Dispute over private trailer sale

[bkneil]

I hope someone can help. I recently bought a second hand Bateson trailer. I specifically asked about the condition of the floor (as my horse put her foot through the floor of the last trailer I bought) and the tyres. I was told the floor was brand new last summer and it had 4 good tyres - verbally and in written messages.
The second time we used the trailer, our horse put his foot through the rotten floor. When the trailer place took it to sort and service they said that all 4 tyres were cracked , perished and needed replacing. I’ve had all the work done and a service plus other bits. I think as I asked the right questions and the trailer was deliberately mis-described, that the sellers should refund the cost of floor replacement and tyres. They disagree obviously. I’ve looked at the sale of goods act, consumer rights etc and it says that even in a private sale, you are entitled to a refund if the item was not as described- I have proof this was the case in writing and the trailer business are happy to confirm what was wrong. Any advice on where I go from here would be much appreciated.

 

[ycbm]

You've got a very good case. My view would be that you should send them a recorded delivery letter making a demand for payment and giving 7 days to pay and telling them you will sue if they don't.. And if/ when they fail to pay just go online and raise a small claim against them. It's really easy to do online and not expensive.

Good luck. It should be a slam dunk if you have the written evidence.
.

 

[SantaVera]

Are you a bhs member? You can ring their helpline,or contact citizens advice you might be able to go to small claims court.

 

[phizz4]

No help to the OP but a timely reminder of how to check for the age of the tyres on a car or trailer.

Tyre age and tread depth: The importance of tyre age as well as tread depth

If you drive relatively few miles every year, you might find that your tread depth remains fairly intact for several years. But, importantly, that doesn’t mean your tyres are roadworthy.

www.uniroyal-tyres.com

i knew someone with an Ifor Williams single trailer that was told it was a 2015 model but the 2013 aged tyres told a different story.

 

[bkneil]

Are you a bhs member? You can ring their helpline,or contact citizens advice you might be able to go to small claims court.

I’m not a member though have been looking into it recently. I was thinking about small claims but was worried about the cost… but if I’m likely to be successful, the sellers would have to pay my costs too I think

 

[DressageCob]

I’m not a member though have been looking into it recently. I was thinking about small claims but was worried about the cost… but if I’m likely to be successful, the sellers would have to pay my costs too I think

Small claims costs are pretty minimal. It's just the issue fee (which is on a sliding scale depending on value of the case) https://www.gov.uk/make-court-claim-for-money/court-fees
Then there's the hearing fee for the final hearing (that ranges from £27 to £346, again depending on the value)

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1093005/EX50_web_0722.pdf

 

[ycbm]

I’m not a member though have been looking into it recently. I was thinking about small claims but was worried about the cost… but if I’m likely to be successful, the sellers would have to pay my costs too I think

It cost me £50 in total a few years back to sue Britannia Hotels in court for about £300 and they paid costs when they lost. Your sellers are quite likely to pay up as soon as you pay the fee to register the claim and they get the notification that you have.
.

 

[bkneil]

No help to the OP but a timely reminder of how to check for the age of the tyres on a car or trailer.

Tyre age and tread depth: The importance of tyre age as well as tread depth

If you drive relatively few miles every year, you might find that your tread depth remains fairly intact for several years. But, importantly, that doesn’t mean your tyres are roadworthy.

www.uniroyal-tyres.com

i knew someone with an Ifor Williams single trailer that was told it was a 2015 model but the 2013 aged tyres told a different story.

Oh that’s really useful thanks. For cars too

 

[bkneil]

Small claims costs are pretty minimal. It's just the issue fee (which is on a sliding scale depending on value of the case) https://www.gov.uk/make-court-claim-for-money/court-fees
Then there's the hearing fee for the final hearing (that ranges from £27 to £346, again depending on the value)

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1093005/EX50_web_0722.pdf

Thank you. I was aware of the issue fee but not the hearing fee. Worth pursuing in my case definitely

 

[Flyermc]

No help to the OP but a timely reminder of how to check for the age of the tyres on a car or trailer.

Tyre age and tread depth: The importance of tyre age as well as tread depth

If you drive relatively few miles every year, you might find that your tread depth remains fairly intact for several years. But, importantly, that doesn’t mean your tyres are roadworthy.

www.uniroyal-tyres.com

i knew someone with an Ifor Williams single trailer that was told it was a 2015 model but the 2013 aged tyres told a different story.

That isnt always correct. We bought a brand new caravan with tyres on it 18 months older than the van, apparently more specialist tyres are often stored for awhile before they are first used. If its an ifor trailer, you'd prob be best looking at the serial number

 

[fetlock]

Not sure you’d have a case re the tyres if they have no more info than that they were good. When I took my previous car off a 4 year sorn the tyres looked fine and sailed through an immediate MOT but had a cracked/perished advisory the next year but visually (to me) still had looked good.

The floor though, they’ve plainly misled you about.

 

[BSL2]

I hope you can sort. What the hell is wrong with people, being happy to sell a dangerous trailer to an unsuspecting person. I could never live with myself. Disgusting!

