Drop off centres for unwanted horses?

[Cecile]

Good spot. I haven't seen this advert before. Do any of the hunts advertise their services? Our local ones no longer offer the service, alas.

Around here we have the vet, knacker man or drag hunt, never seen hunts advertise their services
There is also this type of thing, are there any members on here who have used this service?

http://www.nfsco.co.uk/about-the-scheme.php#1_2

 

[ycbm]

If it weren't for the red tape, every horse would be worth roughly 70p per kilo as dog food, and that in itself would encourage the bottom feeders to set up in the 'horse disposal' business.

Horse passports and EU regs on human consumption effectively killed the horsemeat business, and the current situation is the direct result.
It is madness that 500kg of meat is a £400 liability, not a £300 asset.

This.

In1986 I had a horse shot (at home) and removed by the local Pet Food company. His meat was not fit to process due to his illlness, but I was still paid £40 for his carcass. Today it would cost me £200 to have that horse shot and taken away. Why?

 

[anguscat]

Scratching my head for some sort of practical response to these tragic abandonment cases recently. The 2 colts in the news today just another example of this horrible form of fly tipping.
If people are bothered to load them up and drive them somewhere quiet - while alive! couldn't we have some sort of anonymous / prosecution free places to take them to - at least so they can be PTS quickly not left to die in the cold slowly. If vets signed up to it you could have a network around the country (or in areas where which is most prolific)
Would there even be a hope that people would dump them a little before it's completely too late? so the odd one could make it.

Would hunts take these kinds of poor things in for hound food? Should that me much better advertised ?

Or should we all be getting horses put back on the dog food menu so the 6 month old colour colt is at least worth £25 for dog food and won't be pushed out the back of a truck unable to stand in a storm

Sorry for ranting - really made me sad this morning reading the news AGAIN !

We desperately need a solution. I posted about this issue a few weeks back....I think it was headed something like 'day after day'. For my part I've decided to print off the reports of every cruelty case, having the harrowing picture as the front sheet for every report. Every so often I'll be sending a bundle of them to my MP. I just want to increase awareness of what's going on. I think unless you're a Horse and Hound website follower, you'd not know the scale of the problem. Maybe more of us might consider similarly lobbying our MPs directly? Someone on this thread succinctly described it as fly-tipping of the most callous type. It's so difficult to understand the mind-set of the people who carry out these acts. They must have some sort of attraction to horses to have them in the first place.
I think use in dog food so these poor beasts have at least some monetary value, would be very good. Wasn't Princess Anne saying something along these lines a year or so ago?

 

[Kaylum]

We desperately need a solution. I posted about this issue a few weeks back....I think it was headed something like 'day after day'. For my part I've decided to print off the reports of every cruelty case, having the harrowing picture as the front sheet for every report. Every so often I'll be sending a bundle of them to my MP. I just want to increase awareness of what's going on. I think unless you're a Horse and Hound website follower, you'd not know the scale of the problem. Maybe more of us might consider similarly lobbying our MPs directly? Someone on this thread succinctly described it as fly-tipping of the most callous type. It's so difficult to understand the mind-set of the people who carry out these acts. They must have some sort of attraction to horses to have them in the first place.
I think use in dog food so these poor beasts have at least some monetary value, would be very good. Wasn't Princess Anne saying something along these lines a year or so ago?

Unfortunately know too well the scale of the problem which has been going on for over 20 years now since coloureds became the fashion and it was acceptable for ponies to be tethered and nobody said anything in case their houses were burnt down.

I am glad these discussions are going on on this forum and fb. A good way to actually help in a productive way is to get involved with a charity. Spreading the word around, helping with the educational work they do in schools and with groups. Helping ponies as many can be brought back to health and rehomed. Offer discounts on castration, free microchipping etc. Be a point of contact at auctions where there is terrible neglect make relationships with people whose trust you gain.

