Disunited.. a schooling issue..

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MissDeMeena

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I have an ex-racehorse, about to up-grade to BE Int. level..
She keeps going disunited in canter, esp in Novice test 110, when you have to do Med. canter down the long side..

All the usual has been ruled out, so please no.. check back/saddle/teeth etc etc..

I've also spoken to a vet about it.. felt along her back, agreed she wasn't sore etc..
An old trainer used to say, when they go disunited, keep them like it untill they change themselves, as it's not comfy, and they'll learnt not to do it....
However, she is happy to stay disunited on a fairly small circle for a long time, ie 3, 4, circles... with that in mind, the vet says there's defo nothing wrong with her, as if there was, she wouldn't be able to stay disunited for that length of time....

So.. there's nothing wrong with her... but i can't stop her doing it.. any ideas welcome..
 
Have a couple of canter ground poles placed carefully in the menage, and when she is disunited, canter her over these and she will find it very hard to stay disunited.
We have a little MGA pony. When he has been doing games a lot he does this, and then to remind him it is not correct, we use the above trick and have found it works. :)
 
I used to have a problem with any test that had medium canter down a long side, horse would change behind coming into the corner. I find that taking a bit of outside bend round the corner helps.

Mine has gradually strengthened up (big horse at BE Nov at the mo) but it's a trick he learnt when he was 4 and very unbalanced and he just finds it easier to switch behind than to work through it. It's hugely frustrating and has resulted in me shoving my weight all over the place to try to stop him doing it which inevitably just makes him worse.

He's now fine in a dressage test but still does it all over the place jumping :(.
 
Has the back been xrayed? I know you said everything has been checked, but it has taken over 6 months for me to convince trainers, vets, chiros etc that there is something wrong with my ex racer. She occasionally went into a disunited canter - pretty much only symptom. Turns out she has 6 impinging vertebrae, arthritis in her facet joints and an SI injury. Had I not been a stubborn cow, we'd have carried on as everyone was more than happy with her. Maybe a thermal image would put your mind at rest that it isn't physical and is fairly cheap
 
Zoon.. i'm going with the theory, that's its serious ability to jump a decent sized fence, means there's not alot wrong with itb back.. also, XC happy jumping up/down drop fences etc etc.. got to stick with that, as a) she's not insured, and therefore b) there's no way i can afford any vets fees...


Gamebird.. She is still a little weak, although strengthing up all the time.. will try bending to the outside a little. Funny tho, as that's the way she always wants to bend, and i find myself wanting to bend her to the inside, and leg-yeld her out the whole time..

Bubblegum.. will try again with canter poles.. i've tried her with them before, although for a different reason.. we had them on the way up to a fence, to try and keep her straight and even rhythm etc.. she found them far too exciting, and had to fly-leap her way down them.. i don't think we ever got to actually putting a fence up at the end at all.. However, since then, i've done alot of pole work on the lunge, and she's finding poles on the floor alot less exciting.. so maybe i'll give it ago again...

Thanks for the help every one!!! :-)
 
Mine had an unrelated injury that put it out for all of last season but involved it being X-rayed from bow to stern and having whole body scintigraphy as well. I can all but guarantee that there is no physical injury at the base of my horse's disunitedness.
 
Mine's similar, he raced until 11 and when i got him he could only canter true in a straight line, he still slips disunited when either excited or if he panicsbut he is 90% true now . As with yours there is no injury but my instructor believes it to be more a habit. We have come to the conclusion most horses canter true and know when they are disunited, either breaking to trot or correcting themselves. Mine finds being disunited so easy that it is a habit that is quite hard to break, he doesnt understand why he shouldnt go disunited as to him its as easy as being true (he can do lap after lap disunited and its makes no odds to him!)

He does it on both reins too so its not more one sided if anyone thinks that!

I dont know if theres any logic to this but i also imagine that he is maybe looser somewhere in his back (either skeletal or musclular) which enables him to flip so easy (and to stay in it) and maybe some horses have it and others dont (like some people are double jointed)???

We have got to our 90% rate of true canter by building up the true canter and returning to trot when disunited, this at least means he is now in the habit that if he disunites he knows to come back himself rather than carry on.

Not much help im afraid but at least you know there are others!
 
