DIY yard rule regarding when to muck out..

Ridiculous! It sounds to me like to YO wants to make more money by paying her to muck out if you can't do it in the morning.

Surely the whole point of DIY is that you can have a routine to suit you and your horse?

On my last yard my friend and I used to take it in turns to do mornings. We would turn out both horses but just muck out our own stable. The other one would come down later, muck out and then bring both in. Under this rule we would have had to muck out each others stables in the morning as well to make that work.

On my current yard the yard T/O and B/I, so I go up once a day or twice a day depending what I have on. If I go down in the morning I tend to muck out, but then I end up mucking out again later on as she will have trashed her stable again by the time I get there, so if it's about the yard being swept it wouldn't help. If I just go down in the afternoon she has to go back into a dirty stable, and do you know what...she doesn't care! She's a horse and is happy to lie down all night in her own poo. Standing in a dirty stable for a couple of hours really is the last of her worries :-)
 
Fides said:
For horses with respiratory problems in a barn setup, yes it does. And as I mentioned earlier - wooden stables left with wet in will rot, especially if it is mares who pee up banks.
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Horses with respiratory problems should be in airy well ventilated stables not stuck in the middle of a barn.

All horses I have known with respiratory problems have had stables on either end of barn so near a door or window or have been not been in a barn specifically because barns can be dusty if poorly ventilated.

Also you would think that a horse with respiratory problems would be getting lots of turn out so would be out during the day anyway!
 
This could be me being a little suspicious about it all,..but it sounds like a money making scheme on the YO's part to me.

I personally would not touch a yard with such a rule,.. a little ridiculous to expect in my humble opinion.
 
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abb123 said:
Horses with respiratory problems should be in airy well ventilated stables not stuck in the middle of a barn.

All horses I have known with respiratory problems have had stables on either end of barn so near a door or window or have been not been in a barn specifically because barns can be dusty if poorly ventilated.

Also you would think that a horse with respiratory problems would be getting lots of turn out so would be out during the day anyway!
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Of course... But even with that having stables stinking of ammonia won't help. Not all places offer 24/7 turnout, and in summer some have night turnout and in in the day.

Not an issue with my horses but I can see where YO are coming from if it is a barn set up.

I wouldn't leave mine unmucked out, simply because I don't want my wooden stables to rot. My last place had wooden stables that had been deep littered and all the bottoms were all rotten and splintered. I had to use banks to cover them up, even though I don't usually bother as I was feared of them getting a leg stuck under
 
Fides said:
Of course... But even with that having stables stinking of ammonia won't help. Not all places offer 24/7 turnout, and in summer some have night turnout and in in the day.

Not an issue with my horses but I can see where YO are coming from if it is a barn set up.

I wouldn't leave mine unmucked out, simply because I don't want my wooden stables to rot. My last place had wooden stables that had been deep littered and all the bottoms were all rotten and splintered. I had to use banks to cover them up, even though I don't usually bother as I was feared of them getting a leg stuck under
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Very few stables that are mucked out everyday will smell that bad that it causes a problem. If it is a problem then a far easier solution is for the offending stable to change to a super absorbent bedding, such as wood pellets. This would also solve the problem for wooden stables too.
 
abb123 said:
Very few stables that are mucked out everyday will smell that bad that it causes a problem. If it is a problem then a far easier solution is for the offending stable to change to a super absorbent bedding, such as wood pellets. This would also solve the problem for wooden stables too.
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But many yards operate a straw only or shavings only policy. In fact thinking about it, the yards I have known with this policy have been straw bedded ones. Not all yards give the option of change though. As with all things DIY - you either suck it up and accept the rules or move on. The only way DIY is truly for the benefit of the DIYer is if you have the horses at home. Anything else and there will be some rules you have to adhere to - which is why mine are at home ;)
 
I have, but I payed no attention to it. The yard was new and the owner didn't really have a clue. The rule was soon dropped when he put me in charge as yard manager.
 