 

[Kaylum]

BTW our local MP is amazing. He supports us 100 percent in everything we do. He attends our Faryes, tweets for us and cannot praise him enough. When you might think people aren't doing things they certainly are the media you see is quite select. If you follow the actual charities themselves and get out and talk to them you would be very surprised about the vastness of their work.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Why not put the effort into establishing a viable route to market for the meat. That way fewer old horses would be neglected, because they'd be worth something to the meat man again. More abbatoirs, more employment, cheaper dog food, and better horse welfare.

Problem is, that doesn't scan well for the money-collecting machines who are the animal welfare charities. Nobody gives money to a charity which wants to build an abbatoir and ensure lots of old, poorly ponies are shot as quickly as possible. Otherwise they'd be lobbying for just that.

This sounds like the best idea, IMO.
But pt is right, there won't be enough people willing to donate to that cause.

 

[poiuytrewq]

It's a very sad situation.

 

[Sparemare]

Until there is zero tolerance for the owners of these abused and abandoned horses there won't be a solution. The police, rspca, council know what's going on, but have insufficient powers and manpower to deal with it.

 

[Orangehorse]

We desperately need a solution. I posted about this issue a few weeks back....I think it was headed something like 'day after day'. For my part I've decided to print off the reports of every cruelty case, having the harrowing picture as the front sheet for every report. Every so often I'll be sending a bundle of them to my MP. I just want to increase awareness of what's going on. I think unless you're a Horse and Hound website follower, you'd not know the scale of the problem. Maybe more of us might consider similarly lobbying our MPs directly? Someone on this thread succinctly described it as fly-tipping of the most callous type. It's so difficult to understand the mind-set of the people who carry out these acts. They must have some sort of attraction to horses to have them in the first place.
I think use in dog food so these poor beasts have at least some monetary value, would be very good. Wasn't Princess Anne saying something along these lines a year or so ago?

Well done you, that is a good idea. It makes me sick to see these reports of dead and dying ponies just dumped, and I think the person who said that they will have a nice shiny pick-up is about right.

 

[Regandal]

Until there is zero tolerance for the owners of these abused and abandoned horses there won't be a solution. The police, rspca, council know what's going on, but have insufficient powers and manpower to deal with it.

I don't think it's just resources. These horses are being dumped by one section of society (in the main). They are seen as above the law. Untouchable.

 

[Goldenstar]

I don't think it's just resources. These horses are being dumped by one section of society (in the main). They are seen as above the law. Untouchable.

That's my view.

 

[dizzyneddy]

If all the horses were micro chipped and passported it would be possible to find the owners. It is once again the case that we have the laws in place, but they are not enforced.

This is another problem at the place l am there are 4 liveries with a total of 8 horses between us & only my 3 & l of another liveries is microchipped. The YO has asked the others to do it last summer but in a conversation with one of the other girls about microchipping & that all horses should be done she just said that her vet said it's upto her if she has it done & that she wasn't bothered about it. Money isn't a issue for her as she drives around in a flash car etc. It's as if people/society these days have a couldn't careless attitude. My youngest mare is the same age as one of hers & l got mine as a weanling l remember the breeder wanted some details as the vet was doing her passport & microchipping so to me it's essential that all horses are done.

It's just so sad that horses are being deposed off in such as callous way. l personally don't know what can be done but something has to be done. It seems that it's mainly cobs being dumped but there are lots of old TBs & other breeds particularly older horses that are being sold so cheaply nowadays somhow long is going to be until we start seeing the likes of these being dumped?

l just wonder what the world is coming to.

 

[dizzyneddy]

I don't think it's just resources. These horses are being dumped by one section of society (in the main). They are seen as above the law. Untouchable.

l totally agree with this & it's a pity they couldn't have the same treatment done to them be pulled off a flat bed!!!!

 

[MotherOfChickens]

Golden star, it isn't that these people cannot afford to have their animals either properly looked after or pts humanely, it is that they do not value them sufficiently to spend the money. I bet the men that dumped those colts today have a shiny new pick up and caravan.

its not the PC point of view, but it is mine. you can legislate law abiding people all you want, it will not stop those who d this until you educate them to be different or actually hold that population accountable.