Ted does it out hacking usually, in a straight line, me in a light and forward seat so not affecting him - drives me mad, I end up throwing weight to try and make him change like GB above...does help sometimes, but is the wrong thing to do! I do wonder whether it is to do with a very slight difference in weight in the stirrups, it is the only thing I can come up with.
 
Plenty of lunging in canter will sort it, working her really long and low in a Laura B type contraption ( draw reins that go over the withers, behind elbows, between the front legs and up to the bit)
 
The GreyDonkey did this when we first bought him . . . like you we ruled out all the issues like scary back/pelvis, etc. issues, tack fit, etc. and concluded that it was weakness (he was very weak) and habit. He only ever did it on the left rein and we solved it by a) riding left canter in a slightly exaggerated half pass position and then slowly (over weeks) straightening up; b) always bringing him back to trot and asking for canter again when he disunited; c) lunging over poles to help strengthen his stifle and use his hocks; and d) when he got fitter, quite a lot of counter canter.

He hardly ever does it now . . . and when he does he brings himself back to trot and corrects himself. I'd say it's 95% resolved.

Good luck - you are not alone :).

P
 
Does your horse go disunited when playing around in the field?
If yes, then I would doubt the vet's conclusion; if no, then the rider is very likely to be cause of the trouble, making the horse unbalanced and/or blocking its back. Either way, just about the worst thing you can do is bend it to the outside. It is 'solving' a problem by superimposing another problem.

Make sure your position is as close to perfect as is humanly possible. Then ride transitions and work on straightness and bend to improve strength and balance.

I would also tend to question a trainer who wants you to keep the horse disunited until it changes itself. The horse does not go disunited for its own amusement but to compensate because something has gone seriously awry somewhere along the road. As humans, purported to be more intelligent than the horse, our task must be to find the whys and the wherefores, not to pile one wrong upon another. It may be frustrating but , in the long run, so will symptom-treatment.
 
Seabsicuit... i've been lunging her for a while now, in that style, and over poles, with the intention of building up muscle, making her stronger etc. with it has a lot!! she's a different horse now.

Be Positive... yes she will do counter-canter.. it's something i was doing a bit of before all the lunging, again to try and get her using her hind legs a bit more. She is also happy to bend in whatever direction when doing it.. also sideways movements are not a problem, ie half-pass, shoulder-in etc etc. they all happen pretty easily for her!! It's going i a straight line that's the problem.

Dirty-D.. I think that is the case, she finds it so easy, that it's almost no different to normal canter for her..

Thankyou very much everyone for all your replies!!!!
Will just keep trying to get her stronger!!
 
My boy was disunited in canter , only on circles. He was not lame in any other gait or on the straight.
Turns out he had a torn meniscus in his stifle.
Very long road to recovery and at the moment a poor prognosis to return to full work
Sorry. Hope it is something and nothing with your horse
 
Have you had your own back checked?

I only ask as I had mine done yesterday (first time in my life!) by a chiro / Bowen therapist who was out to do my horse :D. Turns out I was very crooked, and today I noticed a big difference when riding. On a horse that I usually struggle to get clean walk-to-canter on the left rein (we usually end up on the wrong leg / trotting / disunited) I got a perfect transition at the first attempt.

Given that it's happening on a straight line, it could be crookedness from you that's encouraging him to change behind (I hope that doesnt come across as harsh - it's not meant to be!). How is he with another rider on board?
 
ditto getting your back checked, makes a huge difference.
I echo Mondy's words, I would absolutely NOT bend the horse to the outside. In fact I would do the whole movement in shoulder-fore, consistently, until the bad habit has gone. I doubt a judge will pick you up on it, (and even if they do, it'll cost 1 mark not many, which disunited etc would), it will increase inside hind engagement and help to supple the horse.
I've tried the 'keep cantering until the horse changes back' option and ime it doesn't work... the rider, because disunited is uncomfortable and 'wrong', gets flustered, asks repeatedly, gets nothing. Horse's balance and quality of canter (half-canter, whatever it is!) gets worse and worse. Far better to trot, rebalance, maybe pick up canter again, every time at home anyway. But hopefully shoulder-fore, or even canter shoulder-in at home for the first x times, should help hugely.
 
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