dopeesophee
Well-Known Member
should i get some??
for my stubborn mare that has a v. high head carriage??
i have honestly tried everything
for my stubborn mare that has a v. high head carriage??
i have honestly tried everything
draw reins
- Thread starter dopeesophee
- Start date
Weezy
Well-Known Member
What does your instructor suggest?
BlackWhite381
Well-Known Member
I know some people will say in the right hands they are ok, but i personally hate them! Have you got an instructor or someone who you could ask there oppinion who has seen you ride?
skewbaldpony
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
should i get some??
for my stubborn mare that has a v. high head carriage??
i have honestly tried everything
[/ QUOTE ]
No.
should i get some??
for my stubborn mare that has a v. high head carriage??
i have honestly tried everything
[/ QUOTE ]
No.
carthorse
Well-Known Member
Have you had a good instructor try , have you tried a pessoa training aid on the lunge or side reins, have you used lateral work, have you taught her from the ground to soften to contact and then release?
If you have tried all the above, you could try for a very short while but only to show her what you mean , please don't use them for long.
If you have tried all the above, you could try for a very short while but only to show her what you mean , please don't use them for long.
lannerch
Well-Known Member
another NO
draw reins are more likely to make the problem worse longterm.
draw reins are more likely to make the problem worse longterm.
dopeesophee
Well-Known Member
yes i have a dressage trainer, but havent been able to have her 4 a while. and a sj trainer, but the sjer h8s all gadgets but the dressage doesnt seem to mind, as i have ridden with a lungee bungee etc
i can get her head down, but would prefer it to be quicker and less of a fight, sometimes if she is in that mood she wont do anything i ask her
i am thinkin about a show ring snaffle bit with my running martingale and sheepskin noseband 4 sjin?
and i have a full cheek french link snaffle 4 dressage
she is also very strong!
i can get her head down, but would prefer it to be quicker and less of a fight, sometimes if she is in that mood she wont do anything i ask her
i am thinkin about a show ring snaffle bit with my running martingale and sheepskin noseband 4 sjin?
and i have a full cheek french link snaffle 4 dressage
she is also very strong!
Tiffany
Well-Known Member
Does she do the same thing when you lunge her?
toomanyhorses26
Well-Known Member
I was advised to put them on my tb and three weeks later he was down at the vets for back issues don't know if there was a coincidence or they were the cause but I will be cautious in using them in future.Think there are better training aids such as the lungie bungie and the equi ami which encourage the horse rather than pulldown and force them into an outline. The one that has relly helped my horse though is the pessoa- he is quite arguementative which comes through in how he carries himself so with this he was arguing with himself as such and soon got bored!!! It doesn't suit eveyone -my friends horse hated it but he was v stuffy and then turn himself over in it think it was prob the sheepskin part round the bum that did it!!!
skewbaldpony
Well-Known Member
Is that her in your sig?
Have you got a pic to show us the problem?
Have you got a pic to show us the problem?
YorksG
Over the hill and far awa
Another no vote, I am sure you have checked all the usual stuff (back, teeth, tack etc) and tried a change of bit, I think draw reins are never the answer
Diggerdog
Well-Known Member
I think that there's an echo in here.......No, no, no..
dopeesophee
Well-Known Member
Have you had a good instructor try , have you tried a pessoa training aid on the lunge or side reins, have you used lateral work, have you taught her from the ground to soften to contact and then release?
^^
tried all of those except the pessoa, (2 expensive) she is worse lunging as she fights and stops spins round and rears, not just small rears either!!
ok and as to the ""in the right hands"
i dont have hard hands, i hardly hold my reins atall tbh
the instructor has ridden her and even she had a fight to start with!
^^
tried all of those except the pessoa, (2 expensive) she is worse lunging as she fights and stops spins round and rears, not just small rears either!!
ok and as to the ""in the right hands"
i dont have hard hands, i hardly hold my reins atall tbh
the instructor has ridden her and even she had a fight to start with!
carthorse
Well-Known Member
How refreshing to see these posts.
Skhosu
Well-Known Member
No. Not in a million years.
skewbaldpony
Well-Known Member
still 'is that her in your sig'?
BlackWhite381
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
yes i have a dressage trainer, but havent been able to have her 4 a while. and a sj trainer, but the sjer h8s all gadgets but the dressage doesnt seem to mind, as i have ridden with a lungee bungee etc
i can get her head down, but would prefer it to be quicker and less of a fight, sometimes if she is in that mood she wont do anything i ask her
i am thinkin about a show ring snaffle bit with my running martingale and sheepskin noseband 4 sjin?
and i have a full cheek french link snaffle 4 dressage
she is also very strong!