I am too sick of hearing that 'we' are responsible. No I am bloody not, I've not bought one of these cheap scrags nor have I ever dumped an animal-stop pussyfooting around and go after those that do, why should I pick up their bill?

 

[windand rain]

The laws exist already but there is no funding to enforce them. An amnesty might work for those that care but have hit hard times but it will never work for those who dont care and are happy to con someone into rescuing them and as a result lining their pockets. These animals are kept poor to encourage the unwary into rescuing them it is a lucrative business with no overheads or costs. The ones being dumped are collateral damage in the main

 

[fattylumpkin]

Whether the idea would work or not, I'm cheering Polos Mum for at least trying to come up with a solution to a horrible problem.

 

[LadyGascoyne]

The issue with drop off points would be that these facilities would incur a duty of care towards these animals.

They'd either have to foot the bill themselves for the pts/disposal/clean up/time or they'd have to apply for public funds.

If for some reason the pts couldn't take place immediately (if funding wasn't immediately available or if logistics became a problem) they would legally have to seek medical care, feed etc.

The bills could quickly escalate and there would have to be some kind of evaluation as to whether the pts qualified for public funding. Some organisation would need to administrate, and police it- which would cost again.

If it was a publicly funded service, I think there would most likely end up being a threshold to meet for pts and not a blanket acceptance that any animal dropped off is immediately destroyed.

Euthanasia clinics work in the US because the clinics don't take custody of the animal, so the only care is the actual pts itself.

I'd love to see licensing, especially stallion licensing, but again, it would be high on admin and a long process.

Castration clinics would be my vote, it's the long play but I think it would be easier to get public approval for than euthanasia clinics.

Great post Polos mum, it's so important to keep these discussions alive.

 

[Fairynuff]

The issue with drop off points would be that these facilities would incur a duty of care towards these animals.

They'd either have to foot the bill themselves for the pts/disposal/clean up/time or they'd have to apply for public funds.

If for some reason the pts couldn't take place immediately (if funding wasn't immediately available or if logistics became a problem) they would legally have to seek medical care, feed etc.

The bills could quickly escalate and there would have to be some kind of evaluation as to whether the pts qualified for public funding. Some organisation would need to administrate, and police it- which would cost again.

If it was a publicly funded service, I think there would most likely end up being a threshold to meet for pts and not a blanket acceptance that any animal dropped off is immediately destroyed.

Euthanasia clinics work in the US because the clinics don't take custody of the animal, so the only care is the actual pts itself.

I'd love to see licensing, especially stallion licensing, but again, it would be high on admin and a long process.

Castration clinics would be my vote, it's the long play but I think it would be easier to get public approval for than euthanasia clinics.

Great post Polos mum, it's so important to keep these discussions alive.

wish there was a 'like' button

 

[char3479]

I don't see how encouraging breeding for meat is going to help with the problem. There is a market already, which pays reasonably well, and which a lot of people utilise. I can't imagine the owners of the horses bred for meat are the ones doing the dumping because they already make their money from it. I'll make the assumption that the 'dumpers' are people who breed on a small scale and who can't be bothered to do any of it properly because they don't make a lot from it, but carry on doing it because it's another way to make a few quid sometimes. However, I have no idea. But Polo's Mum, totally agree that there needs to be something done, because it's abhorrent that it carries on unchecked.

 

[Equi]

Unfortunately I think the well meaning folk have caused this to become such an issue. The ones who can't tolerate the thought of a pet animal being used for food.

No I'm not going to raise my own horse to slaughter it and eat it, but that's cause I have the funds to look after it from another scoured and the funds to dispose of it when needed.

If cow meat suddenly became unfashionable you would see cows dumped everywhere too.

We need to make it acceptable to use horses for meat again be it in our food or dog food. I would happily eat a horse steak if I knew it had come from a farm where they were raised in as best a way possible - that includes race horses cause we all know how well they can be looked after!

