Elderly horse quidding

[**puddleduck**]

Hi, I have an almost 30 year old heavyweight cob mare who I’ve owned for the past 21 years. We’ve noticed that she’s struggling eating, quidding lots and not eating anywhere near the volume she used to, it’s been progressive for the past few years.

She’s always been your typical cob and got fat on fresh air and we’ve had to be mega careful at monitoring her weight as she has such a tendency to get fat. However, The last two winters she’s dropped loads of weight and actually ended up quite underweight by the end of this last winter just gone. We had to supplement with lots of hard feed to try and keep weight on her which is the total opposite to what she used to be like.

She has always had her teeth rasped by our equine only vet practice annually at the same time as vaccines for the entire time I’ve owned her and for the last about 3 years she’s been having 6 monthly teeth checks. As she was dropping weight over winter they put her on a 3 month teeth check, the issue is that every time they check her mouth and it’s been several different vets all specialist equine vets, they have all said that her mouth is in exceptionally good order for a horse of her age and they can’t find any reason as to why she’s struggling eating. Her teeth aren’t smooth so she should still be able to grind the haylage efficiently and she’s no loose teeth and is only missing one back tooth but that was from a long time ago.

She’s out 24/7 on good grass at the moment and so her condition is good again but the quidding hasn’t stopped as the water trough is full of balls of grass and if you walk round her paddock you can see chewed up grass on the floor.

Anyone any ideas as to why she’s struggling despite having good teeth? And ideas to help her? As I’m worried for this next winter.

The vet seemed at a bit of a loss last week when she came out.

Thanks

 

[ester]

Do your vets have additional dental qualifications?

 

[**puddleduck**]

Do your vets have additional dental qualifications?

I’m not sure if they all do, but I know she has been seen by one who definitely does. Although that wasn’t the vet who saw her last week.

She was sedated and had her teeth dremelled last week and they spent about 45mins checking her out but could find nothing bar a couple of slight edges but absolutely no way bad enough to cause any issue. She’s no food packing, no ulcers, nothing loose/cracked/displaced.

 

[ester]

We suspect that my oldie likely has a degree of jaw arthritis so if nothing visible that might be a possibility. Perhaps a bute trial might be a good idea to see if there is any improvement?

 

[**puddleduck**]

We suspect that my oldie likely has a degree of jaw arthritis so if nothing visible that might be a possibility. Perhaps a bute trial might be a good idea to see if there is any improvement?

Oh now that could be a possibility. She has bute for generalised stiffness but it’s only on an as and when basis and she’s generally in good health (doesn’t normally show her age). So she only usually has it before farrier visits as she was struggling lifting her legs high enough and if she’s stayed in for a long period then she has it then too, I haven’t noticed any correlation with bute and improvement in her eating but I haven’t looked for it and she’s probably not on it long enough as only usually has it for a day or two at a time.

Will try trialling her on a low dose for a week or two and see if there’s any improvement.

Thanks

 

[Gloi]

food stuck in diastemers was the usual reason for my oldie quidding. He had to be sedated and have specialist dental work regularly to sort them out properly. A bute trial may be a good idea though.

 

[**puddleduck**]

food stuck in diastemers was the usual reason for my oldie quidding. He had to be sedated and have specialist dental work regularly to sort them out properly. A bute trial may be a good idea though.

They said she has a few diastemers but didn’t have any packing as they’re quite wide. Everything flushed really easily with just a bit of water in a normal syringe.

Will try the bute trial and hope that works, if not I’ll be posting back for help on how to manage her food intake 🙈 I’ve owned her over 20 years but this is all brand new territory to me.

 

[meleeka]

I have a similar problem with my oldie. Although she’s not actually quidding, her teeth aren’t as efficient at chewing as they used to be and although she always looks as if she’s grazing, I think she’s struggling on shorter grass. I’m feeding her a round scoops (soaked) of Veteran Vitality and will add sugar beet and linseed in the winter, basically anything she doesn’t have to chew. She’s only 11.2hh so that would obviously need to be more for a bigger horse.

I think you ought to be aiming for a total hay replacer and the feed companies will be able to help with that. I plan on still giving mine hay all the time she wants it, but don’t expect it to provide anything in the way of goodness anymore.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I would start her on a higher dose to 'load' the painkiller effect and then drop to a low dose, rather than beginning with a low dose, which might not make much difference to her.

 

[ester]

Historically mine has one big tooth hole and a few smaller ones, he's always had slightly tricky teeth.
A couple of years ago he stopped eating anything, vet suspected the holes but dentist confirmed they hadn't really changed some bute and 10 days later he was much better again and hasn't had that sort of episode since. The dentist pondered the jaw idea and I would have xrayed had it continued but as it resolved we didn't bother. We do know he struggles with dentist visits because he clamps on the gag.

He's actually fine with hay and grass but really struggles with chaff which seems a bit odd but that's horses for you. He's on bute now anyway for other arthritic issues so if it has deteriorated we might not have picked it up.

