Do You Smack your horse?

Diamonddogs, it's no use being resentful, if your horse is trying to bite you, even occasionally, you need to work out why.
Slapping isn't curing the relationship problem, try something else.
 
Just a little suggestion as there seems to be a few with nipping issues - try carrying a jiffy lemon in your pocket for a few days - a couple of well aimed well timed few squirts into an open mouth Is normally all it takes. Much better than slapping his face and risking making him headshy.
 
My god, Pale Rider, you're a piece of work aren't you. I don't normally get into brawls with strangers on the internet, but for you I'll make an exception.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the relationship I have with my horse, and like you keep banging on about, you haven't seen her, so you're in no position to judge.

She doesn't BITE - there's a world of difference between a bite and a nip, and the rare NIP from a formerly abused horse is something I can live with, knowing that a lightning quick slap done at the right time pulls her up short.

Why not accept that people are individuals too and all have different ways of doing something, mmm, instead of being sarky and condescending to anyone who throws down the challenge and says "Prove it". Cheap, snide remarks and point scoring help nobody.

FWIW, as stated earlier, my horse gets a slap on the extremely rare occasions she steps out of line in a potentially dangerous way, ie trying to nip. She came to me as a nervous, headshy creature with a history of abuse so had little trust in humans, who'd have a heart attack if you looked at her the wrong way, or would get defensive, therefore potentially dangerous. In less than a year I've turned her round into one of the most affectionate, kindest horses on our yard, with manners to die for, who would follow me to the ends of the earth, and this was done with firmness, fairness, kindness and an occasional slap if warranted - all the things you abhor, apparently, but it worked for MY horse, and if I worked with another horse that didn't respond to that way of training I'd find another way that did.

Not that I have to explain anything to you, but for the benefit of anyone watching, her stable is right next to the tea room, and the key to the tack room is kept in her stable, so everyone in the world has to pass by and some have to put their arm in to get the key. If she was a seasoned biter, do you really think she'd be in that stable?
 
In Scotland?. Actually I could tie in with a visit to my cousins in Glasgow...

I'm completely up for this by the way... If you are?
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And when you're in Glasgow, feel free to drop in on me and my unslapped 1400lb horse and his large and equally polite friends ;)
 
I smack a shoulder and say no. I don't beat them up, don't ill treat them, my girls are generally well mannered and have no hang ups, but like us they occasionally need telling when something is inappropriate.

I had to smack my little mares shoulder the other day as she decided to bite her companion but I was between them and didnt fancy my girls having a spoilt brat disagreement just with me in the middle.
 
Fburton - I tried the stick finger in gob with my filly this morning, she likes to nibble on my coat or anything nibblesome. Anyhoo I got as far as putting my finger in her gummy bit and she gave me her 'worming' face and stopped nibbling! Didn't annoy her she just looked slightly bemused, interesting as would have never thought to try this..
 
daisydoo said:
Fburton - I tried the stick finger in gob with my filly this morning, she likes to nibble on my coat or anything nibblesome. Anyhoo I got as far as putting my finger in her gummy bit and she gave me her 'worming' face and stopped nibbling! Didn't annoy her she just looked slightly bemused, interesting as would have never thought to try this..
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Hehe, I can picture it. :D A yucky-yucky-spit out face is the normal reaction to palate-poking, so I'm not surprised you saw something like that. It just shows horses find it mildly unpleasant, and if it happens as soon as a nibble is attempted they will quickly go off it.
 
Ambers mum said:
I had to smack my little mares shoulder the other day as she decided to bite her companion but I was between them and didnt fancy my girls having a spoilt brat disagreement just with me in the middle.
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I think this is a good example of where smacking can avert trouble. What might the experienced "non-smackers" do instead in the same situation? I can think of a few alternatives myself, but it would be good to gets other people's ideas about this.
 
I would if either of my 2 were being bolshy when being led or in stable but that would be the only time. (although i'm sure neither of them really realised it was a smack!) If they were ever naughty I would just ignore them and would go OTT on praise if they were good (it worked well for us but accept EVERY horse is different!)
 
I like to sternly 'back up' to correct on the most part but dangerous behaviour such as biting I tend to 'block' with my elbow, ie if my mare tries to invade my space my elbow sticking out evades but I don't really have to 'do' much else, point taken but usually body language is all that's needed. It's tricky... Depends on horse and how they have been handled, relationship between horse and handler, you could argue in hindsight you should have done x y z in order to reinforce a leadership role on a regular basis but I do understand how a timely 'pop' can nip some dangerous behaviour in the bud.. Extreme reaction to extreme behaviour perhaps... I dont know it's hard to word things on here without fear of getting picked apart but you get my gist I hope!
 
My old mare was a nightmare to handle- kicked, dragged and all the in-between, so she got her fair share of smacks- for her safety, my own and others around, she needed to respect me.

My new mare on the other hand is a cheeky so and so, but then she's a typical spanish ;) ...all she needs is a sharp "no" and she goes and hides in the corner as if all offended ...she has had a few smacks though as sometimes she over-steps the mark, although this is becoming less frequent now she's sussed who's in charge ;)

Horses are powerful animals and can use that against us and if bad behaviour isn't effectively dealt with, it can cause terrible accidents and can become a serious problem for both the horse, and owner.