Too much red tape and soft people.

 

[s4sugar]

Laws already exist but are not enforced.

I would like to see; -
NED reinstated, it was just getting it's act together when it got pulled and the saving of £185K pa is a drop in the ocean compared to what dumping and fly grazing etc cost across the country.
Zero VAT on gelding and a charge of about the same as gelding for each male kept entire for an identification licence until full stallion licence at the age of three or four. This should include DNA sampling as many breed registries already require.
Any horse being travelled without a passport (or emergency documents) seized.
More horse abattoirs.
Holding numbers as for cloven hooved stock, licencing for livery yards.

lots more but that is a start.

 

[The Fuzzy Furry]

Well done you, that is a good idea. It makes me sick to see these reports of dead and dying ponies just dumped, and I think the person who said that they will have a nice shiny pick-up is about right.

I don't think it's just resources. These horses are being dumped by one section of society (in the main). They are seen as above the law. Untouchable.

Some of you may be interested to know that there is widespead disgust among large parts of the travelling community about this too.
There has been much discussion about sorting these abysmal scum out, not all travellers are the same, many actually do care very much for their horses - like many do on here. Travellers locally to me are up in arms about it as this reflects badly on them as a community too.
Yes, these are the types of animals that they might have but not all belong to travellers themselves.
Locally there are a number belonging to house dwellers, who have no idea on how to keep a pet rock, let alone a pony/horse. They are agressive to any input from welfare societies - or even the travellers who have tried to help out too! One member of this 'breed' has already been hauled up for horse dumping, but whilst they still keep breeding rubbish from yearlings and 2 yr olds, this is still going to happen!

Remember, there are Aholes in ALL walks of life & whilst I accept that 1 part of the community 'can' be an issue, its not always them ALL the time.

 

[honetpot]

When people were dumping cars because the price of scrap was so little you were having to pay to have them taken away, our local council subsidised their disposal. It saved the cost of removing them burnt out from the side of the road, and they have VIN numbers.
I think there should be 'monitored' paddocks where you can dump them, but if it got out they were going to be shot the equivalent of the anti- abortionists would be stood outside trying to save them.
The ones that are being dumped are not worth anything for meat, I know someone who supplies the meat trade and they look like bulls when they leave him.
I think the idea of collating all the incidents is a really good one, every council will have this problem, but they have so many other problems unless it causes a huge accident it does not get reported. As it is all the small rescues are mopping up a lot, one local to me had two dumped at the bottom of their drive in the dark, they had obviously been shut in somewhere.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/175...52728028070813/?sale_post_id=1452728028070813

 

[Rollin]

Some of you may be interested to know that there is widespead disgust among large parts of the travelling community about this too.
There has been much discussion about sorting these abysmal scum out, not all travellers are the same, many actually do care very much for their horses - like many do on here. Travellers locally to me are up in arms about it as this reflects badly on them as a community too.
Yes, these are the types of animals that they might have but not all belong to travellers themselves.
Locally there are a number belonging to house dwellers, who have no idea on how to keep a pet rock, let alone a pony/horse. They are agressive to any input from welfare societies - or even the travellers who have tried to help out too! One member of this 'breed' has already been hauled up for horse dumping, but whilst they still keep breeding rubbish from yearlings and 2 yr olds, this is still going to happen!

Remember, there are Aholes in ALL walks of life & whilst I accept that 1 part of the community 'can' be an issue, its not always them ALL the time.

THIS. Over many years I have met a number of travellers - as you say not all scum, many care for their horses.

I do think a drop off centre would be a good idea, however, the people who do this don't read newspapers belong to forums such as this etc. so would have no idea of the options open to them. The people responsible are pig ignorant who probably starve their cats, dogs, and children too.

