difficult problem!!!

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charliebucket

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Hi all, just wanting to know if anyone has any ideas on a difficult problem i am having at the moment with my horse - he is a rising 8 clysdale x and has only ever been in a school 5 times in his life - schooled on grass - each time going in the school has just bucked and not gone forward
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each time there has been a battle and given up. this was with previous owner. i am now unable to ride in a school on my own without someone chasing me around!!! i am haveing lessons, but want to try a few exercises in between my lessons to get him going forward - he hates the schooling whip and will not come off my leg properly. he also has no back muscles due to saddle not fitting for a LONG time. i lunge him most days and he is fine with this - weather not permitting to go inthe field to see what he does with me there. any ideas would be gratefully appreciated!!!! p.s i am not very confidant and he does like to buck a little when wanting his own way!!
 
I can't say I'm known for my fab suggestions, but here goes...
If he's ok being lunged in the arena, perhaps get someone to lunge him while you're on him and see how it goes. That might get him used to being ridden in the arena while doing something he is familiar with and is associated with good behaviour. Having someone else there will also help with your confidence.
Hope that's useful :-)
 
If he has no back muscles then it may be that he just isn't comfortable to go forward and is telling you in the only way that he can.

Pop a suber pad or similar under the saddle, that should help a lot whilst he is building his back muscles up. Do lots of long lining rather than lunging to help him. And do leading or long lining work over some raised poles. You can also massage his back in the wasted areas to help get the blood supply to them and encourage the muscles to come back.

Good luck, once the back and saddle issues are fixed he should be a lot more comfortable. Don't smack him or have him chased around until then though, that is just plain unfair.
 
Whats the school surface like? Is it deep going?
It could be he finds the going hard in there, and that with a lack of fitness means he is struggling. Lunging would take away the riders weight , and he would be more balanced with out a rider. When the goign is deeper many horses tend to stretch down and look at the floor, and this coudl mean that stretching through his back, he may still have discomfort and this is making him buck.
 
If this horse has only ever been into the school 5 times in his life and is now refusing to go in, it sounds to me as is he's associated the school with something bad. The something bad could be any one of a number of things - e.g pain - as ISH-Mad said, he's finding it uncomfortable going forward in there. And yes, it could also be as King Charles says, lack of fitness combined with the going is making it a struggle. Alternatively he could have had a big scare in the school some time in the past - did anything happen to make him spook at any time while in the school? Is there a notoriously spooky area in the school which other horses don't like either (you'd be surprised how many schools do have a spooky end!). Has he ever been taken in the school and whipped (not, of course, implying that you would do that)? Has he perhaps been taken into the school for some reason to be treated by a vet? Any of these could potentially leave the horse with bad memories of going in the school.

If you are in touch with the old owner, you could ask about the bad memories bit (although you'll have to be tactful about the whipping bit - you don't want them to think you're being accusatory). See if they can come up with anything that might just be the trigger.

So that's worth investigating too - although I do really think that pain (or a memory of pain) is the most likely reason for this behaviour.

You say you are not very confident either when he bucks - and the horse might just be needing the confidence from you that you aren't able to provide him with. Can you get your instructor to ride him more confidently into the school?

One final thing - you say he had a badly fitting saddle for ages. Can I assume that that problem has now been seen to and that the saddle you are using now has been correctly fitted to your horse according to his current body shape? And please bear in mind that his back muscles will be constantly changing shape as you build up the work with him - so I would advise further saddle checks at periods of ideally 3 months, but no more than 6 months apart.
 
I tried a pony out once that I was looking to buy - went fantastically outside, jumped amazingly and we then took him in the school. Indoors this happy, forward going pomy suddenly was reluctant to move anywhere and actually felt lame. We thought maybe indoor schjool/surface and issue so took him on to outdoor arena - same problem. Horse was terribly lame behind. he was also visibly grumpy and didn't want to move.

Took him back on the grass (firmish) and he was completely sound.

It was the oddest thing ever - we considered having him vetted and having physio out but turned out physio we spoke to had previously seen this horse for serious stifle injury. It appeared said horse was in some pain when in the school, quite probably due to the surface being deeper than the grass.

I would consider something similar for your horse - maybe he is trying to tell you he is in discomfort. If he schools ok on grass I would certainly suggest pain being an issue when he has to make extra effort in the deeper school surface.

Certainly when you mention he already had a badly fitted saddle. I would suggest getting a good physio in and then try building up his back muscles (lunge work/pessoa etc) before trying to school him (ridden) again in an arena.
 
Well it is very possible that he is uncomfortable as he has had back/saddle problems. It would be useful to have his back looked at by vet/physio and lunge/pessoa to build up his muscles. BUT, as I know from bitter experience, Clydesdales can be VERY stubborn. We had one (a fabulous mare in all other respects) who hated schooling and who would develop 'lameness' with a novice/sympathetic person riding her, the lameness miraculously disappeared when a more experienced/tougher rider got on instead. Whilst it could be that he associates the school with a previous bad experience, it is also possible that he associates the school with hard work and doesn't fancy the idea. If this is the case, you will just have to persevere, or get a more confident rider to work with him for you. It might be that when you see that he will work properly in the school with someone else, this will help you to develop the confidence to ride him through his stubbornness. Good luck! (you'll need it).
 
thank you to all your responses, i will defiantley put a pad under his saddle. his back muscles have improved with the work over the last couple of months. in my post yesterday i forgot to put that my instructor rides charlie as well and does have the same problems as me, but we make the experience a pleasure for him, she is a great teacher and very sympathetic to his delicate needs. like you have all said, its the psychological issues of previous pain that we are dealing with here, i have had physio on his back and massage the area after work. god there is so much to write about him i keep remembering stuff!!! ha ha. pearlsasinger - yep you are quite right, he has a very stubborn streak that doesnt help!!! i have known him since a foal and my friend owns him, but through lack of time and consistancy and a short fuse the end result is as i've written. he has the most amzing movement and great springy hind that makes me very determined to get him right. please keep the advice flowing!!!
 
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