When I say smacks, I mean a sharp tap on the shoulder- I absolutely hate people who hit their horses in the face or literally take the smacking too far that it becomes bullying or beating.
 
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Horses will bite and kick each other, I have no problem with a 'smack' on the chest or I use body language by stamping my foot at the same time as broadening my shoulders and stepping towards them, at which point they usually back off. I also use my voice to dictate how I feel.

I would never continuously 'smack' or bully a horse though. I also rarely hit a horse on the face as this can lead to head shy issues. I would lightly give a short tap on the nose if they tried to bite and hadn't responded to my previous efforts.
 
I would hope that if I were handling 2 of my horses at once their attention would be on me, not the other horse. I would hope that if one of them started giving attention to the other horse I would notice it and bring their attention back to me before anything else happened......if I did miss all that and one went to bite the other I would have made myself 'big' and sent energy out.....do you know what I mean or is all this 'double dutch'?? As a last resort I would 'chicken wing' and send both horses back away from me and each other.....but then I have had my horses almost all their lives and they have learned my language!!
 
Fburton, I really like your post re biting/nipping. My 4 y/o sec d is a bit of a nibbler and I usually just raise my elbow or push him away but I will try this out.
The other day he got hold of an elasticated cord on my coat, pulled back and twinged it hard across my face... bl**dy hurt but a really loud OUCH ! was enough to send him to the back of the stable.
What I realise with him though is that when I bought him a year ago he was a very well mannered, loving and pretty laid back boy and a real testament to the stud that bred him. He still is and any problems I encounter behaviour wise I will only have myself to blame because it is up to me to continue to educate him and build on that trust. In my opinion a smack would take us back ten paces and make me feel pretty cr*p.
The two old ladies I have I could never smack. The two sec A's probably deserve a 'damn good thrashing' (joke) ;) cheeky monkeys!
If I see someone smacking a horse/dog/child it makes me wince and I can never really see what the benefit is.
 
fburton said:
I think this is a good example of where smacking can avert trouble. What might the experienced "non-smackers" do instead in the same situation? I can think of a few alternatives myself, but it would be good to gets other people's ideas about this.
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I would also be interested to hear this.

Pale Rider...?
 
Never smack my boy... Don't need to because he has ace manners. But my previous loan horse would sometimes bite v hard or turn his bum and kick out.. I would smack him and shout 'no' and always tried to get him quickly. Was never hard and obviously never with anything but my hand.
 
Alyth and Pale rider are classic Parelli page readers. Of course you use energy , ckicken wings, rope flicking , and these are enough with your own or well trained horses. As an O H to a N H trainer ,our horses are 'bilingual' and compete at high levels [ ie in double bridles shock horror!!], and over the years retrained some difficult animals.
Often these horses were difficult because no one had given them a short smack when neccessary, leading to deliberate biting /barging/charging. As owners had read the N H 'manuals' they wouldnt give them the smack they needed. And , yes, we did. However, unles the owners changed their habits , the horses resorted to earlier behaviours- so once again it was people training! Whoah -- yes, we taught people to smack their horses!!
I would rather have a smacked horse than a client with bitten arms, have been truly shocked with what some owners allow their horses to get away with.
With either biters or kickers that have have been abused and are acting out of defence and fear , reprimands are cruel and counter productive, But any horseperson would know rthe difference , and I think most of the posters on here do and have acted appropriately. But to live in a fairyland world where you say you d NEVER smack a horse is well, just strange - have you seen how they reprimand eachother when one steps out of line?!
 
Mine is well behaved all round. But if the occasion called for it if a NO didnt suffice then a short sharp shoulder slap might be used.

I see so many people slap happy who sour their horses and its a vicious circle they cant break and I see so many people being walked over by horses who need manners instilling.

I have to say in 30 years growling at horses is a new one on me! DO people mean they actually growl like a dog at their horses???
 
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Lol, quite a few growlers about. I'm of the opinion that people can growl, slap do whatever they want. Those that do all this stuff seem happy with what they do and the results they get, that's fine by me.
I won't be doing the same.
 
PR are you ever going to realise that for people who are buying older horses which have been trained or mistrained by someone else, that your "advice" (which is actually normally statements about what not to do rather that advice about how to achieve what you do)
is not helpful and in some cases could be positively dangerous?
 
I had a difficult filly once but I never smacked her just more groundwork did the trick, she definitely had a respect issue.

Ive never heard of growling at horses, im sure mine would look at me like i had two heads if i did that.
 
cptrayes said:
PR are you ever going to realise that for people who are buying older horses which have been trained or mistrained by someone else, that your "advice" (which is actually normally statements about what not to do rather that advice about how to achieve what you do)
is not helpful and in some cases could be positively dangerous?
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cptrayes, you have answered your own question. There is nothing to be realised, nothing to be achieved and no advice, be it good, bad or indifferent.

See the comments for what they are - meaningless, verbal rubbish. Hopefully most forum users will have seen through, and laughed at, the comments.
 
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