Dressage experts - can you help me and have a look at this PSG horse?

I actually think there is quite a lot to like there and a lot to work with.

No, he does not have a lot of expression in his changes etc. but then I don't think he is a 'big moving' type of horse. The only thing I would say is if I was looking for a PSG horse I would expect the piaffe to be a little more established than it is on the video, however, again the building blocks are there to improve on.

If the price is right, and he is the kind of horse you are looking for, then yes, it would be worth bringing him over here (of course will xrays needed etc etc to ensure nothing lurking, but I would do that with any horse I am buying) as I think even if he was not the one for you he would sell in the UK.

But I think he could teach someone a lot and just needs to let go a bit more and not be so tense through his frame. But as some others have said, I do not think the rider is helping this situation at all. However, I would also say if you do get him to get some help from someone very experienced at this level or above to improve his way of going etc (sorry if telling you how to suck eggs).
 
I am certainly no 'expert', but personally I think he is not a suitable school master. I would expect a schoolmaster (especially one who has competed at PSG) to have much better basics. He looks very willing, and with some work could be a nice horse at a lower level, but it will take quite some time.

As you are looking for a schoolmaster, I presume you are looking for a horse who is 'ready to go'? For that price, I think you could find a nice horse competing at elementary level with the potential to go on with some more training.

The rider really isn't showing him off to his best, which is a pity.
 
I recall a couple of horses being advertised during the National Winter Finals - If you've travelled to Russia then Ireland will be a short trip :) I'll try and track them down for you...
 
jonny said:
That is actually uncomfortable to watch. Poor horse, and the rider? ummmmmm...... ! I won't say anymore than that.

X :D X
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please don't just watch the last videos though - I really should have tried to put some of the good ones up first, but unfortunately dont know how to use youtube!!
 
_jetset_ said:
I actually think there is quite a lot to like there and a lot to work with.

No, he does not have a lot of expression in his changes etc. but then I don't think he is a 'big moving' type of horse. The only thing I would say is if I was looking for a PSG horse I would expect the piaffe to be a little more established than it is on the video, however, again the building blocks are there to improve on.

If the price is right, and he is the kind of horse you are looking for, then yes, it would be worth bringing him over here (of course will xrays needed etc etc to ensure nothing lurking, but I would do that with any horse I am buying) as I think even if he was not the one for you he would sell in the UK.

But I think he could teach someone a lot and just needs to let go a bit more and not be so tense through his frame. But as some others have said, I do not think the rider is helping this situation at all. However, I would also say if you do get him to get some help from someone very experienced at this level or above to improve his way of going etc (sorry if telling you how to suck eggs).
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you have a very similar opinion to my trainer :o) she likes him, and thinks that she could work on him to improve his way of going. However, she wouldn't touch a horse with a lateral walk, so we won't be buying him. If he didn't have the walk, then we may have considered it (if he X-rayed ok) as there are some good things to like about him if the price is right
 
Halfstep said:
If he passed a vetting and was cheap I'd buy him, I like him! :). He's stiff and unsupple, and his walk is dreadful, but I think a huge amount of this is how he's being ridden. He looks ever so sweet and I bet that with a few months of decent riding and just ridden gymnastically and with suppleness in mind, I bet he'd be a nice sweet amateur's horse at Elementary or Medium. Not PSG, by a long, long, long way. I bet he walks ok naturally and can learn his walk again once the whole rudimentary piaffe thing has been forgotten poor creature.

So, no, not a FEI horse, but at a low price and if you are willing to do some basic reschooling and he's sound, then I've seen a whole lot worse! There are nice flashes in there when he briefly shows his natural movement.
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if you watch the walk video through to the end - he is on a free rein (when she eventually lets him out) - unfortunately he still looks partially lateral to me, although I'm no expert. Its enough to put off my instructor though, which is a shame as she also likes him and thinks he would be nice to work with.
 
Tempi said:
Definately agree with this, he has aboslutly no basics established at all, there is no swing over his back, hes tight in his neck and jaw. Hes not engaged at all and i would see needs a good 6months worth of work before he would get decent marks at even medium level in this country. I wouldnt pay more than 6k for him, sorry.

IMO there are much nicer younger horses for sale in this country that you could train yourself, without having to undone work thats been done on an older horse - which will take a lot longer than training a youngster......
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thanks - there are probably nicer horses over in the UK, but whilst I'm here, I'm just keeping an eye out in case a nice ready made one appears... keeps me busy!! :o)
 
There are a couple of "deal breakers" with dressage horses, and the lateral walk is definitely one of them. At absolute best a horse with a lateral walk will be getting 4s for it at FEI levels and with coefficient marks that's a massive deficit to overcome - the horse would have to be spectacular in every other way, including the other coefficient movements. A horse that walks laterally when taken on the hand, particularly in a double and with less than sympathetic riding MIGHT be fixable or at least manageable but walks are notoriously difficult to fix relative to say, trots. It's quite possible to wreck a good walk but many horses already have a predisposition to "going lateral" so it's worth taking note when you're looking at other horses.

Too bad as there was a lot about the horse in himself to like. Do you know how he's bred? Perhaps it's worth trying to find out if not, in order to keep your eye out for a similar model without some of his baggage.
 
having only seen this thread, have come in a bit late!

Personally, I dont see anything wrong with the horse, apart from the fact that it looks lame on the off hind!
But it could just be lazy and trailing its hocks...

I dont think it would go out at PSG and do a good test, but it may be a good horse to learn the movements off?
 
Can I please ask the dressage experts here why a horse would have a lateral walk? What would cause this?

I actually really like the attitude of this horse and would love to buy him just to get him away from that rider! He is a saint for putting up with being made to walk / trot so artificially and would probably love to be re-trained correctly so he is no longer so tense. Poor lad.
 
I own a Russian horse, and I bought him through the Russian Horse Society which used to be in Surrey and no longer exists, but I did try out quite a few different horses of theirs back then so am familiar with Russian Trakheners.

I have found that in general they have good temperaments and are schooled in tricks but lacking in basics. Mine could do canter pirhouettes and half passes in a very unconnected and incorrect way, and he didn't lunge or have very good ground manners (why did I buy him you're probably wondering :D)

The horse looks very genuine and if you were only using him to learn on rather than aiming to compete at a decent level then an incorrect walk is not so important as temperament. Some horses I know only do a lateral walk when tense/rider is restricting the back so maybe with a different rider he may look very different...
 
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