Dogs xray..would anyone be happy to comment/spot anything pls?

SaharaS

SaharaS

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I will try add this here but highly likely it will misbehave.

I am looking at a rescue dog (another GSD approx 1 year,female,spayed) and asked for more pics. Among them, this was included with no explanation other than it came with the dog's details but they would get back to me if they could elaborate. Would anyone be kind enough to give their opinion & point anything out that i need to know. Dog as far as I am aware has had no external injury and to meet, is as any other normal dog. Once again, I'm not keen to miss something that could be a potential vet bill ticking time bomb of any sort after the last year I've had with horses/sheep & heartache. Haven't discounted the one with the lost voice bark, but this one has appeared & if nothing worrying the choice will be down to the new dog if it wants to come home with us!

If you can spot anything I should be aware of I would be very grateful. Thank you so much in advance..X

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I'm not sure, but don't think the left hip looks quite right? You need to get a vet to look at xrays really.
Left hip looks weaker to me but I'm not a expert.
 
not the best angle either as not straight on, but left hip doesn't look as closely cupped as right..thank you both..will ring my vet & see if they are happy to look..be interesting to hear what the rescue are told when they ask too..thank you both :-)
 
Being cynical , I would wonder if the dog has shown signs of lameness and that's why x rays were taken, as those x rays don't appear to have info on that would suggest they were going for scoring . Which rescue is it ?
 
Shallow sockets, irregular head and very poor hips. That they exist on a "dumped" GSD does suggest there were concerns about her movement or potential.I would beconcerned about the size difference from side to side and are there any numbers on the plate?
 
As a layman to my untrained eye there does seem to be a size difference between the 2 sides, I do know of a young 7months GSD bitch waiting to come into rescue when they have space, if you are interested pm me and I will give you her details, she is in Somerset.
 
MurphysMinder said:
Being cynical , I would wonder if the dog has shown signs of lameness and that's why x rays were taken, as those x rays don't appear to have info on that would suggest they were going for scoring . ……..
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The cynic in me would also wonder at the need for x/rays, and would raise an eyebrow.

Dobiegirl said:
As a layman to my untrained eye there does seem to be a size difference between the 2 sides, I do know of a young 7months GSD bitch waiting to come into rescue when they have space, if you are interested pm me and I will give you her details, she is in Somerset.
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I suspect that when x/rayed, the animal wasn't laying 'square', though for all that, and as you rightly say, there does seem to be a considerable variation from one side to the other, doesn't there? The real test would be to film the dog, being 'trotted up' by someone who can maintain a straight line, and then post the vid on here. The dog's carriage, angulation and stride, should then be obvious, and in truth to the practised eye may reveal more than an x/ray!

Interpreting x/rays is a job for the skilled, which I'm not, but that said, the ball of the joint seems to be a worrying distance from the socket, and barely 'seated'. Should you proceed and take the dog on, and insure it, then should you subsequently make a claim for any hip ops, and if the Insurance company through the dog's chip and therefore pedigree, source the fact that the dog's been previously x/rayed, then you'll be in to SERIOUS costs with your vets. In your shoes, I'd proceed with caution.

Alec.
 
I thinks thdog is square on its just the picture that isn't :) look at the angle you get through the vertebrae and the stifles.
 
rara007 said:
I thinks thdog is square on its just the picture that isn't :) look at the angle you get through the vertebrae and the stifles.
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I think you are right, as MM said its concerning they had an Xray done in the first place, with any sort of lameness I would have expected anti inflammitories to be the first port of call and also time to recover before they went down the Xray route. I just hope Aru sees this post and as she is a vet I would be very interested in her opinion
 
Dobiegirl said:
I think you are right, as MM said its concerning they had an Xray done in the first place, with any sort of lameness I would have expected anti inflammitories to be the first port of call and also time to recover before they went down the Xray route. I just hope Aru sees this post and as she is a vet I would be very interested in her opinion
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It's quite routine to check (lame) GSDs for both hip and elbow dysplasia fairly early on in a lameness :)
I would think carefully OP :( The chances of this dogs hips not causing him serious, painful, expensive grief sooner rather than later are slim.
 
Studying the pic even further, it occurs to me that whilst the spinal column seems to bend very slightly to the left, the right side of the pelvis (though obviously the dog's left) seems to be misaligned and it seems to occupy a different place. Looking at the darker area, above the sockets themselves, the right side also appears to be set further forward. One might expect that were the spinal column perfectly straight, that the problem would be exaggerated.

