Don't know what to do :(

ester said:
To me it is classical in hand work in a slightly less mysterious taking you through the levels so you get the basics right sort of way. The levels make it seem a bit parellish to me but I can see why it has been done like that.
I can't stand MJ's voice though and I am much better learning in person. Someone runs clinics about 20 mins away from us and I learned a lot from watching but also took a huge step forwards taking Frank a couple of times.
He has 2 avoidances 1) I am walking through you, 2) I will eat the lead/the instructors microphone lead/anything else I can find in order to distract - the microphone worked well as she paniced a bit and he got to eat the grass at the edge of the arena while she put it under her shirt :D.
I am not fluffy at all, but it has also highlighted to me how much my state of mind influences him and it is easier to see on the ground. I struggle with anxiety a lot and sometimes it shows through him, bloomin pony ruining my coping face :p.
He was never a problem horse ;) but is getting on, and anything to keep him flexible without lugging me about has to be a bonus. In some ways it was surprising because he is pretty well schooled, flexible, balanced etc but actually being on the ground and analysing it and having a shoulder coming towards you at all times on a circle has been really interesting.
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It was Jay's physio who recommended it, to help him rehab to the best of his ability. He has a few compensations going on, to my upset some of them are from my own back/hip injuries. I think it will be good for me to concentrate on keeping things pure. In some ways I am cautious about reaching the last part of his behaviour, as we have things going pretty well. He does just keep part of himself locked away, and with the minute detail I think that will be examined....

Sorry to hijack OP, I will now bow out!
 
No no it's fine :)

What are these clinics called???

There is a kelly marks one not far away but it wouldn't be the same would it??

I feel she has too much to give to give up on her!!!

She's never had an accident as such but has been bullied into doing stuff as in jumping bigger than she feels comfortable with so I think she has lost confidence tha why I took her back to poles on the road and she came lovely! And I was calmly trotting courses but I don't know if she's come more confident but now she wants to canter round them!!

Even though she is a strong horse less is more she goes better in softer mouth pieces

She is a one person horse.

I wish I could look into her eyes and see all her past and what she is thinking!
 
jo_pearl said:
Fatpiggy she is part welsh!!!

Shes not in any pain or discomfort and she loves to jump her ears are always forward but cause we travel at such speed and she jumps so big she has to bounce doubles to get us out! if i check her she leaps forward and changes legs.

Pole work is a nightmare the moment she sees a pole she gets wound up and excitable to the point i cant do nothing with her :(

to handle on the ground she is 100% and to do flat with she is in walk and trot and her 1st canter is fantastic but once we break the canter that is it :(
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How did I guess!!! You are absolutely describing my girl. She was rising 12 when I bought her and a great many people thought I was absolutely crazy. In hand she had perfect manners but quite literally just put your foot in the stirrup and she would rush off. You are going to find level of patience and persistence that you never knew existed. I never found out the history of my girl, not even her name, but I suspect that she had been a teenagers first horse out of ponies and we all know how teenagers like to rag them around. Combine that with a tendency to being a speed freak anyway and you have a recipe for disaster. I always thought she had probably had more owners than I'd had hot dinners because of her behaviour. If she had been sold in the ring so that people couldn't try her first, they would have just seen a pretty mare which led around perfectly. I did 6 weeks of ground work with her (I did know what she was like before I bought her) and spent the time finding out what words she knew, and getting her used to me. Most of the time she would lunge well but occasionally would let rip although it was mostly leaping and bucking which was odd because for all her faults she never once bucked under saddle. I did alot of free lunging in an indoor arena too. Then after the 6 weeks I put a saddle on her. The first thing she had to learn was to stay put to be mounted. I didn't have a block so would climb up the manege gate and get on from there. Because she had got used to listening to me, she soon learned to stand quietly while I got on and adjusted everything - cue lots of vocal praise. From there it was weeks of work in just walk and halt, then gradually introducing some small amounts of trot and then canter. Bad behaviour was rewarded with small circles until she calmed down. You always have to be one step ahead of horses like this. Never do the same thing for more than a few minutes, so lots of rein changes, lots of pace within a pace, lots of transitions all to keep them guessing and keep talking, talking talking. Be prepared to quit while you are ahead, and to change your plans if she isn't in the right mood to do what you want. You can NEVER argue with a mare, it just winds them up more and more. Mine could go at high speed for ever, leaving younger horses in her wake. She would never admit to being tired until you put her in her stable. She HAD to be lead file, so actually it was so much trouble riding out in company we didn't bother and just went hacking on our own. She was the most exasperating, funny, intelligent animal God ever created and once I'd got used to her I was actually grateful that I hadn't bought a more civilized horse as truthfully , I would have been bored! I didn't bother with instructors any more as they couldn't see beyond her hot-headedness and wanted quick results which they were never going to get. These horses are very much one-person animals. I always said that she and I were two sides of the same coin. I only had to think things and she would do, she knew that I knew what she wanted just by the expression she had on her face. They are worth the effort, but my God, you are going to have to put so much work in so be prepared for that.

