Dispute with buyer

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nickyafc

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Some advice on were we stand please! Recently sold our 9 year old warmblood, the buyer had him on trial for a month on her yard before paying a deposit or signing a contract. After the trial month the buyer paid a deposit of £1000 the remainding balance to be paid by February 2014. A couple of week ago the buyer posted a picture of herself with bruising having fallen off, when my daughter spoke with her she said it was a combination of him hardly being turned out that week and him being at his fittest. Two days ago my daughter got a message saying a vet had diagnosed him with wobblers and she wanted to return him and get her deposit back, this was a big shock but when we asked to see the vet reports she said she wasn't bothered about her deposit but wanted us to sign him over to her care. She told my daughter the vet had said he was unfit to ride and couldn't be sold on and that he had wrote that in his passport (which we found out he hadn't), she said she was going to have him PTS. Although she said she had insurance she wanted to keep his saddle and bridle to sell to cover costs. Obviously we told her we wasn't going to sign him over without seeing any vet reports. After saying he was a very poorly horse, today this horrible person walked him 3 miles before dumping him in a field with no rug and no shelter and at the same time let an 11.2 pony into the field with him.
 
She bought him back to yours, do you mean?
I'm afraid I can't help bar saying never offer that sort of sales deal again! How much more did she owe you? Was it a lot? I think if you get the horse back that is all you can hope for, and look at it as lesson learned.
Poor horse.
 
Poor horse, hope he is safe now. It is not clear from your post, having as you say 'dumped' the horse, is the buyer still asking for their deposit back.

There have been a number of very sad threads on here where horses loaned out before sale is completed, have vanished, people have had no horse and no money, so although the whole situation is very upseting for you if you have your horse back, you are now in a position to find out if there is anything the matter with him.

You might be best consulting a specialist solicitor to be certain of you position in this case.
 
Collect your horse and tack, return deposit and never let the horse out of your yard/ sight without vetting and payment in full.
 
The field was at the yard my daughter keeps her pony but when she arrived the yard was empty, the field had been spot sprayed so wasn't being used, she wouldn't have known that, but then to let a little 11.2 pony in with him when he is 17hh and they have never seen each other before is disgusting. She is now telling people how badly she got treated and she got sold a poorly horse, also saying she hopes we do the right thing by him just like she would have done!!
 
If this is for real it sounds an absolute mess. Not sure why you would let your horse go and new owner pay later, I certainly wouldn't.
If the woman has left him in your field then at least you have got him back although, if she's also left a pony that's a worry. She's clearly playing a game and unless your vet says horse is not suitable for riding I would not be being giving her any money back..
You also want tack and passport back.
 
She didn't leave a pony it was a pony off the yard that she let in the field, this person was off a respectable yard she doesn't live far from us. I'm disgusted at the way she went about things as people who know her said she seems like a nice person but just goes to show how people can change. What it came down to was her saying the horse had been diagnosed with wobblers and wanted us to sign him over into her care, we asked to see the vets report to confirm this and that's when she changed from being nice. I spoke to the vet and asked to see the vets report and was told there wasn't one.
 
Due to data protection a vet cannot disclose vet records to a third party... Could this be why they are saying there was no report?
 
This person is claiming the horse is ill & has a vet report to back this claim & still wants the horse signed over to her care? She then won't produce a vet report & the vet tells you there is no report? Does the vet confirm the diagnosis the buyer is telling you?

It seems that the buyer wants the horse for just the £1000 that they've paid so far & when you didn't fall for their story & sign the horse over to them they've returned the horse.

If this turns out to be the case I certainly wouldn't return the deposit & hopefully you will have learned to not let your horse leave your yard until he is paid for entirely. Don't sell one on installmants, it rarely works out.
 
sounds a dreadful situation all round.

id be on the phone to my vets in the morning to get him checked out asap. From there you can work with the facts.
 
Toby_Zaphod said:
This person is claiming the horse is ill & has a vet report to back this claim & still wants the horse signed over to her care? She then won't produce a vet report & the vet tells you there is no report? Does the vet confirm the diagnosis the buyer is telling you?

It seems that the buyer wants the horse for just the £1000 that they've paid so far & when you didn't fall for their story & sign the horse over to them they've returned the horse.

If this turns out to be the case I certainly wouldn't return the deposit & hopefully you will have learned to not let your horse leave your yard until he is paid for entirely. Don't sell one on installmants, it rarely works out.
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This is what my mind jumped to as well. I'd phone the vets first thing tomorrow and explain the situation and that although you understand you are not allowed to see any reports due to data protection, you would appreciate either a confirmation that the vet has diagnosed wobblers, or get a vet out yourself to check the horse over. At least you have him back with you now, poor horse.
 
