DIY Livery...where do i stand? so very angry

I agree with Amy ^^. AFAIC, DIY means you do your own horse. I fail to see why you should be expected to maintain fencing. I mean, you don't get out and harrow the fields, do you?

I fix fences if necessary as my YO is exactly like the OP's, but I don't think it's my responsibility. If it's my horse's safety, I'll fix stuff, but the YO should maintain fences etc as we're paying him money for a stable and safe grazing.

I'm delighted to say that there's now someone in charge of repairs, frankly more than time!
 
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Charming! Given we pay livery, I'd hope the YO, whether horsey or not, would listen to his liveries. I'm happy where I am, it's just a way of life now, but if someone offers livery, they ought to be responsible for the upkeep of the place. DIY does not mean do everything yourself.
 
The owner may offer grazing but really it is down to the horse owner to ensure the suitability of any turn out for the needs of their own horse. When I have felt from time to time that fields were unsuitable (for a variety of reasons) I have put up my own temporary electric fencing run off a battery. In the same way as I walk my paddocks regularly to check for toxic plants..
 
Wow, what a variety eh.

I'm guessing the cocky "your diy so pay for fencing and maintenance on top of your tack rate" are the livery yard owners and the "move quick" are the liveries, I think.

Put it this way. When on DIY you rent facilities for your horse, unless you've agreed that you will rent the land, there's a difference,.do you rent a space for the horse or do you have a field to yourself?

If I should just fix my fencing can I just build a school whilst I'm at it? Or dump a caravan there?

You can't have the penny and the bun. You either rent someone the facilities to keep a horse or you rent them a field in which they are responsible for.
 
no matter what kind of yard either diy or full, YO's i believe should be responsible for fencing, yes slightly different if your given your own paddock and your told it's yours, look after it. mine are out with several other liveries, none of which have made the effort or think they should go round fixing boundary fences despite their horses legging it into a neighbours field only the other day. in no means do i not care for pony's welfare. i do have my own electric fencing and did spend over an hour the other night with my friend fencing off a strip of fencing that was inadequate to keep a wondering pony in and another hour making a 'fence' that i had seen another livery lean on and break but i only have so much tape to patch up fencing in a very large paddock of everyones horses.

and yes i do plan on moving. i simply wanted to know where i stood whilst i search for a yard whose fencing isn't crumbling around the horses it's meant to keep safe.
 
Vectro said:
What do you expect, its a diy yard, fix it yourself that's the point of diy. Clearly your not cut out for this yard so move.
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What utter rubbish! DIY means that you look after your horse yourself. Responsibility for maintaining facilities to an acceptable level falls with thee owner of the property!
 
I got the same, but I love the Yard and the fabulous vast grazing which saves me a fortune in hay and best of all a non interfering Yard owner. If you've ever been on a political Yard, you'll know that in itself is priceless! It's cheap - and so I bought my own leccy fencing and battery, (otherwise my lad would balloon), as has everyone else on the yard - no moaning, job done.
 
Presumably the fencing was poor when you viewed the yard?

I am a YO, I spend an absolute fortune on my fences, and I make a point of stating in any adverts, on my site, and personally, when they come to view, that they are stock wire with electric tape - that's what I have.

I am not changing it.

If you don't like it don't come, some people don't, and that's just fine and dandy by me.

The point I am making is that prospective clients see the fencing (and everything else) before they come, no point whinging about it after they arrive, the same in your case, the fencing was poor but you still went there knowing that.

I do, however, see your point, but YO is old you say?

How about you all offer to help repair the fence, or do it yourselves, if he provides the materials? Offering to help with the labour is fair, being expected to buy materials is not.

On the other hand, (and I don't know how much you pay) if you are only paying a pittance a week perhaps he can't afford to? Fencing is expensive, would you be happy if your rent went up a bit to cover costs.
 
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I still think it goes back to what was agreed when you moved onto the yard. Where we are it IS the liveries who are responsible for organising things like muck heap disposal, harrowing , topping of fields but I was aware of that when I moved there :)

I think if your pony isn't safe and you're not happy the best thing to do is move. I think YO rarely change which is why I left my first yard and why I accept that at my current yard I sort things out myself or again move somewhere different. Having my boys ur 24/7 and being on a small friendly yard outweighs any negatives .
 
this is exactly the same scenario I had at a previous yard. The whole place was held together with rotten wood, nails and bailing twine and was in need of serious repair. One of the many horses my horse was out with was a big Dales horse and he'd spot the field next to the one they were all in that had more grass in it and through the barbed wire he'd go, dragging the posts and wire. Then all the other horses would follow him. Course it was always mine that would end up with wire cuts on his legs and knee deep in barbed wire. Flipping nightmare place. Would never go back to a yard with barbed wire.

