did you know most dentistry practiced is still illegal

S

spiderella

New User
Joined
25 June 2009
Messages
4
Visit site
after looking into this a lot ive found out that it is still illegal for dentist to do level 2 procedures! they are still classed as veterinary acts under the 1966 vet act and as it hasnt been amended yet these are still only legally done by a vet.so even though some are qualified through beva or wwaed it means nothing as at the moment they are still illegal do be carried out by a edt.this is all freely available information by going on the defra website or the baedt web site,so even though insured these acts would not stand up in a big claim as the insurance company would have a get out claus as they are only covered for level 1 procedures at present. so all and any exams at present are meaningless untill a law change.in the event of something going wrong liability would fall upon any vet who has sedated ect at the time, edts are only carrying out these acts on the good will of vets. if you dont belive me go on the web sites mentioned and check
level 2 procedures are listed here
Catergory 2:


Extraction from the mouth of teeth loosened otherwise than by external physical force (including extraction of teeth of incisors and temporary cheek teeth).


<!--[if !supportLists]-->Extraction from the mouth of teeth loosened as a result of external physical force after consultation with a qualified person who has examined the equine.

<!--[endif]-->
<!--[if !supportLists]-->Extraction of healthy, fully erupted and non-displaced vestigial upper pre-molars (“wolf teeth”).

<!--[endif]-->
<!--[if !supportLists]-->Extraction of dental fragments and palliative rasping of fractured and adjacent teeth.

<!--[endif]-->
<!--[if !supportLists]-->Treatment of fractured and diseased teeth which does not involve the cutting of tissue.

<!--[endif]-->
<!--[if !supportLists]-->Removal of dental overgrowths over 5mm tall involving at least 50% of the occlusal surface which include overgrowth of the whole tooth (“dental hook”).

<!--[endif]-->
<!--[if !supportLists]-->Procedures requiring the use of dental shears, inertia hammers and powered dental instruments (including power rasps).

<!--[endif]-->
Orthodontic treatment not involving surgery
 
so any wolf tooth removal/hooks or use of any power tools is illegal.................weather you have passed a exam or not its still there for all to see in black and white
bloody shocking isnt it
 
Well its certainly shocking that so many dental technicians are going around offering and doing all this stuff that is Level 2 procedures as if its part of their very important job.
I was horrified when I saw a EDT at my friends yard working on a 4 year old cob. First he said the horse had a massive diastema (gap) in its front teeth that was abnormal, well horse didn't have a full mouth so I reckon it was younger anyway. He filed the gap to stop food sticking in it !! Well the mouth was still all on the move, with possibly only partially erupted teeth so that seemed very strange to me. Then he took out the wolf teeth then he said the horse had a wave mouth and got out the electric power tools, then when he had finished that with various sized attachments he then proceeded to "even everything up" with the final power tool. Vet was there and horse was heavily sedated.
(It will be bit seats next I'm sure). I was aghast at all this seemingly unnecessary work on a horse that had not got a full mouth. As the client was known to be a wealthy person I just though the EDT was just looking to make a lot of money.
I think some of these EDT are getting a bit above themselves.
My friend who was there with her horse to have its teeth done, gave him a bit of a wry look and he never even mentioned power tooling her, as he must have sensed that she would not be falling for that.
Hence her bill was about £30.00!!

Years ago we didn't even have a horse dentist, just the vet if there was a significant problem.
Sorry to offend, but I just think a lot of it is a big rip off!
And I do have the vet check my horses teeth annually, before anyone suggest that I don't, and my horse has a rasp or anything serious sorted out. ( he had bad root decay last year and need remedial work undertaken).
This was something that was tangible and evident as my horse had the foulest breath everm and now he is ok.
frown.gif
 
Yes the above is true but there is an exemption order going through at the moment (may take time though) to allow qualified EDTs to perform such tasks legally. Additionally, the RCVS have also stated that they have no interest in persuing any legal ramifications regarding qualified EDTs performing routine tasks such as wolf tooth removal and the use of power equipment.
Non qualified EDTs performing these tasks is a different matter though and consider there are hundreds of non qualified EDTs and only 70 odd qualified ones.
Storminateacup, I am sorry you had a bad experience but please dont tar everyone with the same brush. I use power instruments routinely and I charge exactly the same if I were to do the job with power as I would by hand. In fact it is far more beneficial for the owner/horse as more can be done using power regarding tooth reduction as would not be possible by hand.
 
it is a bit of a "grey area" BEVA, DEFRA, LANTRA and the RCVS are all fully aware that we use power regularly and none of them are interested in taking any qualified EDT to court or persuing any legal allegations over it but at the same time it is illegal. Hence the RCVS exemption order going (eventually) through allowing us to use them.

Personally i think that RCVS are not worried about qualified EDTs using them it is just the hundreds of unqualified ones they are wanting to stamp out. In order for the EDT to become qualified and pass the British Equine Veterinary Association/British Veterinary Dental Association exam (BEVA/BVDA), you have to display work to a v high standard using power.
 
so in all yes it is illegal but tolorated,qualification or no qualification if anything goes wrong the edts insurance company can and will wriggle out of it,the exemption order as far as i can gather from defra has been going to get changed for the past 5 years and will quite possibly take another 5 years as includes regulations for bare foot trimmers.chiropractors/phisios ect ect.
so yes by doing and performing level 2 procedures a edt is breaking the law and leaving themselves open to a private prosecution by an owner if anything ever went wrong.even the people who are on the beva and wwaed lists are still illegal.
 