 

[Kaylum]

Ask the Citizens Advice Bureau online they are very good.

 

[ycbm]

Thinking further about this, can they produce a receipt for the floor replacement? It's possible they paid for it to be replaced, thought it was but it wasn't, or that it was replaced but rotted in a year.

In either case in a private sale you would have no comeback as they didn't lie.

 

[bkneil]

Not sure you’d have a case re the tyres if they have no more info than that they were good. When I took my previous car off a 4 year sorn the tyres looked fine and sailed through an immediate MOT but had a cracked/perished advisory the next year but visually (to me) still had looked good.

The floor though, they’ve plainly misled you about.

To be honest I’m not as bothered about the tyres as the floor. That’s the bit that could have ended up with an unsound horse, vet bills or much worse. We were lucky my friends horse just moved to the side

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I know your were wrongly sold but surely you would check it properly before putting your own horse in it, last time I bought a horsebox I got someone to get underneath it and we pulled all the mats back on the floor to check before I put anything on it.

Unfortunately you can't trust anyone these days sorry you have had to go through this though must have been very scary

 

[TPO]

Regardless of what a seller tells me, I check transport myself and get a trailer service done before using it.

I bought a 3.5t via a reputable seller and my mechanic found weak spots in the floor. I had it fully checked, then repaired, before using it. Ditto the ifor trailer that I bought.

I've seen the equitrek photos that are doing the rounds. I can't get my head around someone buying a trailer of any age, never mind an older (& cheaper) wooden trailer, and putting a horse on it without having it checked by a professional.

What's happened to personal responsibility? Common sense? Sold as seen? Buyer beware?

For all intents and purposes the seller could have believed what they said. The person who sold me my 3.5t did, and it looked OK during my initial checks, but I'm not a professional. That's why I budget for the cost of a lorry/trailer mechanic when viewing/buying.

The owner has a responsibility to ensure that transport is safe each and every time before loading a horse into it.

 

[silv]

Regardless of what a seller tells me, I check transport myself and get a trailer service done before using it.

I bought a 3.5t via a reputable seller and my mechanic found weak spots in the floor. I had it fully checked, then repaired, before using it. Ditto the ifor trailer that I bought.

I've seen the equitrek photos that are doing the rounds. I can't get my head around someone buying a trailer of any age, never mind an older (& cheaper) wooden trailer, and putting a horse on it without having it checked by a professional.

What's happened to personal responsibility? Common sense? Sold as seen? Buyer beware?

For all intents and purposes the seller could have believed what they said. The person who sold me my 3.5t did, and it looked OK during my initial checks, but I'm not a professional. That's why I budget for the cost of a lorry/trailer mechanic when viewing/buying.

The owner has a responsibility to ensure that transport is safe each and every time before loading a horse into it.

This

 

[bkneil]

Regardless of what a seller tells me, I check transport myself and get a trailer service done before using it.

I bought a 3.5t via a reputable seller and my mechanic found weak spots in the floor. I had it fully checked, then repaired, before using it. Ditto the ifor trailer that I bought.

I've seen the equitrek photos that are doing the rounds. I can't get my head around someone buying a trailer of any age, never mind an older (& cheaper) wooden trailer, and putting a horse on it without having it checked by a professional.

What's happened to personal responsibility? Common sense? Sold as seen? Buyer beware?

For all intents and purposes the seller could have believed what they said. The person who sold me my 3.5t did, and it looked OK during my initial checks, but I'm not a professional. That's why I budget for the cost of a lorry/trailer mechanic when viewing/buying.

The owner has a responsibility to ensure that transport is safe each and every time before loading a horse into it.

Buyer beware?? What happened to common honesty? I asked all the right questions, more than once, I have the info in writing. I’m no mechanic so unfortunately I trust what people tell me. The other bits that were done in the service £700 worth i expected as it’s not a new trailer and wear and tear is expected. I asked both the husband and wife separately about the floor and they both said the same thing Sale of goods act does say if a private seller provides false information then they are liable

 

[TPO]

Buyer beware?? What happened to common honesty? I asked all the right questions, more than once, I have the info in writing. I’m no mechanic so unfortunately I trust what people tell me. The other bits that were done in the service £700 worth i expected as it’s not a new trailer and wear and tear is expected. I asked both the husband and wife separately about the floor and they both said the same thing Sale of goods act does say if a private seller provides false information then they are liable

You didn't get it checked by a professional
before using it . You put your horse into a trailer that you had no idea about, trusting strangers isn't an out for endangering an animal. Not being a mechanic is exactly why anyone should always get transport professionally checked.

It's plausible that a floor could be replaced and have weak spots 12mths later. It depends how it was kept and used. That's why everyone should check their floors before every use and have it professionally checked before purchase or first use.

 

[bkneil]

You didn't get it checked by a professional
before using it . You put your horse into a trailer that you had no idea about, trusting strangers isn't an out for endangering an animal. Not being a mechanic is exactly why anyone should always get transport professionally checked.