Oh and at home, when you finally start pole work, trot in between as well as over them, and always use a line in front of a job to keep her feet under control and her eyes down. My girl used to jump way higher than necessary, but with poles to make her think she jumped with far better style and technique. She was always fast in the ring but one year we won the WH points championship at the RC, so it can be done!
 
fatpiggy said:
How did I guess!!! You are absolutely describing my girl. She was rising 12 when I bought her and a great many people thought I was absolutely crazy. In hand she had perfect manners but quite literally just put your foot in the stirrup and she would rush off. You are going to find level of patience and persistence that you never knew existed. I never found out the history of my girl, not even her name, but I suspect that she had been a teenagers first horse out of ponies and we all know how teenagers like to rag them around. Combine that with a tendency to being a speed freak anyway and you have a recipe for disaster. I always thought she had probably had more owners than I'd had hot dinners because of her behaviour. If she had been sold in the ring so that people couldn't try her first, they would have just seen a pretty mare which led around perfectly. I did 6 weeks of ground work with her (I did know what she was like before I bought her) and spent the time finding out what words she knew, and getting her used to me. Most of the time she would lunge well but occasionally would let rip although it was mostly leaping and bucking which was odd because for all her faults she never once bucked under saddle. I did alot of free lunging in an indoor arena too. Then after the 6 weeks I put a saddle on her. The first thing she had to learn was to stay put to be mounted. I didn't have a block so would climb up the manege gate and get on from there. Because she had got used to listening to me, she soon learned to stand quietly while I got on and adjusted everything - cue lots of vocal praise. From there it was weeks of work in just walk and halt, then gradually introducing some small amounts of trot and then canter. Bad behaviour was rewarded with small circles until she calmed down. You always have to be one step ahead of horses like this. Never do the same thing for more than a few minutes, so lots of rein changes, lots of pace within a pace, lots of transitions all to keep them guessing and keep talking, talking talking. Be prepared to quit while you are ahead, and to change your plans if she isn't in the right mood to do what you want. You can NEVER argue with a mare, it just winds them up more and more. Mine could go at high speed for ever, leaving younger horses in her wake. She would never admit to being tired until you put her in her stable. She HAD to be lead file, so actually it was so much trouble riding out in company we didn't bother and just went hacking on our own. She was the most exasperating, funny, intelligent animal God ever created and once I'd got used to her I was actually grateful that I hadn't bought a more civilized horse as truthfully , I would have been bored! I didn't bother with instructors any more as they couldn't see beyond her hot-headedness and wanted quick results which they were never going to get. These horses are very much one-person animals. I always said that she and I were two sides of the same coin. I only had to think things and she would do, she knew that I knew what she wanted just by the expression she had on her face. They are worth the effort, but my God, you are going to have to put so much work in so be prepared for that.

Oh and at home, when you finally start pole work, trot in between as well as over them, and always use a line in front of a job to keep her feet under control and her eyes down. My girl used to jump way higher than necessary, but with poles to make her think she jumped with far better style and technique. She was always fast in the ring but one year we won the WH points championship at the RC, so it can be done!
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Thank you for your reply! To mount my mare stands for me all day and over a fence is as honest as the days come! i have been wrong and she has helped me out!!!

If i could tune some of the excitement out of her she would be fantastic as she is so bold! she isnt too bad hacking in company likes to be upfront just gets stressed at gates! just wants to rush through them does not want to wait and stand but ive started taking mints and when she stands at a gate she gets a mint (she loves her food lol) and it is working! and last weekend she lead a young girl and her pony back like a saint!!!! walked quietly and calmly as if she knew she had to be good!!!

What i find is when she works lovely and has a length of rein when she comes back to a slower pace her head rises and comes back and i find that stage difficult to keep her head down and keep her working as she becomes bouncy!
 
They do straightness training clinics at Pencoed , Jo-pearl. I haven't been but was there for another event and saw the signs directing people to the small school.
 
Haven't read all the replies (dont you just hate it when someone says that ;) ) but agree straightness training will help.

A simple exercise for a strung out horse. Ride her in a tight figure 8 on a loose rein (and I mean small circles, as small as you can). When she relaxes make the figure 8 slightly larger but if she gets het up, go back to smaller again. Gradually build up size of the figure 8 -always end with her being relaxed and calm even if it means you've only walked in a small figure 8 for 10 minutes (or longer if thats what it takes). Do not start trotting sessions in the arena until she starts calm and ends the session calm in walk (the exercise can be done in trot as well once established in walk, obviously on larger figure 8s). Sounds dull but I've seen this work on absurdly fizzy horses.It is gymnastic in itself if done correctly and you can also use it to work on your own position.

Another exercise and I don't know how it works but it really does (and is done on the ground and can be done in just a headcollar). Stand by her shoulder and look away from her. Every time she looks at you or turns her head to look somewhere else, gently bring her head back to the front again-without making eye contact or speaking to her. Do it for as long as it takes for her to relax/doze/rest a hind leg.