Get your own vet out to examine your horse as you need to know one way or the other. If the diagnosis is right then it's unfortunate. If the vet finds nothing then you'll know the buyer was trying it on the get a good horse at a cheap price. Either way no refund & don't 'sell' a horse on installments as I said previously.
 
The vet did say he couldn't discuss things with me but then went on to tell me he had done a stage 2 vetting and the horse had shown signs of wobblers, he then said it would be no use getting another vet to check him as they prob wouldn't have the experience or knowledge and wouldn't be able to tell..strange thing for a vet to say. He also said he would have had it for a long time but yet he had a stage 5 vetting about 2 years ago. I read that wobblers can be caused by a fall in the field while playing, or while being ridden damaging the vertebrae in the neck, not sure if that's true or not. Like important thing is tonight he is safe and happy.
 
Sounds like a dodgy vet to me. He's the only one in his profession capable of a diagnosis? I would record details of all the conversations with him and the buyer.
 
nickyafc said:
The vet did say he couldn't discuss things with me but then went on to tell me he had done a stage 2 vetting and the horse had shown signs of wobblers, he then said it would be no use getting another vet to check him as they prob wouldn't have the experience or knowledge and wouldn't be able to tell..strange thing for a vet to say. He also said he would have had it for a long time but yet he had a stage 5 vetting about 2 years ago. I read that wobblers can be caused by a fall in the field while playing, or while being ridden damaging the vertebrae in the neck, not sure if that's true or not. Like important thing is tonight he is safe and happy.
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Very odd. There is no reason why the vet cannot discuss things with you, the owner. He could also quite easily send a report of his visit to your vet.

Is the horse now in a field next to your house, and is he really 17hh ?
Why did the woman walk this sick horse 3 miles to the livery yard without informing you of her intention ? Surely you would have preferred to collect him instead, as I'm sure she would have.
 
nickyafc said:
The vet did say he couldn't discuss things with me but then went on to tell me he had done a stage 2 vetting and the horse had shown signs of wobblers, he then said it would be no use getting another vet to check him as they prob wouldn't have the experience or knowledge and wouldn't be able to tell..strange thing for a vet to say. He also said he would have had it for a long time but yet he had a stage 5 vetting about 2 years ago. I read that wobblers can be caused by a fall in the field while playing, or while being ridden damaging the vertebrae in the neck, not sure if that's true or not. Like important thing is tonight he is safe and happy.
Click to expand...

What an odd thing for the vet to say. Especially as he wouldn't have been able to diagnose wobblers in a stage 2 vetting, it needs a full neurological workup and x rays. As others have suggested, have your own vet check him out asap.
And if the buyer has the passport, keep her sweet until you get it back.
Did you have a contract re who would be responsible for vets fees during the transfer period?
 
Get your tack back as well!

It sounds like the woman was out to fleece you so get your tack back (solicitor's letter if necessary) and never speak to her again, you, and the horse, have had a narrow escape.

Very weird response from the vet. Get your vet to call him directly and see what he says then.
 
Wow, he looks very fit!
It does sound like a mess but I guess it's good you got him back and nothing worse happened to him. About the pony being put in, yes it probably was not the best idea given their sizes but maybe they thought he would settle better with another pony in with him, rather than leaving alone and risking him trying to jump out?
Hope you get your tack back!
 
The video will tell you nothing. Mine would have looked exactly the same ten days before I had him shot, and he was born with a severe neck deformity that did not show up until he was ten.

Get a vet. A different one.

I cannot actually imagine any vet saying what that one said to you, and if it is genuine then you should report him because if this whole story is true, and the horse is not a wobbler, then he is party to an attempted fraud.
 
The vet at a vetting gave his opinion that the horse is a wobbler and is therefore unsuitable for the job the buyer wanted him for
That why I would if possible get him out and get him to show OP why he thinks the horse is a wobbler .
He absolutely cannot disscuss the vetting without the permission with the buyer.when I buy the owner have no idea if the horse has passed or failed until I ring them and take them through the findings .
If she won't give permission you have to ask your self why.
But OP has every right to ask him to examine the horse on her behalf if he won't you ask yourself why.
OP I hope everything goes well with your horse .
Get your tack back and if you get a copy of the vets cert from the vetting saying he was not suitable for purpose you will have no choice but to return the deposit , if you don't you have no reason to return it.
good luck it's all very strange I hope it works out ok for you and the horse.
 
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