It's plausible that a floor could be replaced and have weak spots 12mths later. It depends how it was kept and used. That's why everyone should check their floors before every use and have it professionally checked before purchase or first

 

[bkneil]

Insinuating I don’t care about my horses welfare is not necessary. And your responses are inflammatory and not helpful as they don’t answer my question

 

[Goldenstar]

I am gobsmacked that having put your horse in a rotten floored trailer in the past you simply trusted someone’s word an old trailer was ok , you can see tyres did you look at them ? Did you check their age you need to do these things for yourself .
The floor I except you might well do ok at the small claims court the tyres that’s on you IMO.
But wise up and educate yourself .

 

[bkneil]

Thanks to those who posted with useful information on where I go from here. I will persue this but think I’ll be buying new in future!

 

[AmyMay]

We buy a lot of second hand vehicles. Any inferences that work has been done is discounted unless there is a receipt confirming this. It doesn’t matter how honest someone appears (and most likely is), we never take someone’s word for anything.

We also crawl around any potential purchase checking for structural defects, including checking underneath.

 

[WelshD]

Have they actually lied about the floor?

If it was replaced last year but with standard plywood unsealed around the edges for example it could easily have degraded substantially in that time.

If though you can prove it was not done last summer and they lied then that's different so for example you can trace who did the work or maybe find an old Facebook post referencing the new floor (some people seem to put their whole lives on social media) the problem is that if they tacked it DIY then short of catching them out I cant see how you can prove the age of the floor, they could have even used secondhand boards. The age of the floor really isn't a safe indicator of its condition.

I think you'd have to chalk the tyres up to experience, if they still had tread on them then they probably looked ok to the seller, if you didn't notice the perishing when purchasing so it wasn't obvious to you then it probably wasn't obvious to them either

 

[Gallop_Away]

The floor you may very well have a case if you can prove the seller deliberately mislead you. However it isn't completely impossible for a floor to become rotten in places, even in the short space of a year. So if the seller can prove they replaced the floor a year ago, I don't think you will get very far as ultimately they haven't mislead you. So with the floor I will say maybe.

However the tyres I'm not so sure. You can see the tyres for yourself and as with a car, should have the knowledge to know if there are issues with the tyres. If you got stopped by police with a bald tyre, the excuse of not knowing it was bald wouldn't hold up.

I'm also utterly gobsmacked anyone would risk their horse based on the word of a stranger. Yes people should be honest, sadly they sometimes aren't. Lesson learnt the hard way in this case.

 

[nagblagger]

Some people are more trusting than others, years ago this may have been me when i bought a trailer, I was ignorant of a certain kind of person and was very trusting, but was also lucky it did not have a problem. Hindsight is wonderful which we can all relate to, I certainly would do somethings differently if I could move back time. Luckily there was no internet to criticise me for my lack of insight when asking for advice, the importance is learning from the experience, education and helping others.
I think you should definitely get an expert to document their evaluation and opinion when they repaired it, print off the texts emails stating the floor had been replaced, maybe ask to see their receipts and either speak to the BHS legal or citizens advice as others have advised.
Good luck and i'm glad the horse wasn't injured.

 

[bkneil]

We buy a lot of second hand vehicles. Any inferences that work has been done is discounted unless there is a receipt confirming this. It doesn’t matter how honest someone appears (and most likely is), we never take someone’s word for anything.

We also crawl around any potential purchase checking for structural defects, including checking underneath.

Some people are more trusting than others, years ago this may have been me when i bought a trailer, I was ignorant of a certain kind of person and was very trusting, but was also lucky it did not have a problem. Hindsight is wonderful which we can all relate to, I certainly would do somethings differently if I could move back time. Luckily there was no internet to criticise me for my lack of insight when asking for advice, the importance is learning from the experience, education and helping others.
I think you should definitely get an expert to document their evaluation and opinion when they repaired it, print off the texts emails stating the floor had been replaced, maybe ask to see their receipts and either speak to the BHS legal or citizens advice as others have advised.
Good luck and i'm glad the horse wasn't injured.

Thank you. I think I expect the same of others as I do myself. My old trailer I was totally honest about and someone paid £700 to use it to transport their motor cross bikes. I even put someone off coming from Scotland willing to pay double that- I told him that the work which needed doing to make it horse safe wouldn’t be worth a 500 mile journey. Buyer was happy as was I . I’d feel physically sick if a horse came to harm because of me trying to make more money.

 

[Julia0803]

Just to play devils advocate….

They may not be lying about the floor.

About ten years ago I purchased an old rice trailer. Had a lot of work done on it before using it, including replacing the floor. It was done by a professional, not a diy job.

I came to sell it a bit over a year later.

Obviously I had told the prospective buyer that the floor had been replaced, as well as tyres and breaks.

Imagine my mortification when they lifted the mats and found soft spots at the very front (not where horses stood thank god).

I’m sure they must have thought I was lying, but it genuinely had been replaced. However, it was stored outside at the yard and parked on grass.

Thankfully it was only the very front section, and I just got that bit replaced (and the rest of ot double checked!) and sold it a few weeks later.