YO's just don't seem to want to spend the money or have the ability to see problems arising or safety issues. If they see a problem starting with something they will never try to fix it straight away. Remember the old adage, a stitch in time saves nine. Well that is really true.
 
I don't think its fair to lump all yo's together, there's good & bad like anywhere else. I wouldn't move somewhere with dodgy fencing so its not a problem I've personally had to deal with. Nobody forces anyone else to either, so its really a case of stop complaining or move, not sure why people think the fencing will suddenly replace itself when they move somewhere.
 
DIY does usually mean you're responsible for the day to day care of your horse not the maintanence of the yard but if the YO is not fulfilling their part of the deal then really the only options are to maintain things yourself or move. As i said before you are responsible for your pony.
 
It should tell you in your contract ( I assume you have one)

At my yard I as the YO take responsibility for the state of the fields, the fencing, ditches and stables. I do this because non of my liveries have the tools to do the job to a high enough standard, i.e. they don't have access to a tractor for harrowing. I also want the job doing properly so I don't want inidividuals patching fences with random materials in odd places.

I take the attitude that people are leaving their horses with you and this is you most valuable asset. Regardless of monitary value the horses have infinite value to the owner and so should be treated accordingly. I'd never ever risk one coming to harm through my own neglect. I have a three wave approach to fenching. Firstly a thick and mature but well maintained hedge (mostly stock proof), post and rail fencing, and then the liveries themselves are responsible for putting in their own electric fencing. That way they can get what ever field shape, groups that suits them.

My first instinct would be to invest in some electric fencing but if the owner wasn't looking after your horses environment then your not getting what you are paying for.
 
I would ask yo if he has any posts/ fencing materials or if i get a reciept for materials can i knock it off my next livery bill and would fix it myself, but that's me
 
Wow! Sometimes forums make me sad, seems like a lot of you have jumped down the OP throat to be honest. Maybe losing the hour has made us all grumpy!

I work on a very small DIY yard and the responsibility for all paddock/repairs etc is with the YO. However where the bargy cob has leaned the fence into submission his owner is required to patch up the fencing where she can. Mostly things are sorted with a friendly discussion with the YO and we all make do and mend with temporary fixes (bit of bale twine and electrical tape etc.) until permanent fixes can be made to the post and rail. I do understand though that we're lucky, very lucky by the looks of some of the above posts.

I can completely understand the desire to stick with a yard if there is decent grazing, no politics, a yard owner that doesn't butt in every five minutes etc. but do agree that you have to put the safety of the horses first regardless of any positives. I wouldn't shout at the OP to 'move yards or shut up' as some seem to have said but I would say that you have to be proactive in getting something done. Essentially your options are A) fix the fencing yourself at your own cost or club together with the other liveries. B) Offer to help the owner with the labour but remind him that it is his obligation to at the very least provide materials/pay costs C) Make do with adding a bit of electric fencing or similar while you look for another more suitable place.

I agree, I'd struggle to sleep worrying where my boy was going to end up! Sometimes you have to change your tact with these old boys; try the friendly friendly 'I really need your help' approach or if that fails try highlighting the relevant part of your contract and threaten to leave (don't try this unless you actually have somewhere to go!). Deadlines usually work in the later approach, 'if you can't get this fixed by the end of the month I will have to leave'.

Are any of the other liveries feeling similar?

Hope you get it sorted!
 
This seems to be the sad case of many YO owners... My previous yard was an older woman with 37 acres of lush grazing with a handful of horses there. At the time I thought it prefect location wise and grazing for my gelding. Over time though it became more and more evident that she just wasn't prepared to spend any money on up keep and the post and rail fencing started to deteriorate with nails sticking out and posts falling down. Despite the efforts of a few liveries and our husbands to try and rectify there were others that just couldn't be bothered. Last summer in the June a young girl moved on with a lovely 2 year old ish... Stunning lad and a lovely kind girl... By the sept he was pts... His right hock was penetrated with a rusty old nail on the sat evening by the following Friday despite efforts to save him he was gone... I moved the following weekend, the hurt, pain and anger to see her devastated and the lose of him and the ignorance of the yard owner finally made my decision... Maybe I should of gone sooner who knows my lad never came in with injuries despite me knowing how bad things were.

I personally think on DIY yards as most yards it's an equally responsibility. It's the YO to make sure there is appropriate fencing that ensures the safety of the horse. If the fencing is damaged then by the owners horse then yes they should fix it to the standard it was at.

I would perhaps look at other yards I did it was the best thing I did for the safety of my lad.
 
