Do we really know what our youngsters will be like until we back them?

cblover

cblover

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Just sitting thinking about my youngster and what he will be like under saddle. We all imagine how it will go and the things we will do together but do any of us really know what they will be like until we actually do it?

I know some that are great chilled out young horses but have notched up a gear when asked some questions during the backing and riding away process, others have quietened right down once backed and given a job to do. What are your experiences and feelings on this?

My Ted is a big lad (well he is for me!) but chilled out most of the time...still likes to play a lot and has a great companion for that, but on the whole respectful of my space. I'm intrigued to know how he'll turn out once mature, what he'll be like to ride and if he'll take it all in his stride.

This waiting game is no good for me! lol
 
No, you definitely don't! I bought a un handled 10 month old filly. The second I got her home I regretted it. I understand she was not handled but she was very handy with her hind legs! She was very highly strung as a yearling, barged, pranced, very spooky and used to gallop off the second she was turned out. Eyes would b on stalks at everything. As a 2 yr old she learnt manners but still spooky. Now rising 3, went to loose jump her.... So lazy she barely trots. And my friend leant over her and walked round school like a 30 year old cob. Def not what I expected!
 
It's amazing how they can change isn't it! My cob mare is everything you could want in a cob but as a youngster she was bargy, rude, exploded from the trailer, had separation anxiety...you name it but she's turned out to be amazing. For all that, she was always such a likeable character!

I'm hoping Ted will be the same. Have to say, him being a gelding is a whole new experience for me. He seems like he's on dial up and not broadband if you know what I mean. Bless him....bit slow! lol
 
Mines two and breaking her n 2014, she is a cOw with her back legs, but soooo laid back its unreal, the livery owner even said they had a tractor in the field yesterday and she was literally nose on in fascinated !!

I did do a lot of bomb proofing at the time I had her at home - bit/roller/bags etc and she doesn't spook! So hoping She's ok
For backing (not that I'm doing it anyhow)!!

So yes big risk! Spesh as mine was only meant to be a companion and nownbpaying 159 a month on a risk.....!!
 
My IDx was a dope on a rope when I got her at 6 months old. I really thought she would be a doddle. Unfortunately it transpires that although she is a lovely plod 99% of the time, her panic reaction is to rear, leap and spin. So no, you can't always know :)
 
All so different, I'm hoping mine will take it in his stride. He's been shown and travelled quite a bit over the last 2 years and I won't be rushing to do anything bit sit on him as a 3 yr old. He's a draft breed and got lots of growing to do yet.
 
I bought my arab as an untouched 3 year old ... only been shown in hand ... she was a complete cow and everyone at my old yard were taking bets on how long I'd last on here on our first ride out. You know what ... she didnt put a foot wrong and never has done (she's now 11) ... groundwork is sooo important, I taught her everything from the ground so ridden was all done through voice commands ... "aaaaaand canter" is still the best :D

We are expecting her first foal next spring :D
 
just to buck the trend i have a 5yr old welshie who we've had since a weanling, he's a loving boy but very 'pingy', was like it as a baby and has stayed that way since breaking.
 
Ive bred several of my own and backed them, 2 have turned out exactly how i thought they would be under saddle. They both were so friendly and you could do anything with, when i went to back them it was easy, they were relaxed, didnt take much at all and they are total plods. One of my geldings who is very spirited on the ground and who I thought would be a g*t to ride is the safest youngster ive ever been on and great under saddle! :rolleyes: Got one more to back next year, a 3yr cob x hanovarian filly who is quite spirited. Always thought she would be a handful and so far iam right after getting her used to a saddle and bridle this year. :o
 
I think Teddy will be more spirited than my other mare, but hopefully in a good way. He's generally a good boy but as he's two, he often decides he knows better than everyone else.....can't wait for this phase to pass! lol
 
To an extent yes, I believe you can know. If you do everything gradually over the years, then they shouldn't even realise that they've been backed and ridden until they're hacking out and being ridden fine, if that makes any sense?

