Dressage and the older horse?

[dressage_diva]

Just wondering people's thoughts on introducing dressage to an older horse (mid-late teens) that has spent most of it's life hacking/jumping (low-level)? Do you think it can be done if you take your time and introduce the work slowly so as not to strain their muscles? Or do you think it's too late to change a horse's way of going and the muscles cannot learn to work in another manner? I'm not talking about producing a top-level competition horse but getting a horse to work through from behind into an outline and doing basic lateral work (with a view to maybe competing BD Elem).

Am really interested in hearing people's thoughts/experiences. Thanks

 

[the watcher]

I think it would be a very good exercise for the horse.As long as you take it steady and concentrate on building muscles correctly instead of rushing into false outlines (not that you are planning to do that) then it can only be a positive.

 

[MyDiamondLass]

IF you horse is well balanced and has a good atitude to work i dont think you would have any problem what so ever! Give it a go you will always get feed back on your score sheet so you will see what you need to work on!

 

[MissSBird]

My sister's fell pony was very much sj trained. It's taken 3 years but she's finally beginning to work in a proper outline - or as much of one as her confo will allow.

She was very stubborn though and had never been taught how to work properly; my sister was also novicey at asking for an outline.

So to sum up, yes! There's no reason not to give it a go

 

[miller]

I turned to dressage with my 13yo ex SJ horse - registered BD and in limited outings he now has 96 points (not competed for 4 years as had no transport or money due to doing up a house) he is now 21 and still working Adv Medium at home with a few adv movements thrown in.

Never had any injury issues and he is still loose and supple now (doesn't even come out stiff in the mornings)

Give it a go as someone else said the comments will help you

 

[SillySausage]

My horse is 18 next month ... we started competing in (unaffiliated) prelim dressage about two months ago with great success!

I think it depends on your horse really, their fitness levels, any outstanding problems, their willingness and ability to learn etc. Mine is the fittest he has been in a long time, has no existing problems and the most incredible attitude to learning

 

[dressage_diva]

Thanks guys interesting replies. The reason I ask is that I moved my 15yr old horse to a reputable dressage yard and had him on training livery where he was being regularly schooled and I received lessons on him and everything seemed to be going fine. We did lots of lunging in a pessoa and were taking things slowly with him when after about 6weeks he suddenly got a lot of heat and pain in his back (behidn where the saddle sitS) and seemed to be stepping short behind. Long story short a very reputable vet (who's an expert in lameness etc) said that he was too old for us to introduce dressage and to ask him to change his way of going as muscles had memory and trying to make him work in a different manner to what he was used to. However, vet said he could carry on "as before", ie. jumping and hacking. The vet also confirmed that both his GP and dressage saddles fitted him fine (they'd only both been fitted about 6weeks ago anyways!).

The thing is, the day before the back pain flared up my horse managed to roll out of his rug in the field (he's never done this before, but it was suddenly very warm and I think he was just uncomfortably hot). My gut feeling is that this was what caused the back pain, not least because for the 3 days before the back pain he was only hacked on a loose rein - surely if it was the dressage work that was to blame the pain would have flared up after a schooling session?

The other thing was that this vet is rather old school, believing dressage to be pointless and that all horses should be out hunting! So whilst I don't doubt his clinical diagnosis (which was that after some rest there was nothing physically wrong with my horse just a tweaked muscle), I'm concerned he may have been a little biased.

Since then I've just been hacking him and jumping him, but I'm tempted to go back to the dressage with him (incredibly slowly) and see how things go, but was worried that maybe I was being narrow-minded and presuming I could change him at 15?

I should add that up til the back pain he's been very fit and healthy all of his life and has always been at a good level of fitness (ridden 6 times a week and certainly fit) and he enjoys a variety of work.

Would it be a really bad idea to start introducing some lunging in a pessoa again to work on strengthening his back muscles? If so, what's the maximum number of times a week I should do this (I'll build up slowly).