 

[char3479]

Some of you may be interested to know that there is widespead disgust among large parts of the travelling community about this too.
There has been much discussion about sorting these abysmal scum out, not all travellers are the same, many actually do care very much for their horses - like many do on here. Travellers locally to me are up in arms about it as this reflects badly on them as a community too.
Yes, these are the types of animals that they might have but not all belong to travellers themselves.
Locally there are a number belonging to house dwellers, who have no idea on how to keep a pet rock, let alone a pony/horse. They are agressive to any input from welfare societies - or even the travellers who have tried to help out too! One member of this 'breed' has already been hauled up for horse dumping, but whilst they still keep breeding rubbish from yearlings and 2 yr olds, this is still going to happen!

Remember, there are Aholes in ALL walks of life & whilst I accept that 1 part of the community 'can' be an issue, its not always them ALL the time.

This.

 

[windand rain]

Some of you may be interested to know that there is widespead disgust among large parts of the travelling community about this too.
There has been much discussion about sorting these abysmal scum out, not all travellers are the same, many actually do care very much for their horses - like many do on here. Travellers locally to me are up in arms about it as this reflects badly on them as a community too.
Yes, these are the types of animals that they might have but not all belong to travellers themselves.
Locally there are a number belonging to house dwellers, who have no idea on how to keep a pet rock, let alone a pony/horse. They are agressive to any input from welfare societies - or even the travellers who have tried to help out too! One member of this 'breed' has already been hauled up for horse dumping, but whilst they still keep breeding rubbish from yearlings and 2 yr olds, this is still going to happen!

Remember, there are Aholes in ALL walks of life & whilst I accept that 1 part of the community 'can' be an issue, its not always them ALL the time.

I agree wholeheartedly there are evil scum in all walks of life. Dodgy dealers are not necessarily travellers. In fact some of the worst cruelty is exposed in animal hoarders often at the very top of their game. Judges and prestigious show winning breeders often cherry pick their stock and neglect to the rest. Maybe not as far as dumping them but they are sometimes in a state. There is huge wastage in the Tb industry many too slow are dumped in a field until the next sale or sent for slaughter and they are the lucky ones

 

[Fairynuff]

Some of you may be interested to know that there is widespead disgust among large parts of the travelling community about this too.
There has been much discussion about sorting these abysmal scum out, not all travellers are the same, many actually do care very much for their horses - like many do on here. Travellers locally to me are up in arms about it as this reflects badly on them as a community too.
Yes, these are the types of animals that they might have but not all belong to travellers themselves.
Locally there are a number belonging to house dwellers, who have no idea on how to keep a pet rock, let alone a pony/horse. They are agressive to any input from welfare societies - or even the travellers who have tried to help out too! One member of this 'breed' has already been hauled up for horse dumping, but whilst they still keep breeding rubbish from yearlings and 2 yr olds, this is still going to happen!

Remember, there are Aholes in ALL walks of life & whilst I accept that 1 part of the community 'can' be an issue, its not always them ALL the time.

very well said ! It's so easy to blame the travellers for everything under the sun. Sometimes we should be looking nearer home..

 

[YorksG]

One of the big contributers to this problem is the loss of the small equine slaughter houses which used to cover the entire UK. Back in the 1980's our first horse had a catastrophic injury and the vet called the local equine slaughter company, who dealt with the death and disposal in the most humane and careful manner, and then sent us a small cheque. Since then the regulations which cover these establishments changed, our local equine slaughter house would have had to spend a minimum of a million pounds, to reach the standards, which we were told were EU wide, (I do wonder how the Spanish houses cope?). We are fortunate that this establishment changed to be a "pet crematorium", which also disposes of equines, with a slaughter and collection service, the last time we used their services it cost us about 200 pounds.

 

[tda]

What about this? I saw it on Dragon Driving
I have no idea who, what or where as I haven't seen this advert previously

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-97952.html

I saw this ad inH&H last week

 

[Regandal]

I'm perfectly aware that the majority of travellers do not neglect/dump their horses. But someone is, and until all equines are traceable, you'll never know who's doing it.