[/ QUOTE ]
It isn't just about getting there head down though you want them to work from behind in a nice soft outline! Easier said than done i know but it can never be achieved 'quickly'. IMHO all draw reins will do is make her drop behind the bridle making it easy for her to evade you because she isn't between hand and leg which won't help with the fact she is strong. have you tried lunging her in side reins to get her to accept the contact?
yes i have a dressage trainer, but havent been able to have her 4 a while. and a sj trainer, but the sjer h8s all gadgets but the dressage doesnt seem to mind, as i have ridden with a lungee bungee etc
i can get her head down, but would prefer it to be quicker and less of a fight, sometimes if she is in that mood she wont do anything i ask her
i am thinkin about a show ring snaffle bit with my running martingale and sheepskin noseband 4 sjin?
and i have a full cheek french link snaffle 4 dressage
she is also very strong!
[/ QUOTE ]
It isn't just about getting there head down though you want them to work from behind in a nice soft outline! Easier said than done i know but it can never be achieved 'quickly'. IMHO all draw reins will do is make her drop behind the bridle making it easy for her to evade you because she isn't between hand and leg which won't help with the fact she is strong. have you tried lunging her in side reins to get her to accept the contact?
dopeesophee
Well-Known Member
ok
yes it is her... ill try find a pic
checked teeth and back etc every year she is 17 and set in her ways, but not stiff, just tense... she is on a calmer and i masage her neck b4 and after riding...
i guess its just me and my m8 being typical sjers lol
i have ridden her in a pelham, waterford snaffle, port pelham and cheltnham gag... all making it worse!
yes it is her... ill try find a pic
checked teeth and back etc every year she is 17 and set in her ways, but not stiff, just tense... she is on a calmer and i masage her neck b4 and after riding...
i guess its just me and my m8 being typical sjers lol
i have ridden her in a pelham, waterford snaffle, port pelham and cheltnham gag... all making it worse!
arwenplusone
Well-Known Member
Very hard to answer the question without knowing you and your horse.
Contrary to others and yes I may get jumped on & I'm not bothered - I think that draw reins *can* work. But then I've also ridden in side reins and a gag on the bottom hole so don't listen to me
I would ask your instructor's view as he/she knows the horse & will be able to advise you in the best & safest way.
Contrary to others and yes I may get jumped on & I'm not bothered - I think that draw reins *can* work. But then I've also ridden in side reins and a gag on the bottom hole so don't listen to me
I would ask your instructor's view as he/she knows the horse & will be able to advise you in the best & safest way.
dopeesophee
Well-Known Member
she is ALWAYS between hand and leg... i always make sure she is working from behind, because i know that i cant get her to drop without her being from behind
skewbaldpony
Well-Known Member
OK, if that's you on her in your sig ...... and it may just be a bad photo, so don't take it too much to heart! .... but you are a long way back on her, with a very bent knee, and not the right kind of centre of gravity to be able to drive her into her bridle .. in my uncultured and old fashioned opinion.
I can't see very well, but maybe you need some work on your position, or a new saddle (like don't we all
)
Of course this may all be irrelevant as my glasses aren't that good!
I can't see very well, but maybe you need some work on your position, or a new saddle (like don't we all
Of course this may all be irrelevant as my glasses aren't that good!
carthorse
Well-Known Member
Copies of Pessoas are not very expensive at all and they are worth it but don't have it tight to start with.
I am worried by the way you say you hardly hold the reins , this might be part of the problem, if you have no contact ,when you ask something it is quite severe to a horse because there is no feel in the horse's mouth .
Your instuctress may have to' fight to start with' but I hope she gives a nice soft contact when your mare softens her contact. I feel it may be a problem of you not quite understanding contact and your mare also not understanding as well, Draw reins would make the problem worse ,I think, and you would just rely on them and damage your horse's back
I am worried by the way you say you hardly hold the reins , this might be part of the problem, if you have no contact ,when you ask something it is quite severe to a horse because there is no feel in the horse's mouth .
Your instuctress may have to' fight to start with' but I hope she gives a nice soft contact when your mare softens her contact. I feel it may be a problem of you not quite understanding contact and your mare also not understanding as well, Draw reins would make the problem worse ,I think, and you would just rely on them and damage your horse's back
BlackWhite381
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Very hard to answer the question without knowing you and your horse.
Contrary to others and yes I may get jumped on & I'm not bothered - I think that draw reins *can* work. But then I've also ridden in side reins and a gag on the bottom hole so don't listen to me
I would ask your instructor's view as he/she knows the horse & will be able to advise you in the best & safest way.
[/ QUOTE ]
Side reins ... Really ???!
Very hard to answer the question without knowing you and your horse.
Contrary to others and yes I may get jumped on & I'm not bothered - I think that draw reins *can* work. But then I've also ridden in side reins and a gag on the bottom hole so don't listen to me
I would ask your instructor's view as he/she knows the horse & will be able to advise you in the best & safest way.