OP, again, I'd have someone with daily experience of the viewing of x/rays, give you an opinion. Whatever's wrong, is wrong, I suspect. I'd be interested to hear of the outcome, will you keep us informed?

Alec.
 
rara007 said:
It's quite routine to check (lame) GSDs for both hip and elbow dysplasia fairly early on in a lameness :)
I would think carefully OP :( The chances of this dogs hips not causing him serious, painful, expensive grief sooner rather than later are slim.
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Whilst you are right that this often happens, it is something that can infuriate GSD owners if vets want to x ray and start talking hd at the first sign of a lame GSD. Am I right in thinking you are a vet student? Once qualified you will endear yourself to us GSD folk if you consider other causes of lameness before x raying. :)
 
Well, either the femur and fib tib on the right hand side are of much bigger bone, or the left hand side are of poor bone. Or the x-ray is of no use to man nor beast due to the poor angle!
 
MurphysMinder said:
Whilst you are right that this often happens, it is something that can infuriate GSD owners if vets want to x ray and start talking hd at the first sign of a lame GSD. Am I right in thinking you are a vet student? Once qualified you will endear yourself to us GSD folk if you consider other causes of lameness before x raying. :)
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Oh yes- im not saying this is correct (We had a rescue GSD when I was growing up) but I've seen it in real life that forelimb lame GSDs come in and before anyone's had a chance to breath the full hips and sometimes elbows have been done! (Admittedly often forewarning of problems, but potentially totally unrelated to the current lameness. Was just trying to warn that the hip xrays could well have been taken not due to a hip lameness.
 
Only other thought OP is so you know how old she was when these were done. Iirc and I spect murphysminder knows too CC has always said on previous pup threads not worth xraying until X months?

Mm don't worry I'm already barefoot training rara so GSD lameness will be but a hop skip and jump away!
 
Possibly the legs weren't blocked, I doubt this was a plate for the BVA, plus there's no KC number written anywhere I can see. It might simply be that the dog is young and that's why the legs look a little 'loose' but I don't like the head on that bone.

The only reason for an x ray is because a dog is lame. The left hip looks like it's going to cause pain, the ball is very uneven and that's going to rub. The socket is at least fitting inside so might be a recent thing and the dog might move fine. A femoral head ostectomy might help enormously, as might careful management and building up the muscle.

I think you need an opinion from someone who really knows what they're looking at, tho, because we might all have had x rays done and be able to give opinions, but you want someone who does this for a living.
 
My dogs have never had their legs blocked for x rays (as has been discussed on here before :) ) so that doesn't necessarily mean a bad plate. The bitch is apparently over 1 year so the x ray should give a true picture if it was done recently, although some breeders do screening x rays at under a year (not because a dog is lame) so it could be this.
As you so rightly say ct, none of us can really give an opinion , it needs an expert. Hopefully SaharaS has had more information from the rescue as to why there was a need to x ray this bitch as it certainly would seem it wasn't for scoring purposes. I have had dogs with bad hips with never a days lameness, but would not knowingly take on this bitch without knowing more facts.
 
Hmm, well if very young it could account for some looseness but still wouldn't be happy with those hips. It all comes down to why the x ray was taken really, hopefully the rescue can provide some answers.
 
OH my..thank you all so much, I'm very VERY grateful for al your time & input in this..have made the decision to back off..I would offer her foster but only foster & only if she were in danger of pts which I know she isn't. I've another 5 options and going to pm Dobiegirl...feel like I've actually learnt something today!

Oh and I also found out that she's not even the 'over a year' but only just 10 months :'(

Thank you all very much X
 
SaharaS said:
I will try add this here but highly likely it will misbehave.

I am looking at a rescue dog (another GSD approx 1 year,female,spayed) and asked for more pics. Among them, this was included with no explanation other than it came with the dog's details but they would get back to me if they could elaborate. Would anyone be kind enough to give their opinion & point anything out that i need to know. Dog as far as I am aware has had no external injury and to meet, is as any other normal dog. Once again, I'm not keen to miss something that could be a potential vet bill ticking time bomb of any sort after the last year I've had with horses/sheep & heartache. Haven't discounted the one with the lost voice bark, but this one has appeared & if nothing worrying the choice will be down to the new dog if it wants to come home with us!