My last horse was brilliant out hacking except at one point, he started getting impatient at junctions and gates-really impatient and quite expressive! he also preferred to be up front :D I did this exercise with him several times and he completely stopped. I've also used this exercise on two youngsters in their ground work-they both stand and wait for me no bother when tackling forestry gates (can't be done from saddle) as well as around the lorry, mounting blocks etc etc
 
MotherOfChickens said:
Haven't read all the replies (dont you just hate it when someone says that ;) ) but agree straightness training will help.

A simple exercise for a strung out horse. Ride her in a tight figure 8 on a loose rein (and I mean small circles, as small as you can). When she relaxes make the figure 8 slightly larger but if she gets het up, go back to smaller again. Gradually build up size of the figure 8 -always end with her being relaxed and calm even if it means you've only walked in a small figure 8 for 10 minutes (or longer if thats what it takes). Do not start trotting sessions in the arena until she starts calm and ends the session calm in walk (the exercise can be done in trot as well once established in walk, obviously on larger figure 8s). Sounds dull but I've seen this work on absurdly fizzy horses.It is gymnastic in itself if done correctly and you can also use it to work on your own position.

Another exercise and I don't know how it works but it really does (and is done on the ground and can be done in just a headcollar). Stand by her shoulder and look away from her. Every time she looks at you or turns her head to look somewhere else, gently bring her head back to the front again-without making eye contact or speaking to her. Do it for as long as it takes for her to relax/doze/rest a hind leg.

My last horse was brilliant out hacking except at one point, he started getting impatient at junctions and gates-really impatient and quite expressive! he also preferred to be up front :D I did this exercise with him several times and he completely stopped. I've also used this exercise on two youngsters in their ground work-they both stand and wait for me no bother when tackling forestry gates (can't be done from saddle) as well as around the lorry, mounting blocks etc etc
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So you did the figure of 8 exercise out hacking was it>?
 
no-figure 8 work was in the school and that wasn't for my horse although if my horse was to get uptight and there was space I would use it definitely. The ground exercise can be done on the yard, it doesnt need need to be done in the context of a ridden session but can be repeated in different scenarios.

obviously this is with all the caveats of teeth, bit, rider and saddle etc
 
In your other thread about bits, you said you were going to your first show last Sunday with her. Is that right? Because if she's only been to one show, she may well have found it stressful.

As for everything else, I think you need some professional help - perhaps someone local to you on here can advise on a great instructor who can help you get her back to basics?
 
jo_pearl said:
Thank you for your reply! To mount my mare stands for me all day and over a fence is as honest as the days come! i have been wrong and she has helped me out!!!

If i could tune some of the excitement out of her she would be fantastic as she is so bold! she isnt too bad hacking in company likes to be upfront just gets stressed at gates! just wants to rush through them does not want to wait and stand but ive started taking mints and when she stands at a gate she gets a mint (she loves her food lol) and it is working! and last weekend she lead a young girl and her pony back like a saint!!!! walked quietly and calmly as if she knew she had to be good!!!

What i find is when she works lovely and has a length of rein when she comes back to a slower pace her head rises and comes back and i find that stage difficult to keep her head down and keep her working as she becomes bouncy!
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A judge once said to me "if only she could contain herself she could be really good". Yes, I used to get the bouncing giraffe too. I had to ride in full chaps for the first year as she leapt and bounced and jogged so much the stirrup leathers gave my legs blisters and the extra grip was much appreciated.
 
we have done a ridden show before but was a tiny show with 5 of us in the ring and cause was a small show i could ride her in her gag and she was great did one class and was fine but the ring was ALOT smaller.

This time we did a large ring and did in hand and she was fantastic in hand but kind of lost her head ridden.

She did settle for the very last individual show but after 4 classes lol!!

yeah that the thing with my mare if she could contain herself she would be amazing!!!!!
 
jo_pearl said:
we have done a ridden show before but was a tiny show with 5 of us in the ring and cause was a small show i could ride her in her gag and she was great did one class and was fine but the ring was ALOT smaller.

This time we did a large ring and did in hand and she was fantastic in hand but kind of lost her head ridden.

She did settle for the very last individual show but after 4 classes lol!!

yeah that the thing with my mare if she could contain herself she would be amazing!!!!!
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You've answered your own question. After 4 classes she settled... So the answer is go out as often as possible. I'd hire arenas rather than go to competitions so that there's less pressure on you and take your instructor with you if possible. It sounds from what you say that every time she rushes you stop riding so rush = softening rein and doing what she wants. Start with lunging in an alien arena so that no fear is involved then walk a small circle with a contact but 1/2 halt a lot if she rushes. This is a feel thing so I think if you are going to be successful you need someone you respect on my the floor helping you. If necessary let them get on... But baby steps rushing out to a competition is not the best until you are confident in any environment and have a plan of action for those difficult moments.
 
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