Do you trot on the road?

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I did notice however that FB, if given the choice between trotting on the road or the verge when out on long distance work, prefers to trot on the road!!!
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I can only assume he likes the noise

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Mine is also like that!
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I assumed it was because they could see the floor better so more willing to go forward- the longer grass can hide dips. Only because given a field of grass and a concrete road- it is the field of grass she would rather shift down!
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xx

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It's definitely not because they like the noise
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When a horse has shoes it loses what's called proprioception. Much like human beings use our hands to feel things - nerve endings sending messages to our brains telling us where are hands are, what they're touching, whether it's hot or sharp or nice and fluffy and soft - a horse's hoof would do the same thing... telling the horse what the ground is like, unlevel, stony, dangerous etc and therefore allowing the brain to make adjustments to speed, angle of limbs to ensure he stays balanced and safe. With the addition of metal shoes the horse loses this ability (like when we put gloves or shoes on) and therefore a big part of his body awareness. As such he will tend to choose smooth surfaces over rougher surfaces (road v grass verge) in order to stay safe.

As for trotting on roads I did it when my horses were shod but always worried about concussion and slipping. In fact it's one of the main reasons I took their shoes off. Now shoeless I don't worry about slipping at all and concussion is much less of a risk. I even canter on the roads now if it's a quiet country lane. Makes a big difference to my speeds when I'm competing at endurance events.
 
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When a horse has shoes it loses what's called proprioception. Much like human beings use our hands to feel things - nerve endings sending messages to our brains telling us where are hands are, what they're touching, whether it's hot or sharp or nice and fluffy and soft - a horse's hoof would do the same thing... telling the horse what the ground is like, unlevel, stony, dangerous etc and therefore allowing the brain to make adjustments to speed, angle of limbs to ensure he stays balanced and safe. With the addition of metal shoes the horse loses this ability (like when we put gloves or shoes on) and therefore a big part of his body awareness. As such he will tend to choose smooth surfaces over rougher surfaces (road v grass verge) in order to stay safe.

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Interesting points x

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Now shoeless I don't worry about slipping at all and concussion is much less of a risk. I even canter on the roads now if it's a quiet country lane.

[/ QUOTE ] I used to do this when I was very young, but i couldnt even dream of doing it now. Wouldnt you still get some trauma, as it is still hard ground wether they have shoes on or not? x
 
Yep I do in moderation. My chunky monkey seems to prefer it to walking, when I ask for trot his neck comes up and his ears go forward and trots along almost as if he is enjoying the view
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Now shoeless I don't worry about slipping at all and concussion is much less of a risk. I even canter on the roads now if it's a quiet country lane.

[/ QUOTE ] I used to do this when I was very young, but i couldnt even dream of doing it now. Wouldnt you still get some trauma, as it is still hard ground wether they have shoes on or not? x

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There have been studies to show that canter actually causes less concussion than trotting so in theory is better for the horse. But the risk of slipping is greater when cantering so not really a safe option when shod.

Hard ground will always cause some degree of concussion but the shoeless hoof has evolved to dissapate concussive forces. On impact with the ground the frog acts as a hinge and allows the hoof wall to spread outwards, as the sole of the hoof moves downwards. The whole hoof is a dynamic structure that flexes and absorbs concussion lessening the amount transfered upwards to the limbs. A shoe constricts the hoof and stops it from expanding outwards to any useful degree. Most shod horses also don't have frog/ground contact so the frog cannot operate as nature intended and therefore all the concussive forces travel up the hoof wall and onto the limbs. There's also evidence to show that because in the shod hoof the sole cannot drop downwards on ground contact but the weight of the limb is still forced downwards that this means the pedal bone is crushed down onto the sole and that what we think is stone bruising of the sole is actually bruising from above from the pedal bone.
 
I was joking about the noise
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I know it's because he is very wary of uneven grass because he comes from an area that is basically desert and he is totally unused to it - in the same way that he has his moments in the forest if I ask him to walk through mud because he isn't used to the feeling of very soft ground. He too will canter happily on the verge. I must admit I'd love to take his shoes off - he wears Natural Balance at the moment, with tungsten pins in the rears to stop him slipping.

How long did it take your horse to get used to being barefoot and what breed is he?
 
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I was joking about the noise
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I know it's because he is very wary of uneven grass because he comes from an area that is basically desert and he is totally unused to it - in the same way that he has his moments in the forest if I ask him to walk through mud because he isn't used to the feeling of very soft ground. He too will canter happily on the verge. I must admit I'd love to take his shoes off - he wears Natural Balance at the moment, with tungsten pins in the rears to stop him slipping.

How long did it take your horse to get used to being barefoot and what breed is he?

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The noise from shoes is better for warning pedestrians that you're coming up behind them!
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Probably their only advantage.