Fides said:
But many yards operate a straw only or shavings only policy. In fact thinking about it, the yards I have known with this policy have been straw bedded ones. Not all yards give the option of change though. As with all things DIY - you either suck it up and accept the rules or move on. The only way DIY is truly for the benefit of the DIYer is if you have the horses at home. Anything else and there will be some rules you have to adhere to - which is why mine are at home ;)
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Of course there are always rules - ones that should be reasonable and practical.

As I said, I would never move to a yard that had this rule and would move if it ever came in. As would most of the other clients I would guess. I can only think of one or two that would be able to accommodate a rule like this. Which is probably why it isn't a common rule as most YOs know that it isn't reasonable or practical and would have empty yards if they did bring it in.
 
I think its a good rule tbh! If you don't have time to do it in the mornings then you need to get up earlier! I get up at 5 most winter mornings to exercise and muck out 2 by 8.15 when I have to leave for work.

I wouldn't want to leave my stables unmucked out all day because I wouldn't want my y/o to think I was lazy and couldn't be bothered to do it. Plus it makes the stables smell, look untidy etc. I like my horse to come in to a fresh bed, full bucket of water and a haynet after being out.

I could afford to have part-livery but I wouldn't be able to afford nice things, holidays etc so I get up and get cracking on DIY.
 
Prepared to get shot down here, but hear me out.

When I had my own livery yard I had mainly full liveries, with a separate barn for four DIYs. It was in their contract that mucking out had to be done by 9am at the LATEST. Once I explained the reasons why they were all happy with this and were fab about getting it done.

My grooms and I had all the full liveries mucked out and finished by 7am. My rule was that no livery ever saw the yard in a mess and boxes un mucked out. I took a great deal of pride in the fact that you could walk onto my yard at any time and know it would be immaculate. If I was showing a prospective livery around, dirty boxes were a huge no no for me. Especially after 9am.

I think on a solely DIY yard it's silly though.
 
AAR said:
I think its a good rule tbh! If you don't have time to do it in the mornings then you need to get up earlier! I get up at 5 most winter mornings to exercise and muck out 2 by 8.15 when I have to leave for work.

I wouldn't want to leave my stables unmucked out all day because I wouldn't want my y/o to think I was lazy and couldn't be bothered to do it. Plus it makes the stables smell, look untidy etc. I like my horse to come in to a fresh bed, full bucket of water and a haynet after being out.

I could afford to have part-livery but I wouldn't be able to afford nice things, holidays etc so I get up and get cracking on DIY.
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Some people have to leave for work long before 8.15!

It's threads like this which make me so glad that ours are at home.
We used to keep 4 horses at livery and always mucked out after work, before bringing the horses in for the night, 4 of us took it in turns to put out on winter mornings, so that no-one had to get up in the middle of the night to get to work, on time and smartly dressed. I worked in a school about 20 miles away from the yard, which was in the opposite direction from home to my work. I had to be there by 8.30 at the absolute latest, in order to get ready fro my day. The journey took a minimum of 45 mins, often longer than that in bad traffic.

I have read of several practices, on this thread, that concern me far more, from a safety pov, than leaving a horse's bed to be mucked out after work. If I were running a yard (Which I certainly wouldn't- the idea gives me nightmares!) I should address actual safety issues rather than worrying about someone else's routine.

Surely the whole idea of having horses on DIY is to be able to have a routine which suits the owner and their horse, without petty rules getting in the way. If one livery is causing a problem in any way, the YO should address that issue with the individual concerned, rather than making a blanket rule which causes problems for perfectly reasonable people .
 
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Usually most people muck out in the morning anyway, which is why the shift workers are always done by 7am or thereabouts . The only stable in our barn that gets left is the one whose owner runs in at 9am to chuck her horse out before going to work and that stable tends to smell because her standards aren't great. It's not unreasonable to get up 15 minutes earlier to muck out and it makes the yard better for everyone lead. If the vet is examining my horse in the stable and we were sandwiched in between two smelly stables, I'd be mortified.
 
Interesting views on both sides. Fwiw, the stables are in an american barn type set up, and not wooden. I would never leave them in a dirty stable, I would turn out, go to work, come back at around 2pm to muck out, then bring in, ride etc. No horses with respiratory problems as far as I'm aware. No full liveries, its purely DIY.
Those saying get up earlier- what about yard opening times or do you not have them?
 