If you want to stay there, buy some electric fencing, and fence the field/part of it yourself. Your electric fencing means it's yours to take with you when you leave, you could do a smaller bit with one other pony as companion to yours if you worked that out with the other liveries, and with a decent energiser/battery, you won't have escapee pony problems. I've done that in the past to stop ponies eating fencing but also where the fencing is a tad wobbly, and it's worked really well.
 
Sophstar said:
I have both my ponies on DIY livery at a small yard and the YO is an old man who just potters round the place. I have a huge issue with my houdini pony who can find the smallest hole anywhere and escape
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So sorry to be brutally honest OP but as a YO myself I have to say I've got some sympathies with your YO here. You say yourself that your pony is a "Houdini" who will get out of anywhere and TBH this sort of pony will seldom respect ANY sort of fencing. We had one here who would roll UNDERNEATH whatever fence would put up and also would pick up electric fencing poles in its mouth!!! Yes, seriously!!

Whatever a YO does in this instance would probably not suffice unfortunately. Often small ponies will do this just for the sheer hell of it and there's nothing anyone can do to stop them. You could try good solid/properly erected electric fencing as an interim measuare.

I wonder, perhaps your pony is bored and needs more work??? This is often a reason for breaking-out; and/or they see grass on the other side of the fence which is ALWAYS better than what they've got.

If you're not happy with the current set-up, then MOVE; but bear in mind that at a lot of yards if your pony is a confirmed breaker-outer of fields then you may be asked to pay for repairs and/or be asked to move.
 
Moobucket said:
It should tell you in your contract ( I assume you have one)
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I kept my old horse (in the 1970s) on several different DIY yards over the years I had him, and my current horse Mollie is on her second DIY yard. Yet I've never seen or been offered a contract at any of those places.

Do other people have contracts, and it's just me? :confused:
 
It would depend on how much I liked this yard, friends, closeness to home, nice hacking area, to wether I would mend the fence myself or just move to another yard. I rent a piece of land and had to fence most of it myself, owner has let me have a stable and adjoining feed store. I have been able to fence smaller paddocks, the agreement was I can take down the enternal fences but could I leave the boundary fence if I ever leave.
This was a bit dodgy because they could of asked me to leave once the the fencing was complete, but I have been there for 5 years and love it. However I am constantly replacing old posts, and have slowly planted hawthorn hedges where it is possible. OP you do have a few choices mend it yourself, put up leccy fences, bargain with the owner to pay some of the costs, or just move.
 
I'm in a very similar situation to you OP - doddery old man who doesn't have a clue about horses renting his paddocks to me & another lady.

My requests for proper fencing/gates fell on deaf ears so eventually I had them fixed myself and told him i'd be deducting the cost of everything I had to pay for from my monthly rent. I don't have any form of contract but I put to him that as he'd advertised stables & paddocks to rent, that's what I was renting - PADDOCKS! Paddocks are created by fencing - therefore i'm also renting the fencing so this should not be my responsibility to fix it; I shouldn't to pay to rent it, but also pay to maintain it! He didn't really know what to say after that and agreed to take the cost of the materials off that months rent - never helped us to fix the fencing though! :rolleyes:

I hope you manage to get something sorted, I second what everyone's said about getting some electric tape & battery, at least then if you do move you can take it with you and you're not spending money on something you've left behind. Have you not got a dad/brother/OH who's handy with a nail & hammer and you could give fixing the fencing a go yourself?

Good luck! xx
 
Regarding registration of yards. I had my horse at a BHS approved riding school yard and our fencing was poor along with most gates held up with baler twine.
How did it pass?
 
I do sympathise with OP. We have a similar problem at the farm - my friend and I rent the stables and field, however last summer Farmer decided to make a bit of money and let other some utter numpties graze their first pony in with ours - he introduced the poor little mare in with our 2 geldings - you can imagine the hell that broke loose! She got injured at some point by one of our geldings and the owners eventually took her to a proper livery yard. Then he rented the adjacent field to a lady with 3 youngster who promptly smashed the boundary fencing to bits... We were furious BUT kept our mouths shut as we couldn't find anywhere else locally to keep our two.
By the end of the summer all the fencing was damaged and Farmer has had to shell out for new fencing. Luckily it didn't ever become dangerous and our geldings are very well-behaved so wouldn't stray, but I am HOPING this summer that Farmer has learned his lesson... we will see...
Our only other option was to withhold our rent and fix the fences ourselves but in the end we didn't have to!!!
it's not so easy to move horses when you have a nice convenient set-up. There are few yards round here and most have either poor turnout, are very expensive or are run by the sort of people you wouldn't want to socialise with!!!!
 
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