Getting on and riding them, if all groundwork done, shouldn't be a huge step.
 
Yea I think you can do your homework and put the foundations in place prior to backing. I definitely work Ted on the ground and have done since he was little. We've got a little bit of attitude, terrible two's I think, but on the whole he's a good boy.

I've also started clicker training with him and he's certainly 'clicked' on to how it works! lol
 
I'm currently backing my first youngster. I got her a year ago aged 2 and a half. She is now 3 and a half. On the ground, she can be bargy, opinionated, but generally unfazed but obsessed by being in your space. About 6 weeks ago one of the lightweight young riders got on her on the lunge - walked, and trotted no problems and then did the same off the lunge. She did this two or three times. With one thing and another she hasn't done anything since then and this was a month ago. Tonight, I managed to get a saddle that fits her (at last!), so tacked her up, handed her over to the young rider with the words "Oh by the way, she hasn't done anything for about a month" and let her take her to the school. She got on and had a walk and trot round on her - pony is like a pro - I'm sure she was here in a previous life. But I've spent a lot of time long-reining her and leading her out etc. So in my case yes I do think I knew how she would react - I expected her to be easy and she is proving to be easy. I just wish she was a hand bigger!
 
It depends on what you do with them prior to backing..........some people do so much on the ground that the getting on them for the first time is the least of their problems (they are pets, so why should clambering on their backs bring any significant changes?)
The backing is not the issue - but the education afterwards when the pet, is asked to become a disciplined riding horse, can become the problem.
I prefer to leave my youngsters as much as possible in a herd environment (where the leader of the herd, not me, is sorting out their manners) and then send them away to be broken, hardly handled. The end result is often better, than a youngster that has little respect for me, is then broken by me .........often (but not always) a recipe for disaster......
 
Generally you can tell.
When starting lots of horses for racing, both flat and NH, it was a matter of assessing very quickly the animals response to different environment, change of discipline and quite often with TBs their breeding.

If the process is done correctly and kindly, there should be no problems.

I agree with dressedkes in that the horse that has been little handled is easier than the one that has been handled and fussed over with little respect for the handler.
 
My mind changes every few weeks! We have 2 youngsters bred from showjumpers and 2 part-bred clevelands. I expect the clevelands to be easier than the other 2 due to the CB temperament but at the moment they're acting like racehorse youngstock.

I'll come back in 3 years and let you know...
 
Backed my lad last spring before giving him a year off to grow into himself. It was as if he'd read the 'backing book' knew exactly what to do even though he hadn't done any of it before. Hoping he's the same chilled out boy next spring.
 
I have a pretty fair idea with most of mine because I've known them since they were born - and in most cases we've backed full siblings, dams, sire etc. Although the full siblings aren't IDENTICAL, they're very similar. With horses who come to us to be backed, you get a pretty fair idea by their arrival behaviour (response to something new) and the first few days work - although some learn better than others!

It IS important though that you never assume anything - big risk in taking shortcuts because you KNOW this one will be 'easy'!
 
cblover said:
Just sitting thinking about my youngster and what he will be like under saddle. We all imagine how it will go and the things we will do together but do any of us really know what they will be like until we actually do it?

I know some that are great chilled out young horses but have notched up a gear when asked some questions during the backing and riding away process, others have quietened right down once backed and given a job to do. What are your experiences and feelings on this?

My Ted is a big lad (well he is for me!) but chilled out most of the time...still likes to play a lot and has a great companion for that, but on the whole respectful of my space. I'm intrigued to know how he'll turn out once mature, what he'll be like to ride and if he'll take it all in his stride.