If you can spot anything I should be aware of I would be very grateful. Thank you so much in advance..X

11020445_10205259333259494_494872218_n.jpg
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The X-rays seem to be relatively well positioned Ie the acetabulum is similar in both but the picture of said X-rays seems to be taken at an angle so it's difficult to judge are the legs themselves correctly positioned.
they are not bva standard X-rays but they are enough to cause some concern,if she has a history of lameness I would be looking to get full details before taking her on.i don't like the amount of seating within the socket of the joints she has especially on her right (our left to look at)femoral head. I can't zoom on phone to get proper look at the socket to check for bony changes I'm afraid.
However Although the hips don't look ideal in this image it's hard to say at that age if it is a Hugh issue at her age...(puppies that are not fully developed can have a degree of laxity that would be considered an issue in an adult but be fine in a young under muscled pup)it will depend on the clinical picture...if she lame and bunny hopping so the xrays were taken as a problem has been flagged then they are worth further investigation and a degree of wariness.
If they were they done as she was being neutered as she was already under ga and the rescue wanted to check her hips due to breed dispositions issues?they they would need repeating at maturity if she was a breeding animal or earlier if there were lameness concerns. You need to speak to the rescue I'm afraid.an image is no use without the history as X-rays rarely tell the whole story esp in pups.

I would be very wary of taking on a dog with these images as she will uninsurable on the hips if these come with a history of lameness...and I suspect these are most likely to have been taken as there are issues.if you love her then finding out age they were taken and having more imagine done at maturity etc will help but on a straight rule in rule out as your looking for a healthy companion dog with no obvious issues then I would continue looking.

Sorry about rushed answer and terrible grammar.im on phone as laptops broken and it's driving me mad. Can you let us know what the rescue say?
 
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Aru, thank you so much for this, the link & previous post (feeling your pain with unhappy laptop too!)

I think it may have been a cheapy favour xray as lady who runs rescue said another vet had said pts..I won't let on to them I am concerned either way & will push for as much timing info as I can - as Ester commented from my pm with her on fb, they had told me she is over one, and had been rehomed, it now turns out she is only just 10 months, now I'm uncertain how many times she has been homed from leaving the breeder-it seems she had not been walked at all in the last placement & was returned due to the daughter moving back in with a cat, dog went to investigate, cat objected, but when lady went to assess how she was settling & discovered she hadn't been walked, she clipped the lead on & left with her.

I was given the impression she plays crazily flat out now in foster & doesn't show any signs, tho reading between the lines,it seems she may have over played/run while growing and then had periods of inexercise-possibly 'owners' (1st or 2nd) had been told to proceed with caution & she does look very grown up for 10 months..either way I feel that with my boy coming 6 in aug and being a crazy loony pup when he plays, this may not be an easily controllable situation for her to have completely controlled exercise/rest as needed so may not be ideal & thats even before I take insurance plus my lack of overly disposable vet fee fund if uninsurable means I wouldn't be able to do the very best for her as & when she needs it. Breaks my heart to walk away as she is such a sweetheart ..but there are still others, 6 yesterday, now 7 on my list.

I will still see what they come back with regarding xray timings as I think we all want to have a proper conclusion now! I've found the links & info all very interesting as the mare I lost in oct had started having bony changes in her hock(tho she was 28 not 10 months!) tho all this has probably rather expectedly made me a touch paranoid (more than usual if thats possible!)about my boy who has developed a bunny hop & limp intermittently (three times)since we went for his first gsd group walk on salisbury plain at the end of Jan,was incredibly cold minus day tho and he had been hit by a car on that side before I rescued him...then on the run for a month injured so again, if it is his hips rather than just twinged muscle /lactic acid after exercise then showing after rest periods...he is 5 1/2 years not 10 months...we obviously have the horses to do daily & as they aren't at home, so we are out & about an awful lot & I'm just not sure hopping in & out of my truck would be great for her either. I've been so lucky with him to date (touch wood it continues) but to take this little girl on with such enormous if's & buts looming, I just don't think my nerves could cope!

Will update as soon as rescue tell me anything more solid tho..& thank you all so much again x
 
My jury is still out on bat tug. Maybe my expectation was incorrect but I excpected the rug to be super warm but I haven't found that. It keeps heat in with a rug under it but by itself in the house its pants.
 
Dobermonkey said:
My jury is still out on bat tug. Maybe my expectation was incorrect but I excpected the rug to be super warm but I haven't found that. It keeps heat in with a rug under it but by itself in the house its pants.
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I've slotted it into my dogs bed, just under the cover. His bed is big and comfy he wouldn't sleep on it alone.
 
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