Stupid rule! If your horse is mucked out well every day then it's shouldn't be unbearably smelly from one night anyway. Don't see why it matters really.

If it was in te contract from the stay then fair enough if you agree to it but to start a new rule is a bit strange. Maybe they are trying to make money from the people who don't have time in the mornings.
 
Surely if a yard has restrictive opening hours and you start work so early that you haven't got an extra 15 minutes wouldn't you choose another yard ? When viewing a new yard, Seeing dirty stables gives a bad impression.
 
Never heard of such a rule. I worked at one yard where we skipped out before breakfast and mucked out in the afternoon. I felt the beds tended to get messy as activity around the yard had horses moving around a lot.

One thing you could consider is a deep litter bed for winter, then you could just skip out and all done for the day.
 
dogatemysalad said:
When viewing a new yard, Seeing dirty stables gives a bad impression.
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No it doesn't, it shows a lived in working atmosphere. Other livery's stables and how they chose to manage them is of no interest to me.

Things that have put me off a yard are poor fencing or a lack of maintenance, paddocks that have clearly not been poo picked for a month or more to the point ridiculous rules!

My last yard was an extremely well run yard and on arrival people would always comment on what a lovely yard it was. It was swept throughout daily and we were all trained to sweep up after ourselves after mucking out, picking out hooves etc. It was very well maintained and generally very tidy and well kept. However, mucking out of my American barn type stable was often left until the afternoon and this was not an issue. The door was closed so what does it matter. It was mucked out daily and regularly disinfected and did not smell particularly.

My current yard is much more laid back and "rustic" but again, how other liveries choose to manage their stables is really of no interest to me.
 
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Hmm, I have to say.....having that kind of rule seem to just cement the image that to do horses, you need to have money, and enough money that you do not have to work. or that you keep them at home, or you have no kids or live very close to your stables...

I can see why if you want everything done by X then make that rule, and fine if all your liveries can manage it. But if many cant what a trivial thing to lose a livery over.
When I had my horse before, out of the 8 boxes in the barn...5 would be left till evening to be mucked out. It didnt smell. But then none were box walkers or very mucky!
 
I've heard of a similar rule, on a DIY and Assisted DIY yard - all boxes had to be mucked out and the yard outside swept before 10.00 am/or before you rode - whichever was earlier. I think they did it to stop certain DIYers leaving it until the afternoon or even until (in one case) until they turned up in the evening to feed.

Makes sense to me, if you do it first thing, which I on my own little pad did when my boys used to come in, you can stack the bedding at one side and let the floor dry out a bit. Stick it back down after riding or about an hour before bringing in to give the dust time to settle.
 
This is why I much prefer being on the tiny yard I am on - the YO isn't horsey, and doesn't care when you go and muck out etc. The only thing he asks is that if you go after around 10pm at night in the winter you let him know so he doesn't panic when he sees someone around the yard late at night.
 
I can understand the rule or part or full livery yards, but not for DIY. It is perfectly possible to leave the yard itself clean and tidy while leaving individual stables unmucked . . . and anyone showing a potential livery round has only to say "oh, so-and-so works/has early shifts so mucks out in the afternoon" to explain away messy/dirty stables. It will be blindingly obvious to any potential livery whether or not that stable is regularly mucked out or whether the owner is cripplingly lazy and NEVER mucks out.

Careful vetting and screening of potential liveries should be all that's sufficient to make sure that stables/horses are not neglected . . . well, that and an efficient and no-nonsense yard owner/manager.

There are only four horses/ponies stabled at current yard - YO's two ponies, Kal and fellow livery's mare. Fellow livery works full time so I chuck her mare out for her in the morning and her stable remains un-mucked until the afternoon. It doesn't smell, it isn't offensive and everything else about the yard is otherwise neat, clean and tidy. No harm, no foul.