I've taken three horses barefoot this year - all three are arabs. The first was fine straightaway on tarmac/concrete and other smooth surfaces (and grass of course) but a bit ouchy on gravel/stones for about three weeks. I carried on competing him throughout this period but using hoof boots. The second who is 21 and likes to make a big deal of everything was footy on concrete for a couple of weeks and has taken much longer to transition - but he's been shod for more years and his feet are structurally not as good (longer toes/less developed heels). The third one I bought at auction three weeks ago. I took his shoes off as soon as I got him home and to my surprise hasn't taken an ouchy step yet - he was comfortable straight away over gravel and stones and is hacking out on the roads very happily. It really depends on the horse, what his feet are like to start with and what his attitude is like. Diet also plays a huge part. If you can remove as much sugar from the diet as possible (pick feeds designed for laminitics as they should be low in sugar and starches) about four weeks before you remove the shoes then this helps a lot. Some horses are metabolically better able to process sugars and therefore find transitioning to barefoot easy whereas others are very sensitive and will always have issues if there is any sugar in their diet at all. For example some horses have to be taken off grazing and fed hay or low protein haylage instead. If your grazing is very lush then it will have a high sugar content and will make barefoot working more difficult.

There are lots of factors that govern how quickly it will happen and there can be lots of ups and downs all depending on diet at the time but it's more than worth making the effort. I'm so glad I did it. My horses are happier and healthier for it.
 
Cool. I have no grazing anyway. I'm a bald paddock feed em hay girl from my time in the desert. I also feed sugar beet, soaked oats (very few at the moment) and corn or soya oil. Funnily enough I'm a closet distance rider, the guy I spent most time with in the south did endurance and I just sort of adopted his management system. I have an Anglo Arab, who I don't think has been shod for long but he has very round flat feet - more TB like than the Arabs I'm used to with their little teacup feet! FB has pretty sound feet and has no shoes on at the moment - maybe I should try him without for a while.
 
Doctors are split on road running for humans, some think it is good for the joints, some think it is bad for the joints - but there is a big difference between tarmac (road surface, some paths) and concrete - concrete paths cause 20 times the stress on the joints compared to tarmac, as the structure of tarmac means it has some 'give' in it (the stones have space between them), whereas concrete is much denser, so has less give.

With horses, I worked on fittening up a fair number of horses, and was cautioned that trotting on the roads was better than on soft surfaces (including forest tracks, any grass with 'sponginess' - which in the UK was most of the time with all the rain we had) because the soft ground is more likely to cause issues for tendons and ligaments in the unfitter horses. If we had good grass, not to dry, not to wet, we would trot on that, but usually we struck to road work. With fit horses, I had no issues trotting on roads - they only ever made up 10-20% of our hacks, and the less time on the roads the better (narrow lanes).
 
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Cool. I have no grazing anyway. I'm a bald paddock feed em hay girl from my time in the desert. I also feed sugar beet, soaked oats (very few at the moment) and corn or soya oil. Funnily enough I'm a closet distance rider, the guy I spent most time with in the south did endurance and I just sort of adopted his management system. I have an Anglo Arab, who I don't think has been shod for long but he has very round flat feet - more TB like than the Arabs I'm used to with their little teacup feet! FB has pretty sound feet and has no shoes on at the moment - maybe I should try him without for a while.

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Go for it. You sound like you've got the ideal environment. Unmolassed sugar beet is better than the molassed kind, obviously. Oats have the lowest sugar/starch content of the cereals but feeding whole oats is better as they have a higher fibre content. Adding oil is excellent for feet. I also had 50mg of magnesium a day (simple mag ox that can be bought cheaply off ebay rather than one of the expensive branded products).

His feet should become less flat in time - his sole will become more concave and in general his feet will start to look more like the arabs you're used to. If you look at the angle the hoof is growing directly from the coronet band - the first cm of hoof wall underneath the hair line - then that's the natural growth angle. Usually you'll see that angle is quite steep but the hoof then flares out at a shallower angle down to the ground. After 12 months without shoes the whole hoof should grow down at the steeper angle. TBs are just arabs after all! They reckon that TB's only have bad feet because they are shod so early in life (at 18 months for the flat racers) and are also stabled at the same time, compared to normal riding horses that aren't shod until they're backed at 4yo and tend to live out 24/7 as youngsters. It's not genetics that gives TBs bad feet it's their environment.

Let me know how you get on
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I do trot on roads, if I'm hacking to a show and in a hurry, or sometimes just because we feel like trotting. My trimmer has advised me that a moderate amount of roadwork is actually good for his feet. I wouldn't do it for hours and hours because of concussion concerns, but I don't see the harm in a few minutes here and there.
 
There are a fair amount of TBs with rubbish feet who never raced, and lived out for their first 4 years, so I am not convinced that genetics don't play a part in it as well.
 
yes and always have but do prefer to get off road , my mare hammers it so try to avoid too much trotting on the road , but if we didnt we would make a generation of weak horses , i believe a certain amount is necessary for strength x
 
Yes, but not as much nowdays. I also trot down hill on roads to improve balance but we always have road nails in.

I also canter downhill on grass whenever I can even on Shiney (22). Shiney knows his own mind and if he is comfortable cantering down a hill you cant stop him - as Blue_eyed_girl found out at Eland Hunter trial.. lol..
 
I trot on the road in moderation.

I also trot and canter up and down slight slopes (off road only.) If you only ever canter in a flat school, or uphill out hacking, how on earth are you going to cope if you have to jump on unlevel ground at a show/hunter trial etc? Practising going down hill at faster gaits, again in moderation, is beneficial IMHO.
 
My horse and I used to love trotting along the roads, but since being diagnosed with bone spavin we are only allowed to walk :-(

We can trot and canter off road, but it isn't the same - we both miss the clip-clop, I think.
 
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