 

[Tiddlypom]

My chiro vet always gives the head, poll and jaw area a very careful check over when she treats a horse. She picked up problems in my 8yo’s hyoid and TMJ area that concerned her last time, but thankfully it responded well to her treatment, so the possible referral to regular vet for further investigations was stood down. That could cause difficulty eating.

So maybe get a good chiro or similar, pref a vet qualified one, to give her the once over?

 

[Fransurrey]

She may have exposed pulp in her molars. My old boy had that in one tooth - it was found by a vet student!! Despite having the extra qualifications, the vet herself didn't spot it - it had to be felt, rather than seen.

 

[**puddleduck**]

I have a similar problem with my oldie. Although she’s not actually quidding, her teeth aren’t as efficient at chewing as they used to be and although she always looks as if she’s grazing, I think she’s struggling on shorter grass. I’m feeding her a round scoops (soaked) of Veteran Vitality and will add sugar beet and linseed in the winter, basically anything she doesn’t have to chew. She’s only 11.2hh so that would obviously need to be more for a bigger horse.

I think you ought to be aiming for a total hay replacer and the feed companies will be able to help with that. I plan on still giving mine hay all the time she wants it, but don’t expect it to provide anything in the way of goodness anymore.

Apologies I’ve only just seen your reply.

The vet said that her teeth aren’t smooth like what sometimes happens and so physically they *should* still be effective at chewing.

She’s holding weight very well again now as she’s on good (long) summer grass. I rent approximately 3 acres summer grazing just for my 2 horses and strip graze them with electric fencing moving it every morning and night and so she has lots of good grass to go at. She’s still quidding but it’s not causing her an issue in regards to her condition at present.

Last winter she had 2 x round scoops of hi-fi senior, 1 x round scoop of soaked sugar beet and then a small scoop of fibre cubes and small scoop of cool mix, with added water to make a slop. She had no issues with and practically inhaled that twice a day. I think I started giving it to her too late after she’d already dropped the weight, this winter I plan on feeding it as soon as the good grass finishes in anticipation of her losing condition and hopefully prevent her ending up as skinny as she did around jan/feb this year. I’ve also invested in new warmer rugs for her as previously since since she retired and stopped being clipped she’s barely been rugged as otherwise she sweated up but that’s changed now, so I’ll rug her up well too so she’s not losing weight keeping warm.

Thanks for the help, She’s my first horse and even though I’ve owned her 21 years now this is all new territory and I feel like a complete newbie again 🙈

 

[HashRouge]

I have a similar problem with my oldie. Although she’s not actually quidding, her teeth aren’t as efficient at chewing as they used to be and although she always looks as if she’s grazing, I think she’s struggling on shorter grass. I’m feeding her a round scoops (soaked) of Veteran Vitality and will add sugar beet and linseed in the winter, basically anything she doesn’t have to chew. She’s only 11.2hh so that would obviously need to be more for a bigger horse.

This is identical to mine. My mare does actually have diastema and was having major issues with food packing in front of her front teeth and causing gum disease/ soreness, which does seem to have improved quite a bit after her last dental visit. She is also struggling with the shorter grass this year, so is now grazing on the usual strip with her companion at night and going out on the long grass during the day. This does seem to be helping *touch wood*. She started having an extra feed too (also veteran vitality) in the evening but she won't eat it after she comes off the grass, so she is back to just the one in the morning. In the evening I think she will eat it better.

OP I wonder if it is some sort of stiffness with her jaw, as another poster suggested. Perhaps a Bute trial would be a good idea?

 

[**puddleduck**]

My chiro vet always gives the head, poll and jaw area a very careful check over when she treats a horse. She picked up problems in my 8yo’s hyoid and TMJ area that concerned her last time, but thankfully it responded well to her treatment, so the possible referral to regular vet for further investigations was stood down. That could cause difficulty eating.

So maybe get a good chiro or similar, pref a vet qualified one, to give her the once over?

I’ve never had her seen by a chiro/physio so maybe that’s something I could look into 👍 she had a rough start in life and has to be sedated for most things so not sure how well

She may have exposed pulp in her molars. My old boy had that in one tooth - it was found by a vet student!! Despite having the extra qualifications, the vet herself didn't spot it - it had to be felt, rather than seen.

I would hope that of the several vets who’ve seen her that one would have found it if this was the case 😬

 

[**puddleduck**]

I’ve just been down to take her fly rug off as not needed here today and whilst I was doing it she was eating and she’s still dropping considerable size mouthfuls of chewed up grass out, so the issue is definitely still there even though she’s out at grass 24/7 but currently if anything she’s back to being a little on the chunky side so it’s not impacting her too much at present.

I wasn’t going to try her on the bute until she comes in but as she’s still obviously got the issue I think I’ll try giving her some in a tiny bit of feed and see how she goes x