it.
 
Did you know there was a sight that vets list failed horses, yes they do do it on the day they fail them on.
No there isn't! As others have said a pre purchase exam (vetting!) is on the day exam for suitability for THAT purchaser! Not a pass/fail on the horse for ever!
 
cptrayes said:
I'm another who thinks you'd have to search high and low to find a 17 year old TB who did not come up 1/10 lame on front flexions. That would be a pass, in my book. I think the sellers probably feel exactly the same and that's why they won't refund your deposit.

There are many, many people riding around on 1/10 lame horses who don't even know it. It really is hardly lame at all, in fact by definition it's the least possible amount of lameness that you can have without being lame at all. It takes an expert or someone very familiar with the horse's normal action to even spot it.
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Exactly, YO had a cob for sale and this happend their instructor advised the buyers to go ahead with the purchase as she said most horses are lamer than that and are ridden everyday, they had had two other vettings done on other horses with much worse results until they bought him.
 
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