 

[ottodyl1]

I would have thought that as long as you build things up slowly & the pessoa is fairly loose it should not cause a problem - wouldn't overdo the lungeing though - would have thought once or twice a week should be enough as I feel going round & round in circles every day is not always beneficial & more likely to cause problems. No reason why you can not incorporate your flatwork training into your hacking & jumping & keep the sessions short with lots of stretching inbetween. Also make sure your horse is warmed up well before you start to ask for a rounder outline & make sure you cool him down well afterwards to avoid muscle injuries. You could also incorporate some 'carrot stretches' on the ground if he gets a bit tight.
If a horse is using itself correctly & working over it's back it is more able to support it's rider & is going to be less susceptible to injury than one that is hollow with it's head in the air. Obviously, if a horse has always worked in a certain way, it is going to take a long time to alter it's way of going & lengthen muscles which have become shortened, but it's not impossible.
I think as long as you are sensible & as you say, take things slowly, there is no reason why your horse should not be able to progress in it's flatwork.

 

[dressage_diva]

I would have thought that as long as you build things up slowly & the pessoa is fairly loose it should not cause a problem - wouldn't overdo the lungeing though - would have thought once or twice a week should be enough as I feel going round & round in circles every day is not always beneficial & more likely to cause problems.

Thanks, my reasoning behind using lots of lunging was to build up the horse's back muscles without having a rider on board. Will obviously start one just lunging once a week in the pessoa and then increase to two times a week.

Also make sure your horse is warmed up well before you start to ask for a rounder outline & make sure you cool him down well afterwards to avoid muscle injuries. You could also incorporate some 'carrot stretches' on the ground if he gets a bit tight.

Have got an equilibrium massage pad so can use that on him before and after work as well as making sure he is warmed up and cooled down slowly. When we started introducing the dressage training he always had a nice long walk stretch on a long rein and again at the end, just letting him relax and stretch out.

If a horse is using itself correctly & working over it's back it is more able to support it's rider & is going to be less susceptible to injury than one that is hollow with it's head in the air.

That was my theory too!

I think as long as you are sensible & as you say, take things slowly, there is no reason why your horse should not be able to progress in it's flatwork.

Thanks for your useful advice

 

[Lgd]

My friend's old boy was a complete mess when she got him as a 14yo. He had done some dressage but had some serious physical problems that required a lot of vet & chiro visits to put right. He did his first dressage competition as a 15yo. He competed in affiliated dressage and did his first advanced test at almost 24yo. He won his last affiliated class as a 26yo. He is still being ridden three or four times a week, although he has just recently been put onto the occasional bute as he is a bit stiff on starting out. Our vet believes keeping old horses going in a correct way is far better for them.

My niece also taught her ex-BSJA pony to do dressage as a 13yo. We sold her at 18yo as an elementary level schoolmistress, last contact I had she was still sound and doing dressage in her early 20's.

 

[dressager]

My horse was practically retired for 5 years while I went to uni. When he was about 17 or 18 I decided I really wanted to get into dressage more (previously only done local prelim RC type stuff with him, plus jumping and hacking) and so I started having lessons with a BD trainer. She was very respectful of the fact he was older and we spent many months just working on getting him forwards and straight. She advised me only to school him in total for 40 mins (including warm up and cool down) so I had to be quick on getting him to work properly from the start and not just "go round and round" for too long if you know what I mean ie keep a low milage on him. I guess I schooled him 3 or 4 times a week and hacked the rest of it.

After a year of lessons he was established in leg yield, shoulder in, walk-canter-walk, counter canter, walk pirouettes and his medium trots were fab. He probably looked the best he's ever looked! He was always sound and it didn't cause any problems at all. I would never have put him on training livery at that age though as I would be worried they would have rushed him. The main reason I wanted to get him going again was for me to learn a bit more on before I bought a young dressage horse, glad I did it although it took a lot of patience.