[ QUOTE ]
it is a bit of a "grey area" BEVA, DEFRA, LANTRA and the RCVS are all fully aware that we use power regularly and none of them are interested in taking any qualified EDT to court or persuing any legal allegations over it but at the same time it is illegal. Hence the RCVS exemption order going (eventually) through allowing us to use them.

Personally i think that RCVS are not worried about qualified EDTs using them it is just the hundreds of unqualified ones they are wanting to stamp out. In order for the EDT to become qualified and pass the British Equine Veterinary Association/British Veterinary Dental Association exam (BEVA/BVDA), you have to display work to a v high standard using power.

[/ QUOTE ]

But what is the point of having to pass exams to a high standard using power, if you then aren't legally allowed to go out and practise?
 
I was involved in discussions about the legality of equine dentistry way back in 1999 - 2000...With representatives from the veterinary profession, the equine dentistry industry and the government (MAFF, as was then...now DEFRA). We in the equine dental Industry, wanted the situation clarifying and were seeking legal status to practice what we had trained extensively to undertake.

The then president of the British Equine Veterinary Assosiation Invited ALL known working equine dental practitioners to discus the matter and to put the RCVS's stance and viewpoint across. ...Which was that, although certain proceedures are classed as "Acts of Veterinary Surgery", it was considered that the vast majority of the horse owning public had more faith in these proceedures being undertaken by a "Equine dentist" than by a vet, and so the Royal College of Veterinary surgeons considered it not in the public interest to persue any legal action against a non veterinary practitioner who was performing such acts providing it could be proven that the animals welfare was not compromised in any way. They also recognised that, there was such a great need for equine dental proceedures coupled with a distict lack of specialist training on such matters within the Veterinary profession that that this supported their view. As a result the now fully recognised equine dental qualifications were born.

The BEVA and the RCVS pledged us their full suport to secure changes to current legislation both bodies and ourelves recognised at the time that the 1966 vet surgeons act was , In part, outdated and in need of modification to reflect modern NEEDS and PRACTICES.

However, that was then.....and this is now. things havent changed one bit because the powers that be....e.g. the government do not consider YOUR horses to be important enough to push such changes through. So things that havnt changed:

Still not enough vets speciallly trained in "specialist equine dental proceedures" to fill the need.

No closer to getting the rquired changes to the Vet surgeons act

RCVS and BEVA still see no benifit in and chance of securing a sucessfull prosecution of a "QUALIFIED" equine dental practitioner who is undertaking "certain equine dental proceedures" e.g. "CATAGORY TWO PROCEEDURES".
 
Good post...I'll still be using my qualified EDT rather than my vet who has minimal training on the dentistry. I wouldn't go to my GP for a filing.

On the point of the law did you know that currently under UK law (the same law you refer to regarding vet practises) Royal Navy ships that enter the Port of London must provide a barrel of rum to the Constable of the Tower of London. I wonder if they do...

also in England, all men over the age of 14 must carry out two hours of longbow practice a day...er might be out dated and not followed.

Oh and in Chester, Welshmen are banned from entering the city before sunrise and from staying after sunset...I think the Welsh may well find this rascist!

Point is law means very little if the court system doesn't up hold it.
 
spiderella.....the "point" of passing the exam is that WHEN.....(and it is getting closer) the time comes that the ammendments to the said "Act" are made, it will allow those who have BOTHERED to take the exams to carry out such proceedures....so, it is a case of setting the wheels in motion in preparation for that time. The legal changes which are affoot once presented the same anology as with Para medics.... e.g. there were certain things which they were perfectly capable of doing, but which were legally only permitted by DOCTORS.....changes to the law now allows these acts to be carried out by trained and qualified Para professionals....Similar changes are afoot to allow Veterinary Nurses to undertake minor surgical proceedures as well as Vets.

However, the most important thing about any exam is that it sets a STANDARD within an Industry.....So yes, it may be "Illegal", if you want to follow the letter of the law exactly to the letter....but with a MAJORITY of practitioners who are NOT qualified and a MINORITY who are, at least the horse owner can be assured that those who are "qualified" are capable of producing a high standard of treatment. If you havent taken the exam....how can you possibly know what is required when you treat a horse. ??? The motive to become "qualified" is to prove how GOOD you are and to show how good you are and how much you actually know about what you are doing and charging money for....I will gladly sit any test offered to prove I am good at what I do. The question one should ask surely is "why not take the exam??" What are the reasons for not taking it. If you are providing a service and taking good people's money, why are you not prepared to show your clients how good you are. Part of the reason many dont wish to become "qualified" is because Legally, they dont have to be....and as long as people are using them and paying them, they are making a living so why BOTHER to be tested.....that is a question of MORALS....?

A word on Isurance....The company providing our insurance for carrying out such "Illegal" acts are fully aware of the current situation and have given assurance that as long as the individual is "Qualified" (as defined in the proposed legislation) then that individual WILL be covered under the terms of the policy...e.g. for carrying out catagory two equine dental proceedures.

Where individual practitioners who are NOT suitably "qualified" are carrying out those proceedures, there is a possibility that the animals welfare may be compromised and this is a different situation.
 
Actually it was me who asked what the point was - and it still seems ridiculous to me. ED's who have qualified should be able to carry out the procedures they have trained for - legally!

Anyway, I am having Dan Astle Carter out to my horses on Thursday, he uses Le Clair power tools.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top