P
 
No that's a stupid rule which achieves nothing other than the YO being a PITA and enjoying the power. I can't be doing with that sort of rubbish and wouldn't be on a yard with pointless rules whether I mucked my horse out in the morning or not. :)
 
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For the people saying get up earlier I could but I'd rather not stink for work!!! In the winter when my horse is in overnight I pay for his feed/haynet to be put in around 6.30am then I arrive at 7.30 to chuck him out and leave the yard for work 7.45 (yard is on the way) to start work clean and presentable 8.30! Then in the evening I bring him in, tie up outside his stable with a haynet and do his jobs, then ride. Horse isn't in a dirty stable, I don't stink for work/i'm not exhausted and under performing and everyone's happy.
 
Precisely PolarSkye.

It might be what some would prefer but it just isn't possible for a lot of people.

Having thought about and read some more comments I do think I should add a caveat that if the horses are not turned out or are on very restricted turnout then that is different. I wouldn't want horses that are in to be only be mucked out once in the evening and therefore end up standing all day in poo and wee from the night before.
 
abb123 said:
Having thought about and read some more comments I do think I should add a caveat that if the horses are not turned out or are on very restricted turnout then that is different. I wouldn't want horses that are in to be only be mucked out once in the evening and therefore end up standing all day in poo and wee from the night before.
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This is an excellent point - but, as I said above, one that can (and should) be easily addressed by an effective yard owner/manager.

P
 
Like I've said earlier... I still think it's a sneaky way of getting more money out of folks who simply hadn't got a hope in hell of mucking out before a certain time in a morning!

It's all very well some of you saying 'get up earlier'..blah blah,...but what if your job is shiftwork as others have said and you're working on the hours this YO says you need to be mucked out by?? You're then bound by this (in my opinion petty) rule to have to put your hand in your pocket and pay for a service that is impossible for you to do yourself if this rule is applied. I'd vote with my feet/hooves if this rule ever came into force on my yard (which it never will!).

And as for the 'I don't like to see messy un-mucked out stables'... Ha ha... words fail me. I for certainly would NOT be put off by stables that hadn't been mucked out if I was looking round a place...definitely not.

In fact I'd be highly suspicious if a yard didn't look 'lived in' and by that I mean that you expect to see a working livery yard with poo in a stable and a bit of hay on the floor here and there... surely???!!!

As has been said... If this particular YO has an issue with one/two liveries,..then do what any decent YO should do,..and deal with the matter in hand with them...and not come up with such a pathetic and quite honestly ridiculous rule..

Sorry,..just my opinion you understand, but I get so annoyed at yards that go all out and come up with theses kinds of 'rules' .. I left one because I could see exactly what they were doing by restricting turnout in winter (ample turnout at the yard by the way),.. as a devious way of you 'having' to then spend more money on bedding, which you could only buy through them,..coz your horse was in more... I voted with my feet there!
 
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We only have a rule that says all horses must be attended to by 9 am. It's a large 60 horse yard and I think my YO would have fit if people left stinky stables all day. Yard staff would bring in any diy horses that were unwell or stressed and she wouldn't put an ill horse in a dirty stable. Can't say it's ever been an issue though, as everyone comes in time to muck out or they make arrangements for assistance.
 
Wow so many stroppy people ! If you are on a yard then you have to abide by their rules. If the rule is brought in after then ask the YO the reason behind it and then make your decision based on it.

There are a lot of reasons why this rule might be perfectly reasonable and the OP certainly hasn't given enough information to rule them out.
1. if bedding is included in the DIY price then mucking out early reduces how much is removed
2. they might prefer beds to be banked in the day to give the floor time to dry
3. the YO may have had a number of instances where they have been asked to bring horses in last minute and then also ended up having to muck out
4. the YO might be employ someone to do general duties such as muck heap and yard tidying in a morning
5. if someones horse does have copd and they are in a barn then mucking out in an evening may well cause this horse breathing difficulties
6. if the YO works say 7:30 to 17:30 they may want to be sure that all horses are being mucked out

there are probably lots more reasons, but at the end of the day even if it is just that the YO has seen an opportunity to make more money then that is their preogative, they could just put the price up !
 
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