[/ QUOTE ]
Side reins ... Really ???!
Llwyncwn
Well-Known Member
I agree with BW381, and from personal experience as I have a broken horse now. If you are not riding forward from your leg with the most gentle of contacts, i.e. closing your hands rather than pulling back on the reins then your horse will tell you it hurts. There are no quick fixes, believe me I have looked. Less is more IMHO and if you have ruled out any physical reason why your horse will not/cannot work in an outline then you must look within.
Sorry, another NO. (take a tip from another HHO user who's gorgeous mare has a wacking great hole in her tendon).
Sorry, another NO. (take a tip from another HHO user who's gorgeous mare has a wacking great hole in her tendon).
dopeesophee
Well-Known Member
well when i said hardly hold the reins i meant not a hard contact, or using them to balance, i obviously hold them but a soft light contact
re my picture... that was taken when i first had her... was a bundle of nerves, and i was sat squiffy cos i was jus standing around
^this was in the pelham... i dont think i am doing anything untoward but that is how she carries her head wheen i ride sometimes
re my picture... that was taken when i first had her... was a bundle of nerves, and i was sat squiffy cos i was jus standing around
^this was in the pelham... i dont think i am doing anything untoward but that is how she carries her head wheen i ride sometimes
BlackWhite381
Well-Known Member
Looks from the photo like you need to find a bit she is happy in not necessarily a stronger bit as getting the right bit can be 99% of the battle and also have you tried a martingale?
toomanyhorses26
Well-Known Member
if you are looking for a pessoa type action ebay normally have someone selling fakes for bout £40 which are just as good as the originl, if you fancy getting a bit blue peter about things you can buy everything you need from your local climbing /out door shop or iff you are really stuck put the lungie bungie on the front and double over a lunge line,attach to your girth straps and put around her back and you have soemthing simialr to a pessoa we have fond this works well with softer mouth horses as there isn't a constant working on the mouth as with a normal pessoa
ickelshadow
Well-Known Member
you mentioned you barely hold the reins at all.... how would you actually describe your contact? soft? elastic? firm? consistent? or do you play with the bit.
it sounds from a glancing perspective that she is tense in her neck and back, dislikes strong bits and gadgets. therefore a DEFINITE NO on the draw reins, would be far too tempting to keep drawing them in.
it may be worth giving her a break to let her muscles soften (say 2-3weeks) and then build up VERY slowly, aiming to work her in a correct contact and frame, allowing her the time that she needs in her older age (not that she's old, i reschooled my old girl at 24/25!) to adjust appropriately. focus on light hacking and softening school work in 20 minute bursts. if it helps to stay in walk and trot and get into a light seat so that your weight is off her back, then do it - let some spring come back. you will need a light, elastic contact (i want to say encouraging but i dont mean constantly play with the bit, just have a contact that she has confidence in) and focus on rhythm and softness and her stepping through her back.
i'm sure you know that nothing is going to fix itself over night. the tension indicates that muscles are likely to be sore and tight so pulling her head into the right place will only make things more uncomfortable for her.
you say you have her teeth and back checked regularly, but when where they last done? might be worth trying different people if they can't find anything wrong.
have fun and good luck! taking your time to solve it will reap its own rewards.
it sounds from a glancing perspective that she is tense in her neck and back, dislikes strong bits and gadgets. therefore a DEFINITE NO on the draw reins, would be far too tempting to keep drawing them in.
it may be worth giving her a break to let her muscles soften (say 2-3weeks) and then build up VERY slowly, aiming to work her in a correct contact and frame, allowing her the time that she needs in her older age (not that she's old, i reschooled my old girl at 24/25!) to adjust appropriately. focus on light hacking and softening school work in 20 minute bursts. if it helps to stay in walk and trot and get into a light seat so that your weight is off her back, then do it - let some spring come back. you will need a light, elastic contact (i want to say encouraging but i dont mean constantly play with the bit, just have a contact that she has confidence in) and focus on rhythm and softness and her stepping through her back.
i'm sure you know that nothing is going to fix itself over night. the tension indicates that muscles are likely to be sore and tight so pulling her head into the right place will only make things more uncomfortable for her.
you say you have her teeth and back checked regularly, but when where they last done? might be worth trying different people if they can't find anything wrong.
have fun and good luck! taking your time to solve it will reap its own rewards.
dopeesophee
Well-Known Member
^
best pic of her with a reasonably decent head carriage... **bend elbows**
after the previous picture... pelham i decided i wouldnt ride her init as it made it worse... yes i have tried a martingale, but not 4 a while, so i am goin 2 do that this week
Llwyncwn
Well-Known Member
Well, looking at the pic I feel that she has pain in her mouth and, looking at your hands/arms you are obviously tense and fighting her for her head. Have you thought of trying a new instructor?