This waiting game is no good for me! lol
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Ooo what breed is your youngster? My boy is rising 4 warmblood, standing 16.1 and with a lot of filling out and growing to do! He is normally pretty good on the ground but does have his moments. We passaged the whole way down to the field this morning as he knew his fieldmate was already out! However, when I work him he is normally very calm. He may have a few squeals and bucks in the first couple of minutes but settles down. He is backed ready to finish off in the Spring and he always threatens to do something. He flicks out his front feet and swishes his head a bit but has not ever done anything except a pathetic little "buck" in which his feet came all of 1 inch off the ground. However, I do think the one thing that will stay with him is his stubborn streak. He is very good at saying "are you sure you want me to do that, well how about i try and walk off and see what you do? Oh no, wait, i will do it". Other than that he is pretty nice natured so I hope that will override the bad bits!
 
JG - just thinking here...what behaviours do you like your youngsters to display that gives you an idea they will be sane and sensible to back and in their ridden work? I'm just curious thats all.

Christsam - Teddy is a clydesdale x traditional cob and he was 2 in July. I bought him just after he was born and made a deal with the owner that him and his mam would come to live with me till weaning, then mam went home. I wanted to get to know him as early as possible. We've had a few separation anxiety issues after weaning but putting a stable mirror up has worked wonders and he has a lovely playful shettie for the rough and tumble stuff. He loads and travels like a pro and always has, he's been to a few shows and has had general handling and ground work done. I've introduced him to clippers, his saddle, the farrier and dentist...all the usual stuff.

When he was a baby he had over 20 abscesses in the first 17 month of his life and was on the verge of being pts. We tried everything without success until I spoke to Sarah Braithwaite at Forage Plus who advised us to analyse his forage and put him on a bespoke feed plan of vitamins and minerals to balance his diet. It's now a year since his last abscess and he's a picture of health. I later found out that his mam had been fed silage and cow cake while carrying him....poor lad his immune system was shot at. I was not happy I can tell you, but we've sorted it now hopefully. Here is a pic of him..............
IMG_4443.jpg


He's not as big as your lad but I think he'll be about 16hh when he's finished growing. He definitely not a traditional cob in looks, more like a hunter type. He's all lanky at the minute...another growing spurt no doubt. I've also started clicker training with him and he's really enjoying this.
 
im not really a cob or a coloured person but he is nice looking. can leave feathers on for cob looking or he would like more like a hunter wit feathers off! Sounds like you have had a lot of worry and problems over him :( He is looking good now. Shame about how the mother was fed though during the pregnancy. Hope they are taking a bit better care of her now! What are you hoping to do with him? Is he gelded?

Had to laugh at how he looks "lanky". He looks a lot more in proportion compared to WB babies! I have barely any photos of Prince when he was 2. he looked frigging awful! Even now I take off his rug some days and he looks like he's been neglected for weeks! then a day later he looks fine again!

I do also think it makes it easier when you have had them since young. I looked at Prince (who was three months when I paid for him) and a couple of 2 and 3 unbroken youngsters. At least me and the boy will have had 4 years to have got to know each other and I know his ways and what he may or may not do. Always good to see them grow up and mature too :) Though now he has grown up I find mself craving a foaly again! lol
 
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Christsam, the pic was from June this year. He looked in proportion in the pic but doesn't at the minute. He was gelded while still with him mam, he got over it really easily with her to comfort him. His mam has now been sold to 'hopefully' a better and more educated home!

I not sure what my plans with his are, I'll see what we both enjoy doing once he's backed. I'm not competitive at all but enjoy riding club events such as dressage, showing, pleasure rides etc. I think he'll suit either large native showing classes or hog and clip him as a maxi cob.

Time will tell I suppose.
 
Mine aren't backed yet. But even on ground they never cease to surprise me!

Relatively unhandled 8yo managed to break my hand (complete fluke and not either fault). She was nasty to horses and had a habit of swinging her arse at you if entering the field. I started working with her and within a couple of days had all the basics back and a horse who wouldn't go for people. The second she broke my hand she became overly protective of me and will walk on water for me now! She's nice to any person entering the field and won't go for another horse when a person is in there. OH was going to sell until she did that and said he couldn't get rid for her reaction.
She had a history of rearing and broncing on lunge and lead (several years back - hence being left unhandled since as 'dangerous') but has never done to me. Had horses galloping past within inches while I'm out with her and she's not even looked up.

Littlun was quickest youngster to learn I've had and thought it would be very easy. Unfortunately she got attacked in field and it's taken a year to stop shaking if more than one person was on the yard. She'd be fine leading and handling but bolt if she saw someone else. She's now started walking out (through our own land because of history) and although an absolute ball of energy will wait until I take headcollar off and then step back before shooting off into field even with other people present. She's a people pleaser so think that she will be good as gold as long as possible but may explode if something scares her. For this reason she'll probably end up waiting another year before backing and have this year for relaxing with basics. So two years on from when I expected to be doing so.

So I wouldn't like to start guessing at what will happen when I am aboard! Although the elder I have a feeling may have a buck in her (although a history of rearing in hand). I'll just take what comes rather than being disappointed if I give them stupidly high expectations!
 
JanetGeorge said:
Although the full siblings aren't IDENTICAL, they're very similar.
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I wish someone would tell mine that. I have two full siblings and two more with the same sire.

The two with the same sire couldn't be more similar (personality not physically), one is just a little brighter ;)
The two full siblings couldn't be more opposite. They look like they were out of completely different breeds (crosses) and personalities have followed suit. One is more like the half siblings and one needs an abso :rolleyes: Thankfully asbo is mostly like this out with the herd. Opinions seem to leave the door when handling. The sister needs reassurance where as asbo will blindly do what you tell her :D
 
My youngster is an interesting horse - hes quite quirky (Sport Horse - TBX). He was actually quite easy to back, but I ended up giving him a few weeks off after the initial backing to let him chill out and think about things. After that he was fine and we spent all summer hacking about, its only been the last couple of months we have started lessons and getting into schooling work.

However I knew he would be a nice horse to ride before I backed him (hes got natural up-hill movement and self carriage, powerful and muscularly well developed), but OMG I didnt realise totally how amazing his paces would be, the power in him is quite amazing (I've never felt this from any horse I've ridden before). So I will say its been a nice surprise - you might have an idea what they may be like beforehand, but sometimes they can be quite different.
 
cblover said:
JG - just thinking here...what behaviours do you like your youngsters to display that gives you an idea they will be sane and sensible to back and in their ridden work? I'm just curious thats all.
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I like them to be confident - without being bargy! I don't expect them to MIND if they're being led to the field and the mail van comes down the drive at them. I don't like them to freak out the second time I throw a rug on them (1st time IS allowed.:rolleyes:)

But with the home-breds, we start on day 1. For example, when I lead a foal to the field for the first time, I will place my spare hand on the saddle area once the foal is walking out well. He bucks - virtually all of them do. I HOPE that - the next day - he will ignore that hand (most do). We DID have one colt who bucked furiously at that hand every day for 3 weeks (his nickname was a foregone conclusion!) But he WAS fine to back and is fine to ride - although still a stallion.

Once we start pre-backing work, I like them to ignore the roller going on - but don't mind if they buck the first time the saddle goes on. But I don't like them to KEEP bucking with the saddle obviously!

It's just a general impression you get during routine handling about whether a youngster is likely to LISTEN to you - and be trainable.
 
Thanks everyone for your stories...all so different! lol

My Ted is very calm (most of the time) and you can touch him all over. He's had his saddle on and it was a total non event..I made no big deal of it either and that of course helped. He can be a bit 'slow' for want of a better word and I don't think he'll be as brave as my mare. It's such a long time ago since I had a gelding, I've forgotten what they are like. He'll be a big boy so I don't mind a bit of slowness! lol

He can be a bit argumentative and has that 'but I couldn't possibly do that mam' look about him but on the whole I hope he'll be a sensible and chilled out young man.
 
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